Trade Wars

Thoughts_Arrive

https://brorlandi.github.io/StarWarsIntroCreator/#!/AL8H2YD1vfavBKfeKk6z

Meltdown99

Does that mean people might have to pay a few dollars more to buy the crap out of china?  Not a lot of stuff made in china is worth a damn.

tbergs

We get a lot of stuff that is worth a damn. They are a big contributor to US jobs and products. This will hurt us quite a bit since we are more dependent on them. 

"China is currently our largest goods trading partner with $578.2 billion in total (two way) goods trade during 2016. Goods exports totaled $115.6 billion; goods imports totaled $462.6 billion.  The U.S. goods trade deficit with China was $347.0 billion in 2016.

Trade in services with China (exports and imports) totaled an estimated $70.3 billion in 2016. Services exports were $54.2 billion; services imports were $16.1 billion. The U.S. services trade surplus with China was $38.0 billion in 2016. 

According to the U.S. Department of Commerce, U.S. exports of goods and services to China supported an estimated 911,000 jobs in 2015 (latest data available) (601,000 supported by goods exports and 309,000 supported by services exports."

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/china-mongolia-taiwan/peoples-republic-china

Meltdown99

tbergs said:

We get a lot of stuff that is worth a damn. They are a big contributor to US jobs and products. This will hurt us quite a bit since we are more dependent on them. 

"China is currently our largest goods trading partner with $578.2 billion in total (two way) goods trade during 2016. Goods exports totaled $115.6 billion; goods imports totaled $462.6 billion.  The U.S. goods trade deficit with China was $347.0 billion in 2016.

Trade in services with China (exports and imports) totaled an estimated $70.3 billion in 2016. Services exports were $54.2 billion; services imports were $16.1 billion. The U.S. services trade surplus with China was $38.0 billion in 2016. 

According to the U.S. Department of Commerce, U.S. exports of goods and services to China supported an estimated 911,000 jobs in 2015 (latest data available) (601,000 supported by goods exports and 309,000 supported by services exports."

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/china-mongolia-taiwan/peoples-republic-china

You can trust the Chinese all you want.  I have no trust in them.  Although its hard to do, but if their a similar more expensive product made elsewhere I'll pay more...

Im with Trump on this.  The chinese are at the head of the dirty dozen for for steel dumping.

Meltdown99

China had to intervene to curb a rout in its $7.7 trillion stock market this morning, sources say

http://business.financialpost.com/investing/china-is-said-to-intervene-in-stocks-after-tariffs-trigger-rout?utm_campaign=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook

jeffbr

Meltdown99 said:

tbergs said:

We get a lot of stuff that is worth a damn. They are a big contributor to US jobs and products. This will hurt us quite a bit since we are more dependent on them. 

"China is currently our largest goods trading partner with $578.2 billion in total (two way) goods trade during 2016. Goods exports totaled $115.6 billion; goods imports totaled $462.6 billion.  The U.S. goods trade deficit with China was $347.0 billion in 2016.

Trade in services with China (exports and imports) totaled an estimated $70.3 billion in 2016. Services exports were $54.2 billion; services imports were $16.1 billion. The U.S. services trade surplus with China was $38.0 billion in 2016. 

According to the U.S. Department of Commerce, U.S. exports of goods and services to China supported an estimated 911,000 jobs in 2015 (latest data available) (601,000 supported by goods exports and 309,000 supported by services exports."

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/china-mongolia-taiwan/peoples-republic-china

You can trust the Chinese all you want.  I have no trust in them.  Although its hard to do, but if their a similar more expensive product made elsewhere I'll pay more...

Im with Trump on this.  The chinese are at the head of the dirty dozen for for steel dumping.

It's not just about bringing goods in - although this trade war will absolutely harm US consumers when they see the cost of goods (like tennis shoes or cell phones or other everyday items) skyrocket. This will also negatively impact domestic goods destined for China. Exports are going to be hurt, and the companies doing the exporting are going to suffer. Boeing currently has a 300 aircraft order from China that they are now concerned about. Cancellation of Boeing jets would be devastating for Washington's economy as well as other states where Boeing employs a large number of people. 1/3 of Boeing's business is with China. That's just one example. China is my state's largest trading partner. We export apples, wheat, seafood, technology products, etc... There is nothing good about a trade war with China and while some states may not suffer much for it other than seeing consumer prices rising, many states could be devastated. Fucking Trump doesn't understand the first goddamned thing about trade or the economy. 

brianlux

I think before we can fix the economy we need to focus on fixing our consumption habits.  We buy crap we don't need and buy crap that is made to break down and need replacing quickly.  And a lot of that cheap crap comes out of China, cheap crap made by slaves and child slaves.  People in Los Angels buy oranges grown in Florida and visa versa and that's peanuts compared to buying shit made clear the hell over in China. Too few people have even heard of Earth Overshoot Day.  We consume what the planet has to give by August (soon by July).  This cannot go on much longer.

