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How Ticketmaster's sworn enemy, Pearl Jam, became it's new best friend

demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 87,746
edited February 2020 in The Porch

1/31/2020 by Brandon Ross

Danny Clinch
Pearl Jam

For those of us old enough to be music fans and attending concerts in the mid-1990s, Pearl Jam and Ticketmaster will forever be inextricably linked. Pearl Jam became synonymous with anti-Ticketmaster venom from both artists and consumers during that period, who saw the ticketing company as a monopoly (even in the pre-Live Nation merger days) that charged egregious fees to the detriment of both parties. Beyond creating its own fan ticketing, inspired by the Grateful Dead, the band tried to tour without playing any Ticketmaster venues and they were the “star” witness in the DOJ investigation over those same two years.

With that long-ago period forever ingrained, it was hard not to take notice of the extent of cooperation between Ticketmaster and Pearl Jam, as tickets went on sale last week for Pearl Jam’s upcoming U.S. Spring tour. For this tour, Pearl Jam not only chose to exclusively play Ticketmaster ticketed venues, the band ceded control of its Ten Club ticketing to Ticketmaster.

On the surface, these moves are fraught with irony. However, they also represent a subtle but important shift by Live Nation/Ticketmaster over the past few years towards giving greater control of ticketing to the artist -- something Pearl Jam seemed to crave in its early years, as much as the debate was simply about ticket prices. Ticketmaster has improved its technology stack over the past several years, and in turn has been able to give artists more options for how they ticket and price their shows and the tools to make educated decisions. With Ticketmaster building further capabilities, especially around digital ticketing, we expect it to offer artists not only even more control, but rich data sets on their fans, helping artists to develop stronger relationships with those fans and marketing capabilities. The near-term result should be even more dominant global market share among concert ticketing for TM, and in the U.S. for the venues that are exclusive TM customers. In the longer term though, we wonder if it could further TM’s negotiating leverage with venues and even lead to a major change in the domestic ticketing model away from the venue exclusivity model TM created.


Extending the Ethos of the Live Nation Flywheel to Ticketmaster

The genius of Live Nation CEO, Michael Rapino, has always been that he has understood that the concert business began and ended with the artist. It was his job to convince artists not only to tour, but to do so with Live Nation. The often-cited Live Nation “flywheel” starts with catering to artists and in many cases paying talent more than competitors -- which it has been able to do because of the scale of its vertical integration; Live Nation’s promotion business on its own is not a profit center.

Since the 2010 merger, the ticketing business (largely Ticketmaster) has served as one of the key monetization engines in the flywheel. Its success in maintaining and extending market share was helped along by LYV’s promotion business. In the U.S., where venues sign exclusive deals with ticket providers, venues were aware that Live Nation could do what made the most sense economically in routing its tours (to the extent that artists complied), and as LYV built scale in new areas of the concert business, it unlocked further value through adding ticketing. For instance, as it acquired and built festivals, owned and operated ticketing was added.

There was historically nothing specific about Ticketmaster’s business that extended Live Nation’s goal of catering to the artist besides creating the ability to pay artists more because in the U.S. they owned the company ticketing many venues the artist played and internationally the promoter decides on ticketing allocation. 

Meanwhile, technology mostly served to create headaches for artists, consumers and the company. For consumers, concert ticketing has been centered around the “onsale” and speed to buying tickets. As ticket sales moved online, ticket brokers have found ways to acquire mass quantities of underpriced tickets using software or “bots” and mark them up significantly on the secondary market. Ticketmaster attempts to thwart bots and legislation have generally been unsuccessful at stopping these bad actors. Really the only actions that have been effective to combat these issues, especially raising ticket prices, have given artists trepidation over their image.

However, over the last few years, technology has begun to offer alternatives. Ticketmaster is not the easiest battleship to steer, as it has been built and rebuilt upon legacy technology over a 40+ year period. But the company has begun to develop several tools to give artists the flexibility to ticket more on their own terms and to avoid the pitfalls of the online ticketing onsale if they want. Investors have heard about initiatives including Verified Fan, Platinum Seats, and more recently digital tickets (Safetix).

