Have you participated in any BLM-related protests?

Halifax2TheMax

brianlux said:

You want violent protest?  Try these weapons:

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=645816515486865

In case you don't have FB, I'll transcribe as best I can through by wrecked hearing:

************************************************

Terry Tempest Williams:

"How do you turn anger into sacred rage.  For me, I saw a community of people who understood what that meant.  In 1988, the year my mother had passed [from breast cancer due to atomic test bomb radiation], I went down to the Nevada Test Sight after reading Henry David Thoreau's  Civil Disobedience, after reading Gandhi, Martin Luther King, and that mattered to me- to physically cross the line and say now and say yes.  And with a group of women from Utah, with a group of Chivuit people and Shoshone People, Jesuits, and members from [?] , a community of resistors.  We crossed that line at the Nevada Test Site.

I'll never forget- the officer cinched my wrists.  I was handcuffed.  She frisked my body, moved her hands down my legs, reached my ankle and felt a bulge, lifted up my pant leg, and inside my boot, and retrieved a pen and a pad of paper.  [Terry repeats that last few sentences].  She retrieved a pad and paper, looked at me and said, "And these?".  And I remember our eyes meeting and I said, "Weapons".  

Our eyes met again, she put them back in my boot, put my pant leg over them, and we continued. 

There are many different kinds of monkey wrenches.  A pencil, a pen, is one of those. 

I think about Camus, when he talks about how at some point we have to begin to understand that words are more powerful than munitions."

******************************************

"There are different types of Money Wrenches." 

Don't listen to me and decide. 

Don't only read dignin's posted article and decide. 

Read widely.  Observe carefully.  Think critically.  Choose wisely. 

The pen is mightier than the sword, Mr. Lux. But I’ve become skeptical due to the lack of reading comprehension and critical reading skills available today in the USA USA USA. It’s one thing to read Thoreau, it’s another to understand it in its time and put it in context for today. 

brianlux

Halifax2TheMax said:

brianlux said:

You want violent protest?  Try these weapons:

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=645816515486865

In case you don't have FB, I'll transcribe as best I can through by wrecked hearing:

************************************************

Terry Tempest Williams:

"How do you turn anger into sacred rage.  For me, I saw a community of people who understood what that meant.  In 1988, the year my mother had passed [from breast cancer due to atomic test bomb radiation], I went down to the Nevada Test Sight after reading Henry David Thoreau's  Civil Disobedience, after reading Gandhi, Martin Luther King, and that mattered to me- to physically cross the line and say now and say yes.  And with a group of women from Utah, with a group of Chivuit people and Shoshone People, Jesuits, and members from [?] , a community of resistors.  We crossed that line at the Nevada Test Site.

I'll never forget- the officer cinched my wrists.  I was handcuffed.  She frisked my body, moved her hands down my legs, reached my ankle and felt a bulge, lifted up my pant leg, and inside my boot, and retrieved a pen and a pad of paper.  [Terry repeats that last few sentences].  She retrieved a pad and paper, looked at me and said, "And these?".  And I remember our eyes meeting and I said, "Weapons".  

Our eyes met again, she put them back in my boot, put my pant leg over them, and we continued. 

There are many different kinds of monkey wrenches.  A pencil, a pen, is one of those. 

I think about Camus, when he talks about how at some point we have to begin to understand that words are more powerful than munitions."

******************************************

"There are different types of Money Wrenches." 

Don't listen to me and decide. 

Don't only read dignin's posted article and decide. 

Read widely.  Observe carefully.  Think critically.  Choose wisely. 

The pen is mightier than the sword, Mr. Lux. But I’ve become skeptical due to the lack of reading comprehension and critical reading skills available today in the USA USA USA. It’s one thing to read Thoreau, it’s another to understand it in its time and put it in context for today. 

Lack of reading skills in America?  Oh my god, my friend- don't get me started!

I won't discount acts of vandalism as a possible route to achieving the goal, but I stop at harming other people.

A good example is set by Sea Shepherd Conservation Society, and organization that has at times been mis-labled as "terrorist"  (they are not).  There motto:  "Do no harm to others."

I personally stand firm by that. 

Other must choose their own road, but it concerns me that those roads are often chosen with little forethought. 

I'm not convinced that the violent path is the most sought out.  It's easy to type about it, but look at the poll results thus far.  Most people here have not participated in that kind of thing or seen the horror.  I have seen it.  It sticks in your brain and soul.  No thanks.

Meltdown99

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Meltdown99

Wtf

brianlux

Yeow... I'm all helping kids learn to be accepting and non-prejudicial- you bet!- but not to use them as protesters.  That is totally dishonest and disingenuous.   

mace1229

Looks like a private school. Also don’t think you can record and post kids at school without parent permission. So I’m wondering if all parents were informed and okay with this, or they just didn’t care about child laws?

Gern Blansten

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

kids chanting "black lives matter"....how awful

Spiritual_Chaos

Kids showing support for human lives. 

My god. 

oftenreading

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Who says they were forced? I'll take that with a huge grain of salt. Someone posting this has an agenda.

Would the poster be as outraged if the kids were holding pro-environment signs and chanting "Save the trees"? 

tempo_n_groove

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Who says they were forced? I'll take that with a huge grain of salt. Someone posting this has an agenda.

Would the poster be as outraged if the kids were holding pro-environment signs and chanting "Save the trees"? 

You think a 5yo has the brain capacity to understand what they are really doing?

oftenreading

tempo_n_groove said:

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Who says they were forced? I'll take that with a huge grain of salt. Someone posting this has an agenda.

