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Federal Government Reinstates Death Penalty in Federal Prison System

BentleyspopBentleyspop Posts: 10,763
edited July 2019 in A Moving Train

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  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,025
    Sadly, no surprise there.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,355
    I do personally think there are people who's crimes they've committed make them unfit to live, but if our judicial system can not find a way to execute a criminal swiftly without the shadow of a doubt then it's pointless.
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    Good.  Why keep murdering scum alive.  The worlds overpopulated, why waste resources on losers.
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Posts: 12,845
    Meltdown99 said:
    Good.  Why keep murdering scum alive.  The worlds overpopulated, why waste resources on losers.
    There is a distressing tendency to execute the wrong person, unfortunately. 

    Among other arguments against the DP.  
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,583
    so this being the new policy, many of the arguments that have wound their way through state courts into the federal appellate system have raised the injection drugs as unconstitutional as well as the foriegn manufacturers of these drugs refusing to sell for this purpose.

    What is proposed then? A shielding of compound pharmacys personnel like in some states? Same with physicians who participate? Or some other method?
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  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,520
    edited July 2019
    More proof of the US being nothing less than a developing country without a democratic backbone.


    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • OnWis97OnWis97 Posts: 5,140
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
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  • oftenreadingoftenreading Posts: 12,845
    OnWis97 said:
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
    I agree with all of your points except the first two sentences. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,445
    oftenreading said:
    OnWis97 said:
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
    I agree with all of your points except the first two sentences. 
    I agree with all your points except your first sentence.

    j/k

    Im for a death penalty in extreme and rare cases. So I guess I’m moving to Brazil.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 Posts: 28,495
    cincybearcat said:
    oftenreading said:
    OnWis97 said:
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
    I agree with all of your points except the first two sentences. 
    I agree with all your points except your first sentence.

    j/k

    Im for a death penalty in extreme and rare cases. So I guess I’m moving to Brazil.
    Agreed.  Timothy McVeigh, Jeffrey dahamer, yeah bye bye. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • RenfieldRenfield Posts: 1,054
    Revenge is not the answer.
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain Posts: 31,265
    OnWis97 said:
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
    Some good points.

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  • Hi!Hi! Posts: 3,095
    edited July 2019
    I’m not in favor of the death penalty because they’re too many instances of people being wrongly accused and convicted.

    “It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer. “
    I believe this.

    Post edited by Hi! on

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  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,882
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
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  • eddieceddiec Posts: 3,881
    edited July 2019
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    Without trying to sound callous, was the family of the officer compensated by the state? 
    Edit: If the guard had been killed outside the prison, and the man was sentenced to life, then it's justice?
    Post edited by eddiec on
  • RenfieldRenfield Posts: 1,054
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,583
    Renfield said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • RenfieldRenfield Posts: 1,054
    mickeyrat said:
    Renfield said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
    Correct. And I just learned this - Oregon is the only state that permits convictions, for criminal felonies other than murder, on a 10-2 or 11-1 vote of the jury.
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,882
    Renfield said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Renfield said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
    Correct. And I just learned this - Oregon is the only state that permits convictions, for criminal felonies other than murder, on a 10-2 or 11-1 vote of the jury.
    Never knew that either. I like it. 

    I've always kinda wished there were professional jurors. People  that go through law school and trained to properly carry out a judge's instructions. I guess it goes against the "jury of your peers" notion, but as we all know, a lot of our peers are morons. 
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  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Posts: 36,976
    gee, how surprising that the racist fuck in office and his POS AG wants to kill more minorities. shocker. 

    maybe next he's going to attempt to retry the central park 5. 
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  • OnWis97OnWis97 Posts: 5,140
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful Convictions out there.
    Here’s the thing about that...

     I would have to think that any average defense attorney would turn “doesn’t meet the standard for the death penalty” into “reasonable doubt.” It seems like this idea would bring a lot of convicted felons through the appeals process.
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  • oftenreadingoftenreading Posts: 12,845
    edited July 2019
    cincybearcat said:
    oftenreading said:
    OnWis97 said:
    I have a long history of being pro death penalty. And there are plenty of people I don't think deserve to live.  Two things turned me: a) I don't believe for a second that you can possibly use the death penalty with any regularity and not kill an innocent person and b) the way it's applied vis a vis race and income.

    The more time goes on, the more I feel like it also helps feed a bloodthirst, of sorts...people that bask in the idea of inmates being beaten and raped is awesome and they lose their minds if they find out they were able to watch the Super Bowl.

    And now, at a time when authoritarianism is on the rise...not promising.
    I agree with all of your points except the first two sentences. 
    I agree with all your points except your first sentence.

    j/k

    Im for a death penalty in extreme and rare cases. So I guess I’m moving to Brazil.

