'You are in Saskatchewan's hearts': 14 confirmed dead in junior hockey team bus crash

Meltdown99

'You are in Saskatchewan's hearts': 14 confirmed dead in junior hockey team bus crash

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/nipawin-humboldt-bus-crash-1.4609554

Just terrible ... RIP

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Yup. Brutal for sure.

It's very early and no details about the crash have been released, but I can't stop wondering how this occurred given the nature of the highway crossing?

brianlux

Terrible news.  So sad to hear this.

josevolution

Horrible news :( just so sad ...RIP

Meltdown99

Head coach among 14 killed in Sask. junior hockey team bus crash

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/nipawin-humboldt-bus-crash-1.4609835

Meltdown99

Humboldt gathers, and mourns, through a long and tragic night

http://nationalpost.com/news/local-news/humboldt-gathers-and-mourns-through-a-long-and-tragic-night/wcm/eca38dc5-e336-433b-b3bc-95b2e98c967c

Meltdown99

Go Fund Me

https://ca.gofundme.com/funds-for-humboldt-broncos

dignin

I know a few people involved with the hockey team they were heading to play that night. 

Terrible tragedy.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Just watched press conference.

Eesh. 

A nightmare.

Meltdown99

Death toll has risen to 15.

Truck driver was not injured and was originally detained but later relesed...

Fifthelement

Absolutely devastating.  My heart and thoughts go out to the Humboldt Broncos, their families and friends as well as to the first responders and hospital staff.  I cannot even imagine how deep the grief is.

Halifax2TheMax

Words can’t describe my thoughts of this horrific loss. I’m keeping the families and friends in my thoughts. Fuck. That team picture, damn.

Meltdown99

Coaches Corner ... 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=308&v=z-lLYCzAJXI

Thirty Bills Unpaid

This is the part that has me restraining myself from jumping to conclusions:

The semi-trailer would have had to yield to a stop sign before crossing over the highway that the hockey bus was travelling on.

It's wide open there and the roads are straight as the crow flies. In other words... this intersection should be one of the safest intersections in the world.

The wreckage is unfathomable. I can't imagine the force of the collision. I can't imagine the horror of the scene. This is an extremely disturbing event.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/rcmp-say-multiple-factors-under-consideration-in-broncos-team-bus-crash/ar-AAvBsxe?li=AAggNb9&ocid=edgsp

Meltdown99

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

This is the part that has me restraining myself from jumping to conclusions:

The semi-trailer would have had to yield to a stop sign before crossing over the highway that the hockey bus was travelling on.

It's wide open there and the roads are straight as the crow flies. In other words... this intersection should be one of the safest intersections in the world.

The wreckage is unfathomable. I can't imagine the force of the collision. I can't imagine the horror of the scene. This is an extremely disturbing event.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/rcmp-say-multiple-factors-under-consideration-in-broncos-team-bus-crash/ar-AAvBsxe?li=AAggNb9&ocid=edgsp

I've seen Google map pictures of that intersection.  It's very baffling.  Either the trucker didn't stop, did stop and didn't see the bus or misjudged somehow...

How many more of these tragic accidents do we need involving semi/passenger vehicles before we pass stricter requirements to drive those trucks ... you can get your licence in less than 2 months to drive one of those.  The Toronto Star did a piece a few years ago about how many drivers were getting poorly trained at  fly-by-night schools.  It's still to early to speculate I guess...but I do not see how the bus was a fault.
My wife drives semi.  Any job she has had, they only drug when they hired her, and road test before...never been drugs tested after being hired, has never been road tested  by company every so often, or has ever been offered additional training, many truckers drive 10-13 hour days ... the pay is not that great for the hours they put in, that is why many push on long after they are to tired to be safe.  And yes these companies expect/demand the drivers max out their hours weekly.  Another fact to consider, the drivers are getting older...but the same expectations are expected of 55 year old driver, as a 24 year old driver.  I know I do not have the same energy level as 53 year old that I did in my 20's.  I think something has to change.  Will things change, likely not...

After seeing that overhead shot of the debris field, it really is a miracle that 14 people did survive ... unfortunately 15 souls did not make it, life cut to short...

Sad day all around...

And if this driver is at fault, id have no problem seeing him spend the remainder of his days in prison...

Thirty Bills Unpaid

We battle poor truck drivers on the Coquihalla (Highway Thru Hell) all the time. I'm not even going to begin to tell you my experiences which I'm sure are the same as everyone else's. There are several professional drivers, but there are many really poor drivers that, quite frankly, cause havoc. They are responsible for numerous highway closures and numerous accidents through sheer negligence or flat out incompetence.

Speed was an issue here- it had to have been. If the truck had been stopped at the stop sign and then made the decision to proceed-not recognizing that a bus was still in the intersection- the collision would have been significant, but not so significant that both vehicles are destroyed with the semi load dispersed over numerous concentric circles and the bus reduced to its chassis.