We are finally getting to the point where Live Nation can extend its artist-first ethos to ticketing -- offering artists the ability to successfully create and execute on their own objectives. Ticketing can become more than just a dumb revenue center for LYV. And, LYV can add value to more than just its venue clients.




Post edited by demetrios on

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    demetriosdemetrios Canada Posts: 87,746

    How Ticketmaster Solved Pearl Jam’s Objectives for its Upcoming Tour

    Live Nation tickets shows for a continuum of artists across different level of success ranging from a new artist playing a small club to the likes of Pearl Jam in stadiums. Different artists have different objectives. For some, it is simply about maximizing revenue. For these artists, Ticketmaster has worked to improve yield management through the likes of Platinum Seats, which are dynamically priced inventory based on demand. Some artists are interested in ensuring a sellout and want brokers to be involved to take inventory away. They may opt for a more traditional onsale. Other artists are more interested in keeping prices low and ensuring that its best fans get the best seats -- for image or altruism.

    Pearl Jam falls into the latter bucket. They have always believed in the democratization of the ticket. They significantly underprice tickets and aim to get them into the hands of their fans at all costs. To that end, the band started utilizing Ticketmaster’s Verified Fan for its 2018 tour. Verified Fan is a presale whereby prospective ticket buyers must register their accounts with TM to participate. TM marries the account information with first and third party data to determine the likelihood that the ticket buyer will attend the show. It then “verifies” a number of prospective buyers and passes back a unique presale code to the buyer. TM has been able to customize Verified Fan for different artists, depending on the weight they want to assign to different data sets -- such as listening and purchasing behavior.


    The band used Verified Fan for a portion of seats this tour. However, the majority of tickets (perhaps up to 2/3 -- an astounding figure as fan clubs typically receive 8% of tickets) were sold in a presale to members of its Ten Club. Since 1992, Ten Club presales have historically been handled in house and by hand. On this tour, Pearl Jam ceded control to TM, which built a custom ticketing algorithm to ticket with the same rules that the Ten Club has had since 1992 -- with a lottery for all interested members to get tickets and ticket locations assigned by seniority in the club. 

    Finally, Pearl Jam sought to make tickets non-transferrable to ensure brokers never got their hands on tickets to resell. Non-transferrable tickets are controversial, especially as buyers who cannot attend a show lose out. To capture the best of all possible worlds, Ticketmaster built Pearl Jam a custom secondary ticket exchange whereby tickets could only be sold at face value.

    The Role of Digital Ticketing

    Underpinning the secondary exchange was Ticketmaster’s use of Safetix this tour -- its digital ticketing product. The use of the term “digital ticket” often confuses clients who assume all “mobile tickets” are digital. However, what makes digital tickets different is that they are tokenized and tied directly to an owner’s identity.

    As one output, a standard mobile ticket will have one bar code. The ticket is easily transferrable between attendees simply by sharing the barcode through a screenshot or otherwise. In the case of Safetix, the bar code is dynamic, with a new one generated at regular intervals. This makes the ticket impossible to counterfeit, and tightens artist/promoter/ticketer/team/venue control over how, when and at what price a ticket can be transferred. This was the primary use case for Pearl Jam -- allowing the band to control resale.


    But the digital ticket opens many more opportunities for participants in the event ecosystem. The digital ticket is assigned to a unique owner, and as a ticket is passed on to subsequent owners, an ownership ledger is created. So, the exact identity of every holder of every ticket, and most importantly of every attendee, is known.

    The implications are numerous. The phrase “data is the new oil” is tired. But the holy grail of commerce in 2020 is knowing and understanding your customer and having the ability to communicate directly with her. Digital ticketing will create a powerful data set for Ticketmaster, which it theoretically can share with artists to that end. Pearl Jam has a fan club with several hundred thousand members. And there are a handful of bands like Phish or the Grateful Dead that have built a direct to consumer relationship over many years through fan clubs and self-ticketing. But most artists know very little about their fans. Digital ticketing offers the possibility to help change this. 

    Real identity will also improve venue security, help promoters to market and open new sponsorship opportunities for Live Nation -- marrying the online and offline worlds. But those are stories for another day.