Would the poster be as outraged if the kids were holding pro-environment signs and chanting "Save the trees"? 

You think a 5yo has the brain capacity to understand what they are really doing?

We involve children in activities that they don’t fully understand all the time; that’s how kids learn. Children are always soaking up the messages and values of the adults around them. None of us knows what the facts are of this event but I do know that our local primary schools regularly involve kids in community events for various causes. Would you argue that kids shouldn’t raise money for cancer research because they don’t fully understand oncology? That they shouldn’t be allowed into climate change marches because they don’t fully understand climate science? And if not, why would marching for human rights be any different? 

mace1229

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Kids showing support for human lives. 

My god. 

BLM is a lot more than just support for human lives. They are a political organization. Our local chapter was pretty vocal about legalizing prostitution and organized multiple anti-police protests. So it’s a lot more than just black lives .

oftenreading

mace1229 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Kids showing support for human lives. 

My god. 

BLM is a lot more than just support for human lives. They are a political organization. Our local chapter was pretty vocal about legalizing prostitution and organized multiple anti-police protests. So it’s a lot more than just black lives .

It's all part of the same larger issue regarding BIPOC lives in our society

brianlux

Bye

dankind

brianlux said:

Again, I'm all for helping kids learn the importance of getting along with others, and not being racists.  I learned that as a kid by being with kids of other colors, nationalities, religions, etc., not by being paraded around by adults naively thinking little kids have the cognitive ability to understand what a march is really about.  Give kids a chance to interact together and let kids be kids and the problems will settle themselves.  Worked fine for us.

tempo_n_groove

oftenreading said:

tempo_n_groove said:

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Who says they were forced? I'll take that with a huge grain of salt. Someone posting this has an agenda.

Would the poster be as outraged if the kids were holding pro-environment signs and chanting "Save the trees"? 

You think a 5yo has the brain capacity to understand what they are really doing?

We involve children in activities that they don’t fully understand all the time; that’s how kids learn. Children are always soaking up the messages and values of the adults around them. None of us knows what the facts are of this event but I do know that our local primary schools regularly involve kids in community events for various causes. Would you argue that kids shouldn’t raise money for cancer research because they don’t fully understand oncology? That they shouldn’t be allowed into climate change marches because they don’t fully understand climate science? And if not, why would marching for human rights be any different? 

Are you indoctrinating or teaching?  That is where I would draw the line.

Spiritual_Chaos

tempo_n_groove said:

oftenreading said:

tempo_n_groove said:

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/status/1489709114489925632?s=21

Who says they were forced? I'll take that with a huge grain of salt. Someone posting this has an agenda.

Would the poster be as outraged if the kids were holding pro-environment signs and chanting "Save the trees"? 

You think a 5yo has the brain capacity to understand what they are really doing?

We involve children in activities that they don’t fully understand all the time; that’s how kids learn. Children are always soaking up the messages and values of the adults around them. None of us knows what the facts are of this event but I do know that our local primary schools regularly involve kids in community events for various causes. Would you argue that kids shouldn’t raise money for cancer research because they don’t fully understand oncology? That they shouldn’t be allowed into climate change marches because they don’t fully understand climate science? And if not, why would marching for human rights be any different? 

Are you indoctrinating or teaching?  That is where I would draw the line.

Focus on all the religious and nationalistic indoctrinating over some kids walking around playing demonstration. 

brianlux

fuck it

dankind

brianlux said:

dankind said:

brianlux said:

Again, I'm all for helping kids learn the importance of getting along with others, and not being racists.  I learned that as a kid by being with kids of other colors, nationalities, religions, etc., not by being paraded around by adults naively thinking little kids have the cognitive ability to understand what a march is really about.  Give kids a chance to interact together and let kids be kids and the problems will settle themselves.  Worked fine for us.

It did.  But if you don't believe me, that fine.  No need to tire yourself out with that weariness.  I know what did and don't work for me and others I grew up with.

Hey, it's great that you know that it worked for you and some friends that you grew up with, but I would argue that it did not make a dent in US society.

I've raised two five-year-olds (now nine and eleven), and they were/still are more than capable of learning about the systemic issues that they were/are facing because generations like yours and mine think that things "worked fine for us."

brianlux

dankind said:

brianlux said:

dankind said:

brianlux said:

Again, I'm all for helping kids learn the importance of getting along with others, and not being racists.  I learned that as a kid by being with kids of other colors, nationalities, religions, etc., not by being paraded around by adults naively thinking little kids have the cognitive ability to understand what a march is really about.  Give kids a chance to interact together and let kids be kids and the problems will settle themselves.  Worked fine for us.

It did.  But if you don't believe me, that fine.  No need to tire yourself out with that weariness.  I know what did and don't work for me and others I grew up with.

Hey, it's great that you know that it worked for you and some friends that you grew up with, but I would argue that it did not make a dent in US society.

I've raised two five-year-olds (now nine and eleven), and they were/still are more than capable of learning about the systemic issues that they were/are facing because generations like yours and mine think that things "worked fine for us."

Dankind, I don't respond well to weary faces or being told to go pound sand, so I appreciate your good and clear explanation and I'm glad you are doing your best to raise your kids in ways that might make a difference.  I hope they do. 

As far as things working out fine, I only mean that in terms of my own perspective.  But in terms of how my generation or yours as made a difference, what I think about that right now is too depressing, negative, hope destroying, and nonconstructive.  No one needs that. 

Keep up the good work with those kids.