My hunch is that the driver was never intending to stop- either not recognizing he needed to... or thinking the bus was going to.

Meltdown99

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

We battle poor truck drivers on the Coquihalla (Highway Thru Hell) all the time. I'm not even going to begin to tell you my experiences which I'm sure are the same as everyone else's. There are several professional drivers, but there are many really poor drivers that, quite frankly, cause havoc. They are responsible for numerous highway closures and numerous accidents through sheer negligence or flat out incompetence.

Speed was an issue here- it had to have been. If the truck had been stopped at the stop sign and then made the decision to proceed-not recognizing that a bus was still in the intersection- the collision would have been significant, but not so significant that both vehicles are destroyed with the semi load dispersed over numerous concentric circles and the bus reduced to its chassis.

My hunch is that the driver was never intending to stop- either not recognizing he needed to... or thinking the bus was going to.

I agree with you all accounts ... I live in Ontario along the 401 corridor ... drove that hwy for 20 years to, most semi drivers are not very professional, nor are they good drivers...if you ever get chance, watch heavy rescue 401...

if the driver blew through the stop sign, then he should rot in prison...

ive only been to sasketewan once...

but I saw many of these type of  intersections ... Saskatchewan is not overly congested...many of these truckers are complacent behind the wheel. Changes need to come to the trucking industry...but that has to come from the feds...

Meltdown99

Trudeau to attend vigil in Humboldt in honour of 15 Broncos crash victims

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/humboldt-bands-together-following-tragedy-1.4610261

I am very glad that the PM will be attending ... these fine folks will need all the comfort, support and mental health support that can be given...

Meltdown99

I post this because some local politicians say they need rumble strips and these trees block visibility.

A fully loaded semi that has not slowed by the time it comes across rumble strips, probably it's too late.  If the truck was stopped, and the trees blocked his disability, the you proceed with extreme caution...  I really do not see a problem with this intersection... Driving is not rocket science...just way to many careless and inattentive drivers on the road.

Meltdown99

The go fund me is closing in on 5 million...

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

Go Fund Me

https://ca.gofundme.com/funds-for-humboldt-broncos

This is by far the most money ever received for a gofundme camapaign. Tells you just how touched by this tragedy people are.
Just a terrible, heartbreaking disaster.  

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

I post this because some local politicians say they need rumble strips and these trees block visibility.

A fully loaded semi that has not slowed by the time it comes across rumble strips, probably it's too late.  If the truck was stopped, and the trees blocked his disability, the you proceed with extreme caution...  I really do not see a problem with this intersection... Driving is not rocket science...just way to many careless and inattentive drivers on the road.

  Yeah, someone who should have stopped/been keeping an eye out clearly didn't - there is no other way for this accident to have happened the way it did. But you know, no matter what is done, there will still always be accidents, at least as long as human error remains a factor. In this case, I would imagine that a stop sign will be going up pretty soon.
I think suggesting that trees on a corner are to blame is a bit crazy. You can't cut down ever tree that's on a corner in the middle of nowhere. So you cut down these very nice, healthy-looking trees on this one corner.... There are still a million other corners with trees. The issue here is 1) signage, and 2) a human not being careful enough. Not trees.

Meltdown99

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

I post this because some local politicians say they need rumble strips and these trees block visibility.

A fully loaded semi that has not slowed by the time it comes across rumble strips, probably it's too late.  If the truck was stopped, and the trees blocked his disability, the you proceed with extreme caution...  I really do not see a problem with this intersection... Driving is not rocket science...just way to many careless and inattentive drivers on the road.

  Yeah, someone who should have stopped/been keeping an eye out clearly didn't - there is no other way for this accident to have happened the way it did. But you know, no matter what is done, there will still always be accidents, at least as long as human error remains a factor. In this case, I would imagine that a stop sign will be going up pretty soon.

You think they'll make it a 4 way stop?  A 4 way stop make sense.  then the odds are that at the bus would be slowing and stopped.  Just a terrible accident.  You are right, as long as humans drive there will always be accidents.  

oftenreading

Although no cause has been determined yet that I’ve read, it does seem like the odds are high that it was human error. That doesn’t mean that we can’t look at highway improvements to limit future incidents. Human error is going to always be present; humans get tired or distracted or sick or drunk or hung over or any other of a number of things they shouldn’t be, while driving. Engineering solutions that can limit human error can be a good thing; they certainly have in lots of other fields. That doesn’t take away from any responsibility here. 

Meltdown99

oftenreading said:

Although no cause has been determined yet that I’ve read, it does seem like the odds are high that it was human error. That doesn’t mean that we can’t look at highway improvements to limit future incidents. Human error is going to always be present; humans get tired or distracted or sick or drunk or hung over or any other of a number of things they shouldn’t be, while driving. Engineering solutions that can limit human error can be a good thing; they certainly have in lots of other fields. That doesn’t take away from any responsibility here. 