    A Slow Move Away from the North American Exclusivity Model?

    The idea of the artist taking more control of the ticket is a fascinating one, because nowhere in the world is the artist the true end customer for the ticketing company right now. In international markets, concert ticketing allocation is determined by promoters, who do work closely with the artists. However, in the North America, most venues have an exclusive relationship with a ticket provider. Every event (save some loopholes) is ticketed by that ticketing company. If an artist wants to play a particular venue, she must use the exclusive ticketing provider.

    The exclusive ticketing model has been a boon to Ticketmaster. In fact, Ticketmaster is responsible for the existence of the model. In the early 1980s, former Ticketmaster CEO, Fred Rosen, came up with the idea of creating exclusive ticketing relationships with venues in exchange for a ~50/50 split of the service fee. This swift execution of this business model change was almost completely responsible for Ticketmaster building its ticketing dominance, and it has continued to work in Ticketmaster’s favor post the Live Nation deal, even as new competitors have emerged.


    In the near-term, we believe as Ticketmaster better serves artists, benefits will accrue both to LYV and its venue partners -- strengthening LYV’s hold on venues. If artists prefer Ticketmaster, surely they will have a hand in routing tours to Ticketmaster venues, as did Pearl Jam, further growing those venues’ market share.

    However, if Ticketmaster is able to gain more and more concert market share through the combination of its vertical integration and artist demand, we wonder if LYV might want to do the unthinkable and work towards undoing the business model that has been its golden goose.

    Under the venue exclusivity model, concerts are very profitable for Ticketmaster. However, in deals with arenas and stadiums, Ticketmaster is responsible for ticketing all of the sporting events as well -- accounting for most of the tickets sold in these venues. Yet what nobody likes to talk openly about is that sports ticketing is not very profitable for Ticketmaster. Exclusivity agreements usually include ticketing seasons tickets, which account for well over half of tickets sold for the four major sports, with no service charge. Obviously not all from sports, but LYV’s Ticketing division sold 265mm non-fee bearing tickets in 2018 versus 217mm with fees. Perhaps a domestic business where LYV ticketed all of the concerts it promotes, regardless of venue would be a better one than the model which made Ticketmaster what it is today. Then the Live Nation flywheel would truly be complete with the artist at the center. 

    A Word On Unhappy Pearl Jam Fans

    Given our personal fandom and the fact that we follow Live Nation stock closely, we are frequently subject to unhappy calls and texts from friends and clients when they fail to get tickets to a show. The amount of texts we received last week during the Pearl Jam onsale was unprecedented, with, to no surprise, most blaming Ticketmaster and/or Pearl Jam when they came away empty handed.

    Our favorite text read:

    I have been a paying member of the Ten Club since 1993 and got shut out of MSG and Baltimore. And didn’t even get a Verified Fan Code for MSG. Where I live!
    F*cked​
    I can’t believe I didn’t get my first or second choice through Ten Club.
    27 years paying them!
    Shut out.
    27 years!!!

    Sure Verified Fan could improve and it will with time, as all software does with iteration. But the fact of the matter is Pearl Jam did everything they could to make it easier for its biggest fans to get access to tickets. We believe they sold close to two thirds of tickets in their fan club presale. And the rules of the presale were exactly the same as they always were. The problem was that especially MSG was a major undersell for the band. We estimate that Ten Club requests were many many times that inventory available. And, this inventory dwarfed Verified Fan inventory, leading very few fans to be “verified.”

    We have all complained that we wished for ticketing to become more fair. Maybe we should be careful what we wish for.

    Brandon Ross is a partner at LightShed Partners, a technology, media and telecommunications research firm based in New York City. LightShed provides its institutional investor subscribers differentiated insights and offers unique corporate access and events to its clients. This article was originally published on by LightShed Partners.