And then add to that having Trump trying to manage this so-called economy?   Crazy.

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

I think before we can fix the economy we need to focus on fixing our consumption habits.  We buy crap we don't need and buy crap that is made to break down and need replacing quickly.  And a lot of that cheap crap comes out of China, cheap crap made by slaves and child slaves.  People in Los Angels buy oranges grown in Florida and visa versa and that's peanuts compared to buying shit made clear the hell over in China. Too few people have even heard of Earth Overshoot Day.  We consume what the planet has to give by August (soon by July).  This cannot go on much longer.

And then add to that having Trump trying to manage this so-called economy?   Crazy.

Excellent points Brian.

also how come china couldn’t match the us tariffs 1 for 1, I understand they’ll retaliate with 3 billion in tariffs...as opposed to 50 billion the us might impose...

Meltdown99

China Wants Total Access To Canada, May Seek To Import Its Own Workers

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/25/caanda-china-trade_n_15584542.html

i would never trust the Chinese...

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

China Wants Total Access To Canada, May Seek To Import Its Own Workers

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/25/caanda-china-trade_n_15584542.html

i would never trust the Chinese...

Aren't you in favour of the oil industry in Canada though? The Chinese are all over that.

Meltdown99

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

China Wants Total Access To Canada, May Seek To Import Its Own Workers

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/25/caanda-china-trade_n_15584542.html

i would never trust the Chinese...

Aren't you in favour of the oil industry in Canada though? The Chinese are all over that.

I’m in favour of natural gas for my home and gasoline for my car...

im not in favour of the Chinese buying any industry in Canada...

so what are you saying?  The pipeline you oppose is for the benefit of the Chinese...

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

China Wants Total Access To Canada, May Seek To Import Its Own Workers

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/25/caanda-china-trade_n_15584542.html

i would never trust the Chinese...

Aren't you in favour of the oil industry in Canada though? The Chinese are all over that.

I’m in favour of natural gas for my home and gasoline for my car...

im not in favour of the Chinese buying any industry in Canada...

so what are you saying?  The pipeline you oppose is for the benefit of the Chinese...

Well that wasn't what I was saying, but yes, that pipeline would benefit the Chinese, obviously. But just in general, the Chinese have their mitts all over Canada's oil industry.

brianlux

Meltdown99 said:

brianlux said:

I think before we can fix the economy we need to focus on fixing our consumption habits.  We buy crap we don't need and buy crap that is made to break down and need replacing quickly.  And a lot of that cheap crap comes out of China, cheap crap made by slaves and child slaves.  People in Los Angels buy oranges grown in Florida and visa versa and that's peanuts compared to buying shit made clear the hell over in China. Too few people have even heard of Earth Overshoot Day.  We consume what the planet has to give by August (soon by July).  This cannot go on much longer.

And then add to that having Trump trying to manage this so-called economy?   Crazy.

Excellent points Brian.

also how come china couldn’t match the us tariffs 1 for 1, I understand they’ll retaliate with 3 billion in tariffs...as opposed to 50 billion the us might impose...

Good question.  I guess they're in it for the competition.

Meltdown99

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

China Wants Total Access To Canada, May Seek To Import Its Own Workers

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/25/caanda-china-trade_n_15584542.html

i would never trust the Chinese...

Aren't you in favour of the oil industry in Canada though? The Chinese are all over that.

I’m in favour of natural gas for my home and gasoline for my car...

im not in favour of the Chinese buying any industry in Canada...

so what are you saying?  The pipeline you oppose is for the benefit of the Chinese...

Well that wasn't what I was saying, but yes, that pipeline would benefit the Chinese, obviously. But just in general, the Chinese have their mitts all over Canada's oil industry.

Agreed.  What about energy east, would have opposed that?  I am not all that knowledgeable about the oil industry, and I’m mistaken...let me know.

I was under the impression that if energy east was completed it would have reduced the amount of Middle East oil we import.

but that’s the crazy thing about this oil business...why do we import oil?

do we not have enough of our own oil?

good luck with your fight over the pipeline, and I am being sincere.  I’ll stay neutral on this issue.

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

Meltdown99 said:

brianlux said:

I think before we can fix the economy we need to focus on fixing our consumption habits.  We buy crap we don't need and buy crap that is made to break down and need replacing quickly.  And a lot of that cheap crap comes out of China, cheap crap made by slaves and child slaves.  People in Los Angels buy oranges grown in Florida and visa versa and that's peanuts compared to buying shit made clear the hell over in China. Too few people have even heard of Earth Overshoot Day.  We consume what the planet has to give by August (soon by July).  This cannot go on much longer.

And then add to that having Trump trying to manage this so-called economy?   Crazy.

Excellent points Brian.

also how come china couldn’t match the us tariffs 1 for 1, I understand they’ll retaliate with 3 billion in tariffs...as opposed to 50 billion the us might impose...

