Are we losing the ability to get the job done right?

brianlux

The FEMA fiasco prompted me to start this thread.  Add your own clusterfuck example.  Maybe at least we'll get a cynical chuckle or two out of this!

I'm seeing more and more evidence that we are losing  our ability to get things done right.  Just a few examples going from the most broad in terms of who is most affected to the most local:

Being 767 Max.  These planes cover a lot of territory, there are thousands of them (I believe about 5,000), and some safety features are considered... optional?  WTF?

FEMA data breach affects 2.5 million.  Stolen I.D. anyone?

San Francisco's Millennium Tower  skyscraper is leaning, sinking and developed a crack?  Who designed this?  The man or woman who finished last in engineering but somehow managed to cop a degree?

The "pond" below Forni Road on U.S. 50 just outside Placerville, California.  First of all, this road has been closed forever and it's the only alternate route to speak of for locals wanting to get somewhere.  And when it rains, the runoff flowed into an unplanned and rather large pond right next to the highway.  What could go wrong?  I can't wait for the mosquitoes to start hatching!

I keep hearing about how "advanced" technology is these days.  Too bad the people seem to be going in the opposite direction. 

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

The FEMA fiasco prompted me to start this thread.  Add your own clusterfuck example.  Maybe at least we'll get a cynical chuckle or two out of this!

I'm seeing more and more evidence that we are losing  our ability to get things done right.  Just a few examples going from the most broad in terms of who is most affected to the most local:

Being 767 Max.  These planes cover a lot of territory, there are thousands of them (I believe about 5,000), and some safety features are considered... optional?  WTF?

FEMA data breach affects 2.5 million.  Stolen I.D. anyone?

San Francisco's Millennium Tower  skyscraper is leaning, sinking and developed a crack?  Who designed this?  The man or woman who finished last in engineering but somehow managed to cop a degree?

The "pond" below Forni Road on U.S. 50 just outside Placerville, California.  First of all, this road has been closed forever and it's the only alternate route to speak of for locals wanting to get somewhere.  And when it rains, the runoff flowed into an unplanned and rather large pond right next to the highway.  What could go wrong?  I can't wait for the mosquitoes to start hatching!

I keep hearing about how "advanced" technology is these days.  Too bad the people seem to be going in the opposite direction. 

Questionable girders will be replaced; 'Mistakes were made,' says Murray

https://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/parkway-girders-in-question-will-be-replaced-say-builders

This was the largest infrastructure project in Ontario's history, well over a billion.  Most figure the company was trying to cut corners.  A highway that will be seeing a shitload of semis passing through is no place to cut corners.  Amazingly the highway finished on time.  Makes me wonder though... 

Meltdown99

Nipigon Bridge failed due to design, improperly tightened bolts

https://globalnews.ca/news/2957484/design-improperly-tightened-bolts-named-as-factors-in-nipigon-bridge-failure/

This happened shortly after it opened.

Meltdown99

Great thread...

Meltdown99

I'm not going to link them.  But have you heard about all the recalls on cars lately?  I do not remember a time when so many recalls have been issued.

brianlux

Meltdown99 said:

I'm not going to link them.  But have you heard about all the recalls on cars lately?  I do not remember a time when so many recalls have been issued.

I can believe it.   

Cars are more complex than ever-  admittedly safer, but they also break down a lot and who can fix them?  Not  me-- any longer.  I kind of suck as a mechanic but even with my skill level I was able to keep my '65 Malibu tuned and running well with a few basic tools and a socket set.  It helped that it didn't need a lot of repairs.  But cars cars today are in and out of the shop like crazy- even the better ones. 

benjs

I can think of a few pretty critical reasons for this.
1) Corporations' first priorities are to make the most money, not to keep customers safe. It's regulators' first priority to assure public safety from corporations, and we should be demanding answers from them on how their lack of due diligence permitted Boeing to go forward with this product with optional safety features when clearly they ought not to have been optional (as one example). The honour system doesn't work here.
2) We are doing more things at any one time than ever before. From a probabilistic standpoint, we're more likely to get more things wrong by volume, and then also likely by percentage, since we try to develop expertise in too many directions simultaneously
3) With respect to infrastructure - we rapidly expand infrastructure at times of economic and population growth, which often carries the same designs and usable lifespans, yet there's no guarantee of funds to be available when that usable life expires. Ontario is seeing this first hand, with a litany of bridges and roads needing some love for quite some time now
4) The insistence to have serviceability in design has gone away as we've taken a more disposable approach to product. Since we've allowed this collectively over years, we've trained corporations to behave like this. Serviceability is an expensive constraint to work with. It adds bulk, adds design challenges, introduces mechanical components to allow access to inner workings (which means more opportunities for failure to assess), etc. 

brianlux

benjs said:

I can think of a few pretty critical reasons for this.
1) Corporations' first priorities are to make the most money, not to keep customers safe. It's regulators' first priority to assure public safety from corporations, and we should be demanding answers from them on how their lack of due diligence permitted Boeing to go forward with this product with optional safety features when clearly they ought not to have been optional (as one example). The honour system doesn't work here.
2) We are doing more things at any one time than ever before. From a probabilistic standpoint, we're more likely to get more things wrong by volume, and then also likely by percentage, since we try to develop expertise in too many directions simultaneously
3) With respect to infrastructure - we rapidly expand infrastructure at times of economic and population growth, which often carries the same designs and usable lifespans, yet there's no guarantee of funds to be available when that usable life expires. Ontario is seeing this first hand, with a litany of bridges and roads needing some love for quite some time now
4) The insistence to have serviceability in design has gone away as we've taken a more disposable approach to product. Since we've allowed this collectively over years, we've trained corporations to behave like this. Serviceability is an expensive constraint to work with. It adds bulk, adds design challenges, introduces mechanical components to allow access to inner workings (which means more opportunities for failure to assess), etc. 

Good points here Ben, thanks.

With regard to infrastructure, at the surface, it seems to make sense that roads and bridges will fail when so many have reached the age they are today.  On the other hand, an argument could be made that fewer would fail if built correctly in the first place.  I'm thinking about the Brooklyn Bridge, for example, that was built so sturdily that with regular maintenance (which has been done) that bridge is expected to function quite well for a long, long time.  Alan Weisman talks about this in The World Without Us and I understand David McCullough's The Great Bridge reveals much the same (I need to read that one!)  That bridge opened in 1883.  Imagine that!  So why were we able to build something so sturdy in 1883 (I have to emphasize that again!) and yet so much of what is built today is so very much inferior?  This is yet another argument in favor of that very important concept known as durability and why is does not pay to go on the cheap. 

bootlegger10

Greed.   Trying to do the most possible with the least amount of people and machines to get the job done.

brianlux

bootlegger10 said:

Greed.   Trying to do the most possible with the least amount of people and machines to get the job done.

For sure.  And that greed is short-sighted.

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

Meltdown99 said:

I'm not going to link them.  But have you heard about all the recalls on cars lately?  I do not remember a time when so many recalls have been issued.

I can believe it.   

Cars are more complex than ever-  admittedly safer, but they also break down a lot and who can fix them?  Not  me-- any longer.  I kind of suck as a mechanic but even with my skill level I was able to keep my '65 Malibu tuned and running well with a few basic tools and a socket set.  It helped that it didn't need a lot of repairs.  But cars cars today are in and out of the shop like crazy- even the better ones. 

Cars, for the most part, are better than ever.  I'm driving a 13-year-old jeep that runs like a dream, I have no intention of replacing it.

Personally, I wish the manufacturers of recalled cars had to disclose where the recalled parts were made...my guess, a lot from China and Mexico.

brianlux

Speaking of replacement parts, here's another big issue:  replacement parts for electronics.  I'm not a huge audiophile but I try to keep up a bit with the basics.  From what I've read and been told in a number of different circumstances, it seems that these days it difficult to impossible to find quality replacement parts for things like tape decks and integrated amplifiers.  I've had guys tell me to forget about trying to get my two older Marantz tuners repaired because replacement parts are crap.  If true, this fits well under the category of "planned obsolescence".

josevolution

Yes 

PJ_Soul

When people don't focus on the right things, it's definitely hard to get a job done!

U.S. has hit ‘breaking point’ at border amid immigration surge, Customs and Border Protection commissioner says

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/us-has-hit-breaking-point-at-border-amid-immigration-surge-customs-and-border-protection-commissioner-says/2019/03/27/d2014068-5093-11e9-af35-1fb9615010d7_story.html?utm_term=.9d975c052b38&wpisrc=al_news__alert-world--alert-national&wpmk=1

Instead of wasting all this fucking time trying to pay for a stupid wall that won't work, they should be focusing their attention and funds on dealing with this issue directly. More personnel to handle the claims, more immigration centres on the border so they can efficiently and HUMANELY process people and make sure their human rights aren't being violated due to a lack of resources, etc etc. And the government needs to fucking acknowledge that the people coming from Honduras, Guatemala, and Venezuela have LEGITIMATE REASONS to be trying to flee into the USA for a better life. I'm NOT saying the US should just let them come running across the border. I'm saying that some humanity has to be tapped here, and recognize that the US has a legit refugee issue on their hands. That means thinking of these people as human beings in need of help and some basic human kindness when they are confronted and taken in and processed by border services, and not just as an invading swarm, which is exactly how Trump presents it. Encourage these people to enter a DECENT system to try for refugee status rather than make them feel like they need to sneak across or else be separated from their children and essentially be thrown in prison indefinitely, surrounded by chaos because the government is failing to maintain any sense of fucking order.