I agree, nothing wrong with improving hwy safety.  It's also time for the federal government to look at the amount of hours these drivers drive in a day, the rules regarding the trucking incidustry needs review and modernized.  My wife drives semi, companies demand you max out your hours...

PJ_Soul

oftenreading said:

Although no cause has been determined yet that I’ve read, it does seem like the odds are high that it was human error. That doesn’t mean that we can’t look at highway improvements to limit future incidents. Human error is going to always be present; humans get tired or distracted or sick or drunk or hung over or any other of a number of things they shouldn’t be, while driving. Engineering solutions that can limit human error can be a good thing; they certainly have in lots of other fields. That doesn’t take away from any responsibility here. 

Sure, and I think a stop sign would do it. I don't even think a 4-way stop would be necessary. Just stop signs for which ever road there is the more minor one should be adequate. But we have to keep in mind, they can't be upgrading every single rural intersection in the country because of one accident, no matter how terrible it was. It's just not realistic. But at this intersection in particular, yeah, a sign seems like a reasonable response. Looks like there is already lighting.

Meltdown99

PJ_Soul said:

oftenreading said:

Although no cause has been determined yet that I’ve read, it does seem like the odds are high that it was human error. That doesn’t mean that we can’t look at highway improvements to limit future incidents. Human error is going to always be present; humans get tired or distracted or sick or drunk or hung over or any other of a number of things they shouldn’t be, while driving. Engineering solutions that can limit human error can be a good thing; they certainly have in lots of other fields. That doesn’t take away from any responsibility here. 

Sure, and I think a stop sign would do it. I don't even think a 4-way stop would be necessary. Just stop signs for which ever road there is the more minor one should be adequate. But we have to keep in mind, they can't be upgrading every single rural intersection in the country because of one accident, no matter how terrible it was. It's just not realistic. But at this intersection in particular, yeah, a sign seems like a reasonable response. Looks like there is already lighting.

The truck driver approached a intersection controlled with a stop sign.  He either did stop or stop and didn't see the bus approaching...

Also I read that this was the second fatal accident in 20 years, if true, that hardly makes this intersection unsafe...

I live in southern Ontario, not too far from a stretch of the 401 called carnage alley...

In the end it came down to driver error.  I'm all for improving highway safety.  I'm all for an overhaul of the trucking industry as well.

That is not a blind intersection.  all the semi had to do was stop, creep ahead and check that it was safe to proceed...

PJ_Soul

Oh, I didn't know there was already a stop sign. I couldn't see one in the photos I saw. Well, not much you can do about people running signs and lights. Not to be cavellier or anything, but emotions aside, accidents/human errors happen. As I mentioned before, you can't put up major traffic control infrastructure or even rumble pads at every little rural intersection..... But FWIW, this is one of the reasons I'm a strong supporter of driverless technology advancements.

josevolution

Meltdown99 said:

PJ_Soul said:

oftenreading said:

Although no cause has been determined yet that I’ve read, it does seem like the odds are high that it was human error. That doesn’t mean that we can’t look at highway improvements to limit future incidents. Human error is going to always be present; humans get tired or distracted or sick or drunk or hung over or any other of a number of things they shouldn’t be, while driving. Engineering solutions that can limit human error can be a good thing; they certainly have in lots of other fields. That doesn’t take away from any responsibility here. 

Sure, and I think a stop sign would do it. I don't even think a 4-way stop would be necessary. Just stop signs for which ever road there is the more minor one should be adequate. But we have to keep in mind, they can't be upgrading every single rural intersection in the country because of one accident, no matter how terrible it was. It's just not realistic. But at this intersection in particular, yeah, a sign seems like a reasonable response. Looks like there is already lighting.

The truck driver approached a intersection controlled with a stop sign.  He either did stop or stop and didn't see the bus approaching...

Also I read that this was the second fatal accident in 20 years, if true, that hardly makes this intersection unsafe...

I live in southern Ontario, not too far from a stretch of the 401 called carnage alley...

In the end it came down to driver error.  I'm all for improving highway safety.  I'm all for an overhaul of the trucking industry as well.

That is not a blind intersection.  all the semi had to do was stop, creep ahead and check that it was safe to proceed...

Man i hate to put blame but i bet the truck driver saw the bus thought he could make it across or hesitated and then tried to go through intersection missjudged the speed of bus ..Man how terribly sad that it probably comes down to human error ..

Meltdown99

I also believe the bus was white ... I have wondered if the bus kind of blended with the snow on the ground...still no excuse.  Semi-Drivers have to be better...I'm sure the driver will be charged, the police might not even have taken a statement from the semi - driver yet...I'm sure he was in shock as well...I don't see a problem with that intersection myself...

PJ_Soul

The semi driver must be horrifically traumatized at the time, and still. He may be in the midst of a mental breakdown right now for all we know.