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    KN219077KN219077 Montana Posts: 897
    edited February 2020
    It seems that the real problem here is the band plays too few or shows in certain regions and the demand is way higher than the supply. A 2/3 fan club ticket ratio is amazing and will no doubt lead to better crowds. It’s a step in the right direction, hopefully there are enough future ours left in the band to iron things  out
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    teskeincteskeinc Posts: 836
    Play more shows
    Raise the prices
    Limit each member to 2-3 shows per leg
    are all ways to reduce demand.
    1994 : Memphis 1995 : New Orleans 1996 : Seattle
    1998 : St Louis, Birmingham, Knoxville
    2000 : Memphis, Nashville, St Louis
    2003 : Irvine 1+2, Vegas, Bridge School 1+2, Santa Barbara
    2005 : Missoula, Vancouver, Gorge 2006 : LA 1+2, Vegas
    2008 : W Palm Beach, Tampa, Who Rock Honors, EV LA 2
    2009 : LA 1, LA 4, EV 1 Nashville 2011 : EV Long Beach
    2012: EV Vegas 1+2
    2013 LA 1+2 2018 Prague, Wrigley 2
    2020 Phoenix, SD
     
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    LostpawnLostpawn Posts: 414
    This was a poorly written and clearly never edited article. Nevertheless, the information therein is interesting, as are the conclusions.  Thanks for sharing. 
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    badu2fanbadu2fan Posts: 87
    edited February 2020
    I remember getting my tickets for Charleston 96 "No Ticketmaster Tour." My PJ first show. I was 3 rows off floor one section back from stage on the side. The pit was full of body slammers and I enjoyed watching folks make it to the front rail and get pulled over to then be sent back to the pit!!! I still have my ticket!!!! One comment Eddie made was "this is our next to last show and I want you to know we play harder tonight then we will for our last show!!!"
    The new TM Pearl Jam friendship is hard to fathom and for the spring tour set up to create the buzz for the Red State Election Fall tour!!
    I prefer arena to stadiums any day as I am reaching retirement age. Hopefully there will be enough shows in the fall to make this new system work for everyone. I assume they did the small spring tour to make sure the system worked and was fair to all.
    Do folks feel the local fan base should have first shot at tickets and use Zip codes to eliminate travelers?
    An old story on hardest ticket I bought: heading to the capitol Centre in late 70's to get Led Zepplin tickets. We drove 2 hours and arrived at 2am We stood outside until they sold tickets at 10am. The crush into the ticket lobby was intense and after you got your tickets the crowd had to lift you up and hand walk you to the exit!!!
    oh and tickets were $20. I have quite a few more adventures standing in the elements to get tix and not sure the computer generation is willing to go back in time and deal with those experiences.


    Post edited by badu2fan on
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    PB11041PB11041 Earth Posts: 2,765
    Lostpawn said:
    This was a poorly written and clearly never edited article. Nevertheless, the information therein is interesting, as are the conclusions.  Thanks for sharing. 
    My favorite part was the random insertion of LYV as if it was explained. 

     
    His eminence has yet to show. 
    http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
    http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652

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    PB11041PB11041 Earth Posts: 2,765
    teskeinc said:
    Play more shows
    Raise the prices
    Limit each member to 2-3 shows per leg
    are all ways to reduce demand.
    well, the first is the best thing to do but not something this band has been willing to do since 2006, which is unfortunate.  Lightning Bolt fall 2013 was the closest thing to a real tour these guys have done in the last 15 years.  
    His eminence has yet to show. 
    http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
    http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652

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    MickeyMouseMickeyMouse Posts: 1,053
    demetrios said:

    A Word On Unhappy Pearl Jam Fans

    Given our personal fandom and the fact that we follow Live Nation stock closely, we are frequently subject to unhappy calls and texts from friends and clients when they fail to get tickets to a show. The amount of texts we received last week during the Pearl Jam onsale was unprecedented, with, to no surprise, most blaming Ticketmaster and/or Pearl Jam when they came away empty handed.

    Our favorite text read:

    I have been a paying member of the Ten Club since 1993 and got shut out of MSG and Baltimore. And didn’t even get a Verified Fan Code for MSG. Where I live!
    F*cked​
    I can’t believe I didn’t get my first or second choice through Ten Club.
    27 years paying them!
    Shut out.
    27 years!!!