Good question.  I guess they're in it for the competition.

Anyways, I would gladly pay more for a USA or Canadian built product...

the community i live has saw first hand the damage NAFTA has done to our manufacturing.

and a local guy (Barry Zekelman) who owns Atlas Tube in Harrow, Ontario and 11 plants in the USA , is all for those tariffs, and said at the time that he felt Canada and Mexico would exempt which we are as of now.  

I’m for fair trade, not free trade.

cincybearcat

China has been doing shady business for a long time.  This may be painful in the short term but you cannot continue to allow them to bully the market.  Big, tough problems are rarely fixed quick and without some consequence in the short term.  This is one area I agree with trump.

PJ_Soul

Yeah, I'm not pro-China either.... I do feel like it's probably too little too late at this point though. If this kind of thing had been done years ago, and if a bunch of other western nations did it too, then great, we'd be in a much better position now. But it wasn't and they didn't and apparently don't plan on it now, so I don't think it can really work anymore. Trump is promoting a plan that is years past its expiration date IMO.

Smellyman

Meltdown99 said:

Does that mean people might have to pay a few dollars more to buy the crap out of china?  Not a lot of stuff made in china is worth a damn.

Especially that Apple crap

Meltdown99

Smellyman said:

Meltdown99 said:

Does that mean people might have to pay a few dollars more to buy the crap out of china?  Not a lot of stuff made in china is worth a damn.

Especially that Apple crap

I buy apples from southern Ontario, so tasty...would never buy food from China...no standards.

Smellyman

Standards are increasing so much in China, workers benefits, workers rights etc.  That companies now are looking for the next country to pollute and exploit such as India and Vietnam.

Many have their sites on African countries becoming the new China.  It's a bummer that the West loves their 'Stuff' so much.  Using up resources and polluting the planet.

Meltdown99

Just the west using up resources?  How interesting...

Smellyman

Meltdown99 said:

Just the west using up resources?  How interesting...

Well when just the US and 325 million people use 25% of the worlds oil.  I think that number is pretty lopsided.  US is 4.4% of the worlds population

Just me though.

Other resources fall in line with that too.

Meltdown99

Well you’ll have to discuss that with Americans, and maybe they’ll take up your concerns...

brianlux

Smellyman said:

Meltdown99 said:

Just the west using up resources?  How interesting...

Well when just the US and 325 million people use 25% of the worlds oil.  I think that number is pretty lopsided.  US is 4.4% of the worlds population

Just me though.

Other resources fall in line with that too.

Meltdown99 said:

Well you’ll have to discuss that with Americans, and maybe they’ll take up your concerns...

The statistics are easy to find.  Doing a quick search, I just read the following stats that say:

"The United States, with less than 5 % of the global population, uses about a quarter of the world's fossil fuel resources."

"Americans constitute 5% of the world's population but consume 24% of the world's energy."

"Americans make up only 4.5% of the world's population and yet consume nearly 20% of its energy."

The stats vary a bit, of course, but the message is plain and clear.  I won't even bother to cite these statistics.  They're pretty much common knowledge. 

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

Smellyman said:

Meltdown99 said:

Just the west using up resources?  How interesting...

Well when just the US and 325 million people use 25% of the worlds oil.  I think that number is pretty lopsided.  US is 4.4% of the worlds population

Just me though.

Other resources fall in line with that too.

Meltdown99 said:

Well you’ll have to discuss that with Americans, and maybe they’ll take up your concerns...

The statistics are easy to find.  Doing a quick search, I just read the following stats that say:

"The United States, with less than 5 % of the global population, uses about a quarter of the world's fossil fuel resources."

"Americans constitute 5% of the world's population but consume 24% of the world's energy."

"Americans make up only 4.5% of the world's population and yet consume nearly 20% of its energy."

The stats vary a bit, of course, but the message is plain and clear.  I won't even bother to cite these statistics.  They're pretty much common knowledge. 

I know the statistics ... I’m no an America, nor do I care how much Americans consume...

Comparing America to China, I’ll take America thank you very much.

cincybearcat

Smellyman said:

Meltdown99 said:

Just the west using up resources?  How interesting...

Well when just the US and 325 million people use 25% of the worlds oil.  I think that number is pretty lopsided.  US is 4.4% of the worlds population

Just me though.

Other resources fall in line with that too.

Well I'm not sure thats the correct math.  Isn't the US like 30% of the population of developed countries?  

Nami

Smellyman said:

Standards are increasing so much in China, workers benefits, workers rights etc.  That companies now are looking for the next country to pollute and exploit such as India and Vietnam.

Many have their sites on African countries becoming the new China.  It's a bummer that the West loves their 'Stuff' so much.  Using up resources and polluting the planet.

That's the problem, its a cycle that will never be fixed. It all stems back to the stocks and company margins.  

In business everyday is a trade war.  each side wants to come out on top, nothing new here. Not to mention the fierce competition that exists....