    No need to be modest - you disagree with all of my sentences ;)

    Enjoy Carnival!
    Post edited by oftenreading on
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • RenfieldRenfield Posts: 1,054
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Renfield said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Renfield said:
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
    Correct. And I just learned this - Oregon is the only state that permits convictions, for criminal felonies other than murder, on a 10-2 or 11-1 vote of the jury.
    Never knew that either. I like it. 

    I've always kinda wished there were professional jurors. People  that go through law school and trained to properly carry out a judge's instructions. I guess it goes against the "jury of your peers" notion, but as we all know, a lot of our peers are morons. :smirk:
    The Oregon Legislature was working on a bill for the 2020 Ballot that would have asked voters to reconsider non-unanimous juries in a ballot measure, but legislation failed.
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Posts: 12,845
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Renfield said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Renfield said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
    Correct. And I just learned this - Oregon is the only state that permits convictions, for criminal felonies other than murder, on a 10-2 or 11-1 vote of the jury.
    Never knew that either. I like it. 

    I've always kinda wished there were professional jurors. People  that go through law school and trained to properly carry out a judge's instructions. I guess it goes against the "jury of your peers" notion, but as we all know, a lot of our peers are morons. 

    What additional benefit would professional, legally trained jurors add to the process that the judge doesn't already provide? 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • RenfieldRenfield Posts: 1,054
    edited July 2019
    12 Angry Men
    If you haven’t seen this film,  it’s a good time to do so (or re-watch), however you feel about capital  punishment. (I prefer the original film.) 
    Post edited by Renfield on
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,882
    edited July 2019
    oftenreading said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Renfield said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Renfield said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    I'm for the death penalty but prosecutors and judges can't be too cavalier about it. It should only be considered in murder cases of absolute certainty. I'm talking multiple eye-witnesses and video evidence. There's just too many wrongful convictions out there. 

    There was a case in Pennsylvania about two years ago where the defendant deserved the death penalty more than anyone I've ever seen, but didn't get it. He was already serving a life-sentence for 1st-degree murder, and while in prison, he managed to jump a corrections office and stabbed him over 200 times, obviously killing him. He was convicted, and the death penalty was on the table. But strangely, it was left to the jurors to decide his sentence instead of the judge. Is this common? I thought sentencing is almost always up to the judge. Anyway, all 12 jurors had to vote yes for the death penalty to occur, and of course, one person voted no. So this guy that was already serving a life-sentence for murder was given another life-sentence. That's not justice. 
    “For example, in capital punishment cases (death penalty cases) in some states, judges are not permitted to impose the death penalty and it's up to a jury to decide whether a convicted criminal should be sentenced to die.”

    “Like all criminal cases, the jury in a death penalty trial is chosen from a pool of potential jurors through a process called voir dire. ... However, because the jury determines the sentence in capital trials, those juries must also be “death qualified,” that is, able to impose the death penalty in at least some cases.”
    and be unanimous in this serious decision.
    Correct. And I just learned this - Oregon is the only state that permits convictions, for criminal felonies other than murder, on a 10-2 or 11-1 vote of the jury.
    Never knew that either. I like it. 

    I've always kinda wished there were professional jurors. People  that go through law school and trained to properly carry out a judge's instructions. I guess it goes against the "jury of your peers" notion, but as we all know, a lot of our peers are morons. 

    What additional benefit would professional, legally trained jurors add to the process that the judge doesn't already provide? 
    I guess just having twelve people making the decision rather than one. 
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 39,017
    Who here would want to sit before and be “judged” by anyone else on here, for a crime and particularly, a DP case?
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  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,025
    I will admit there have been cases where in my gut I think, "That person should be shot".  But that doesn't mean I would go along with the idea as an actual act.  Too many innocents have died.  I know someone serving a life sentence and I am 99% certain that person is innocent of the crime for which he was charged  (sorry, no more details here).  Now, true, he didn't get the death penalty, but life in prison?  That would be a fate worse than death for me.  So no, I can't abide with this decision.  It's yet another indication of how blood thirsty and viscous  society has become.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 39,017
    brianlux said:
    I will admit there have been cases where in my gut I think, "That person should be shot".  But that doesn't mean I would go along with the idea as an actual act.  Too many innocents have died.  I know someone serving a life sentence and I am 99% certain that person is innocent of the crime for which he was charged  (sorry, no more details here).  Now, true, he didn't get the death penalty, but life in prison?  That would be a fate worse than death for me.  So no, I can't abide with this decision.  It's yet another indication of how blood thirsty and viscous  society has become.
    How blood thirsty and viscous MAGA has become, Brian. The rest of the civilized world is normal. USA USA USA is not, just ask the Swede.
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  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,520
    edited July 2019
    Just bringing up this again to  remind everyone on how uniquely behind the times the US is - in yet another area. The developing states of America.


    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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