    Sure Verified Fan could improve and it will with time, as all software does with iteration. But the fact of the matter is Pearl Jam did everything they could to make it easier for its biggest fans to get access to tickets. We believe they sold close to two thirds of tickets in their fan club presale. And the rules of the presale were exactly the same as they always were. The problem was that especially MSG was a major undersell for the band. We estimate that Ten Club requests were many many times that inventory available. And, this inventory dwarfed Verified Fan inventory, leading very few fans to be “verified.”

    We have all complained that we wished for ticketing to become more fair. Maybe we should be careful what we wish for.


    I want a mod to pin this to the top of the board. #Gutted.
    Uniondale, NY 04/30/03 - Camden, NJ 07/05/03 - MSG 07/08/03 - Reading, PA 10/01/04 - Philly 10/03/05 - Ed Sullivan Theatre 05/04/06 - MSG 06/25/08 - MSG 05/21/10 - NYC (EV solo) 06/21/11 - Montreal 09/07/11 - Brooklyn 10/18/13 - Central Park 09/26/15 - Philly 04/29/16 - MSG 05/01/16 - MSG 05/02/16 - Fenway 08/05/16 - Fenway 09/02/18 - Fenway 09/04/18 
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    LostpawnLostpawn Posts: 414
    PB11041 said:
    Lostpawn said:
    This was a poorly written and clearly never edited article. Nevertheless, the information therein is interesting, as are the conclusions.  Thanks for sharing. 
    My favorite part was the random insertion of LYV as if it was explained. 

     
    That’s a great example. I also like how they discuss vertical integration, and the LiveNation flywheel. I would completely understand if someone who doesn’t have a decent grasp on how artists, promoters, venues, ticketing agencies, and labels all play a role in making a tour happen, would walk away from this article scratching their heads. 

    That, and his frustrating decisions in his use of commas (or lack thereof), make this a painful read. 

    All of that said, I hope the fans on this board get the primary point - PJ worked hard to ensure that of all tickets sold, the vast majority went to fans, at a remarkably low face value.  That is a huge accomplishment in this age of professional resellers, bots, and sophisticated legal secondary markets. 
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    pjl44pjl44 Posts: 8,058
    Man, that was a fascinating read. I'm not an editor so I care more about the content than the prose. Lots of nuggets in there, but I found this one particularly interesting:


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    HH140540HH140540 Atlanta Posts: 499
    edited February 2020
    KN219077 said:
    It seems that the real problem here is the band plays too few or shows in certain regions and the demand is way higher than the supply. A 2/3 fan club ticket ratio is amazing and will no doubt lead to better crowds. It’s a step in the right direction, hopefully there are enough future ours left in the band to iron things  out
    This is the issue with this method. Other than demand way exceeding supply I think it worked well and achieved what the band was going for. If they played 2x - 3x shows it works perfectly. It would’ve been nice for them to announce the 2nd leg at the same time. That would have given people other options and maybe curtailed demand a bit for the 1st leg. I was only able to get tickets to LA and realized it wouldn’t be that much more expensive to fly to Amsterdam and see them three nights in the summer versus flying across the country for the LA shows. It seems like tickets in Europe are definitely easier to come by.
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    Lostpawn said:
    This was a poorly written and clearly never edited article. Nevertheless, the information therein is interesting, as are the conclusions.  Thanks for sharing. 

    Dallas 2013 
    Wrigley 2016 Night 1
    Wrigley 2016 Night 2
    MSG 2020
    OKC 2020

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    erocshiftyerocshifty Posts: 1,170
    KN219077 said:
    It seems that the real problem here is the band plays too few or shows in certain regions and the demand is way higher than the supply. A 2/3 fan club ticket ratio is amazing and will no doubt lead to better crowds. It’s a step in the right direction, hopefully there are enough future ours left in the band to iron things  out
    Image result for hector salamanca gif
    "It's best to live in grace before you're forced to." EV- 10/09/2014 
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    Red MosqitoRed Mosqito Posts: 1,229
    Thanks for sharing the article. Very insightful read! 
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    JR8321JR8321 Posts: 48
    Some great insights here. I think the particular agreement with PJ is unique and they were able to leverage multiple things.
    1)  they still have a very good draw, even outside 10C.
    2)  Their fan base, while mostly 35+, is still passionate and has more $ than in 1995. Even willing to go to multiple shows on a tour despite kids/jobs etc.    
    3)  Obviously,  history becomes a risk for PJ to "deal with the devil" so they had to be sure that TM did so much tailored to the fans.  I wonder if they asked for more and were told "no, this is the best we can do" by TM. But overall I think they have done more than I could have imagined. 
    Couple things have been already stated that I want to second.  One, I personally have assumed that there will be a fall or winter leg.  That was based on the fact that Chicago, Philly, and Seattle were not on this leg. They'd already booked the Euro dates for summer so we can't really blame them for not booking more dates on this leg.  If indeed there is a fall/winter US leg, then it would have been helpful if they announced that, even if they couldn't name cities or dates. There was pent up demand and with no guarantee of more US shows, I'm not surprised there was a mad run on tickets. I wonder if TM made them hold back on an announcement. That would be a little shitty.

    Two, as a long standing fan in 10C (134xxx), I understand the frustration of getting shut out of tickets (SO FAR) expressed by the fan in the article. I was fortunate to get picked for the one show I am able to make on this leg, but  I was shut out on the LB tour (lucked into a ticket) and had some of the same emotions.   
    It is my sincere hope that this fan and many 10C'ers like him are able to buy tickets at Face Value in the Fan to Fan sale.  I think that is a huge win for PJ to secure, esp without penalizing the seller. Obviously there are interlopers that purchased tickets b/c we've all seen the StubHub listings among 10C seats. Hopefully a decent number of those violators will be caught and punished. 

    But there are two main ways you can handle the benefits of Seniority: 
    1) Seniority determines who gets tickets
    2) Seniority determines who gets BEST seats.

    Personally, I don't think it's fair to do both. And it would discourage people from joining. To ME, I want to be close. And with this new arrangement, 1/2-2/3 of a venue set aside for 10C/verified fan seats will usually mean very good probability of getting seats.  (That is of course, assuming the computer systems are working and I know there were some issues. But don't blame the underlying plan on that. The computer issues should improve in subsequent legs).  So I am glad that the higher priority for 10C Seniority seems to be option 2. But I understand that others may feel it's just important to be in the building and they would rather have a guarantee (or near guarantee) that they go to the show, even some brand new 10C member gets to stand in the pit while they are somewhere in the lower or mid bowl of seats. 
    I *think* most longstanding 10C members would take my preference, but I could be wrong. 

    Anyway, I won't be using the Fan 2 Fan sale but I am very curious to see how well it works. I'm really rooting for it and for all those shut out in earlier steps of the process to get tickets. That's all.

    Peace.






     






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    wndowpaynewndowpayne Posts: 1,469
    I miss the days of having to go to the venue box office to buy tickets..
    Charlottesville 2013
    Hampton 2016

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    ZodZod Posts: 10,116
    I miss the days of having to go to the venue box office to buy tickets..
    I don't.  It got pretty annoying lining up, only to find out a big chunk of the lineup were people paid by scalpers, then they'd pull that random number thing, and reorder the line... grrrr.. always ended up at the back.  My two favourite era's of TM:

    1)  The late 90s a coworker told me the secret was calling a ticketmaster somewhere else for Vancouver tickets.    You'll never get through the Vancouver line, but call one somewhere small, without an event going on sale, and buy them that way.   I found Brandon, Manitoba's TM worked great for this.  Tickets go on sale at 9:00am PST.   Call Brandon, MB at 8:58, get right through, ask some stupid questions, and right at 9:00 ask for tickets to the Vancouver gig.  We got amazing seats this way.  Quite often in the front rows of the floor.

    2)  The early days of online ticket sales.   Before corporations and the rest of the public figured out the internet.   When the technically illirate masses were still waiting in line, when you could refresh, refresh, boom, tickets!   Those first few years of online ticketing were amazing (before all the BS started to roll in).

    To me waiting in an actual line is the 2nd worse way I've ever bought them, aside from modern online ticket sales.    Those two methods above were amazing and by far the best :)
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    wndowpaynewndowpayne Posts: 1,469
    Zod said:
    I miss the days of having to go to the venue box office to buy tickets..
    I don't.  It got pretty annoying lining up, only to find out a big chunk of the lineup were people paid by scalpers, then they'd pull that random number thing, and reorder the line... grrrr.. always ended up at the back.  My two favourite era's of TM:

    1)  The late 90s a coworker told me the secret was calling a ticketmaster somewhere else for Vancouver tickets.    You'll never get through the Vancouver line, but call one somewhere small, without an event going on sale, and buy them that way.   I found Brandon, Manitoba's TM worked great for this.  Tickets go on sale at 9:00am PST.   Call Brandon, MB at 8:58, get right through, ask some stupid questions, and right at 9:00 ask for tickets to the Vancouver gig.  We got amazing seats this way.  Quite often in the front rows of the floor.

    2)  The early days of online ticket sales.   Before corporations and the rest of the public figured out the internet.   When the technically illirate masses were still waiting in line, when you could refresh, refresh, boom, tickets!   Those first few years of online ticketing were amazing (before all the BS started to roll in).

    To me waiting in an actual line is the 2nd worse way I've ever bought them, aside from modern online ticket sales.    Those two methods above were amazing and by far the best :)

    I live in a town that has a 10,000 seat civic center.You rarely had a line that took more than 10 minutes..You could go at noon and get good seats.  70s-80s were great,  I never got shut out for a show I wanted to see.
    Charlottesville 2013
    Hampton 2016

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    Tim SimmonsTim Simmons Posts: 6,911
    teskeinc said:
    Play more shows
    Raise the prices
    Limit each member to 2-3 shows per leg
    are all ways to reduce demand.
    Play larger venues. 


    Sorry stadium haters, this is really the only option given the fact they don't want to do large tours while trying to make fans happy.
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    Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 6,114
    demetrios said:

    A Word On Unhappy Pearl Jam Fans

    Given our personal fandom and the fact that we follow Live Nation stock closely, we are frequently subject to unhappy calls and texts from friends and clients when they fail to get tickets to a show. The amount of texts we received last week during the Pearl Jam onsale was unprecedented, with, to no surprise, most blaming Ticketmaster and/or Pearl Jam when they came away empty handed.

    Our favorite text read:

    I have been a paying member of the Ten Club since 1993 and got shut out of MSG and Baltimore. And didn’t even get a Verified Fan Code for MSG. Where I live!
    F*cked​
    I can’t believe I didn’t get my first or second choice through Ten Club.
    27 years paying them!
    Shut out.
    27 years!!!

    Sure Verified Fan could improve and it will with time, as all software does with iteration. But the fact of the matter is Pearl Jam did everything they could to make it easier for its biggest fans to get access to tickets. We believe they sold close to two thirds of tickets in their fan club presale. And the rules of the presale were exactly the same as they always were. The problem was that especially MSG was a major undersell for the band. We estimate that Ten Club requests were many many times that inventory available. And, this inventory dwarfed Verified Fan inventory, leading very few fans to be “verified.”

    We have all complained that we wished for ticketing to become more fair. Maybe we should be careful what we wish for.


    I want a mod to pin this to the top of the board. #Gutted.

    the die hards complain about the supply and demand comments and the decisions made to limit shows in the east but yet promote comments like the bolded words. The reality is they did the exact opposite. They made every decision that led to most East fans unable to see their first arena shows in four years and created a market where charity tickets can be had for $1756. And to be a big fan you have to join 10c? 

    How magnanimous
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    PB11041PB11041 Earth Posts: 2,765
    demetrios said:

    A Word On Unhappy Pearl Jam Fans

    Given our personal fandom and the fact that we follow Live Nation stock closely, we are frequently subject to unhappy calls and texts from friends and clients when they fail to get tickets to a show. The amount of texts we received last week during the Pearl Jam onsale was unprecedented, with, to no surprise, most blaming Ticketmaster and/or Pearl Jam when they came away empty handed.

    Our favorite text read:

    I have been a paying member of the Ten Club since 1993 and got shut out of MSG and Baltimore. And didn’t even get a Verified Fan Code for MSG. Where I live!
    F*cked​
    I can’t believe I didn’t get my first or second choice through Ten Club.
    27 years paying them!
    Shut out.
    27 years!!!

    Sure Verified Fan could improve and it will with time, as all software does with iteration. But the fact of the matter is Pearl Jam did everything they could to make it easier for its biggest fans to get access to tickets. We believe they sold close to two thirds of tickets in their fan club presale. And the rules of the presale were exactly the same as they always were. The problem was that especially MSG was a major undersell for the band. We estimate that Ten Club requests were many many times that inventory available. And, this inventory dwarfed Verified Fan inventory, leading very few fans to be “verified.”

    We have all complained that we wished for ticketing to become more fair. Maybe we should be careful what we wish for.


    I want a mod to pin this to the top of the board. #Gutted.

    the die hards complain about the supply and demand comments and the decisions made to limit shows in the east but yet promote comments like the bolded words. The reality is they did the exact opposite. They made every decision that led to most East fans unable to see their first arena shows in four years and created a market where charity tickets can be had for $1756. And to be a big fan you have to join 10c? 

    How magnanimous
    There is no proof to what you are saying in particular regard to the sentence "But the fact of the matter is Pearl Jam did everything they could to make it easier for its biggest fans to get access to tickets" 

    They did in fact do this, your personal gripe is you liked the safety net of getting to pay what you deemed a reasonable mark up to vermin who provide no value other than to manipulate the system. 

    In so far as the poor poor east coast.  Give me a fucking break.  Oh woe is Boston, New York and Philadelphia, land of the deprived Pearl Jam fan who gets so little.  Said no fan ever who lived outside of the states of Massachusetts, New York and Pennsylvania.

    This was their first run at this, there was bound to be issues particularly in regard to available venue and dates for how the band wanted to tour.  It is one part of one tour.



    His eminence has yet to show. 
    http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
    http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652

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    hrd2imgnhrd2imgn Southwest Burbs of Chicago Posts: 4,865
    You gotta do what you gotta do,  they did their part in the old days and nearly no one got on board  with them.   They tried, all we can ask for.
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    ZodZod Posts: 10,116
    Zod said:
    I miss the days of having to go to the venue box office to buy tickets..
    I don't.  It got pretty annoying lining up, only to find out a big chunk of the lineup were people paid by scalpers, then they'd pull that random number thing, and reorder the line... grrrr.. always ended up at the back.  My two favourite era's of TM:

    1)  The late 90s a coworker told me the secret was calling a ticketmaster somewhere else for Vancouver tickets.    You'll never get through the Vancouver line, but call one somewhere small, without an event going on sale, and buy them that way.   I found Brandon, Manitoba's TM worked great for this.  Tickets go on sale at 9:00am PST.   Call Brandon, MB at 8:58, get right through, ask some stupid questions, and right at 9:00 ask for tickets to the Vancouver gig.  We got amazing seats this way.  Quite often in the front rows of the floor.

    2)  The early days of online ticket sales.   Before corporations and the rest of the public figured out the internet.   When the technically illirate masses were still waiting in line, when you could refresh, refresh, boom, tickets!   Those first few years of online ticketing were amazing (before all the BS started to roll in).

    To me waiting in an actual line is the 2nd worse way I've ever bought them, aside from modern online ticket sales.    Those two methods above were amazing and by far the best :)

    I live in a town that has a 10,000 seat civic center.You rarely had a line that took more than 10 minutes..You could go at noon and get good seats.  70s-80s were great,  I never got shut out for a show I wanted to see.
    Most of my experience starts in the mid/late 90s.   I can only imagine it got easier the further back in time you went.
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    wndowpaynewndowpayne Posts: 1,469
    Most shows were general admission also..You could sit or try to get close on the floor..
    Charlottesville 2013
    Hampton 2016

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    demetrios said:
    Interesting that they are opposed to the general public knowing how many tickets go onsale for an event.
    I disagree with them that scalpers want to know more than fans.
    Dallas 2013 
    Wrigley 2016 Night 1
    Wrigley 2016 Night 2
    MSG 2020
    OKC 2020

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