Song of the day(Indifference)

JDE-PJJDE-PJ Posts: 721
The last song off of VS, and certainly one of if not the best of them all.

Lets hear some of your interps on this one, too many of you are quiet with these, speak up would yah;)

This post also happens to be one of the funniest ever saved, so I hope everyone enjoys what you're about the read:)


Indifference

RrVwMirror
1/22/01 08:03 AM
SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE



Bastet
9/15/99 1:50 PM
INDIFFERENCE


Well, since we haven't heard from El Con, and I've got the songbook, I'm going to go ahead and post the song of the day. I hope that's ok.

indifference

I will light a match this mornin', so I won't be alone
Watch as she lies silent, for soon night will be gone
Oh, I will stand arms outstretched, pretend I'm free to roam
Oh, I will make my way through one more day in Hell
How much difference does it make
How much difference does it make, yeah

I will hold the candle til it burns up my arm
Oh, I'll keep taking punches until their will grows tired
Oh, I will stare the sun down until my eyes go blind
Hey, I won't change direction and I won't change my mind
How much difference does it make
Mmmm, how much difference does it make
How much difference

I'll swallow poison until I grow immune
I will scream my lungs out til it fills this room
How much difference (2X)
How much difference does it make (2X)

>^--^<




brokenarrow
9/15/99 2:48 PM
Re: INDIFFERENCE


....I just don't know about this one....I don't know who It's about, or why it was written......
......But emotionally, this song makes feelings just spill out over the top,
such passion.......!

It will be nice to read interpretations on this one!
brokenarrow>






moyboy
9/15/99 2:53 PM
Re: INDIFFERENCE


If there was some kind of PJ police that sat me down in a chair in a dark room under a bright light and beat me until I made a decision as to which PJ song is my favorite....I would have to answer that it would be this one.
This song has gotten me through many things and has been background music or the words in my head for many more....
I look forward to hearing if anyone knows what this song is truly about and who, if there is an answer.....






Sister Parish
9/15/99 5:53 PM
Re: INDIFFERENCE


I remember a thread about this song from a long time ago. A few people thought it was about suicide or giving up.

To me, it means the opposite. It's about NEVER giving up, no matter what/who you're up against, even if you think (realize) that the struggle is futile, and you're never going to win. It's like, "I'll just keep on fighting, even if it's pointless." If for no other reason than to keep the other thing/guy from winning.

There isn't any sense of triumph or victory, just a weariness and determination.

"Fuck you. You started it."







Bastet
9/15/99 6:07 PM
Re: INDIFFERENCE


Hey SP - great minds think alike! I was just getting ready to post when I read your interp and it's almost exactly what I was going to say - which I am going to say anyway. I've always thought of this writer as someone who desperately wants to make a difference in the world (and with his girlfriend/wife in the first verse) but feels like he is just wasting his effort. He can't see that anything has changed but yet he cares so much that he absolutely cannot stop trying. One of my favorites from this great record.

>^--^<




moyboy
9/15/99 6:18 PM
Re: INDIFFERENCE


I agree with both of you....
But here's my thoughts:
The last two verses are exactly what you are saying- never giving up, being burned but persevering, and keeping with the fight although it has made the fighter weary.
BUT, It seems to me that this is speaking about something specific and it seems that the first verse sets the stage and scene for the next two verses that speak of the struggle/fight. I mean, he is watching someone as they sleep and talks about living in hell....this seems to set the scene for what he is speaking about, but I don't know what it is.
Any thoughts?






moyboy
9/15/99 6:31 PM
EDDIE VEDDER IS A VAMPIRE


EDDIE VEDDER IS A VAMPIRE!!! I've figured it out.....

"I will light a match this mornin', so I won't be alone": When he awakes, everyone else is asleep, he lights his gothic vampire candle to keep him company

"Watch as she lies silent": He is watching his sleeping soon to be victim, before he begins to suck her blood

"For soon night will be gone": Vampires can only wander the earth at nigthtime- they die when the sun comes up....

"Oh, I will stand arms outstretched, pretend I'm free to roam": a posture often taken by vampires as they hold their cape out when they try to look real scary. HE must pretend he is free to roam, but the reality is he can never go too far from his coffin bed because he must be tucked in before sun rise.

"Oh, I will make my way through one more day in Hell": It's hard work being a vampire. He is literally in hell and is immortal. (this is where "immortality" ties in for all of you who like to look for song links)

"I will hold the candle til it burns up my arm": Again, because Vampires roam at night he is holding a candle. Plus, it makes him look scary.

"Oh, I'll keep taking punches until their will grows tired": This could be a comment on the media and how magazines like Rolling Stone never give vampires a fair shake. Or it could be about when he is planting his fangs into a unsuspecting womans neck and she wakes up- he has to throw punches until her will grows weak....

"Oh, I will stare the sun down until my eyes go blind": Now this is the most obvious...Vampires cannot stare at the sun, it will kill them.

"Hey, I won't change direction and I won't change my mind": He may be a vampire, but he is a vampire with goals and he won't be swayed....

"I'll swallow poison until I grow immune": He eats the poison- the blood of his victims- until he grows "immune" and is no longer mortal. Or, he just really likes to eat garlic, which unfortunately happens to hurt Vampires. IT also gives them very bad breath.

"How much difference does it make?": No matter how many victims, no matter how many necks he sucks, it makes no difference. He must still rise the next evening and do it all again.......

So, there you have it. Solid proof. EDDIE VEDDER IS A VAMPIRE.






Bastet
9/15/99 6:45 PM
Re: A VAMPIRE WITH GOALS! LOL


That's pretty damn funny! But I came up with something completely different. The song starts with the girl lying silent but soon she will be awake and making his life hell again. He is with her but still alone. He stands with arms outstretched but somehow he is not getting through to her. Maybe she wants less committment (he will pretend he's free to roam but that's not what he wants). He'll hold a torch for her until it burns him. He'll take all the suggestions he doesn't want to hear (punches) until she gets tired of saying them. He'll challenge her (stare the sun down) forever. But he loves her and only her and will not stop trying to make her see this. He'll take everything negative she gives (poison) and will still scream his love. In the end, though, he still doesn't think it will matter. But on the other hand, the vampire thing works!

>^--^<




Sister Parish
9/15/99 7:07 PM
Professor Van Hessling, I Presume?


LOL moyboy! That was by far the most convincing "Eddie is a vampire" theory I have read.

But to answer your previous question, I have never thought about what specific incident in the speaker's life this song could be referring to. (Although it certainly relates to very specific incidents, or rather ongoing struggles, in my own life.)

I picture that the beginning of the song is how the speaker starts his day, alone, in the dark, unable to rest, bound to his struggle. His lover is sleeping, symbolizing how she cannot share in or truly understand his experience. He is preparing for another round of fruitless, exhasting fighting; "one more day in Hell."

I do not see this song as being about a relationship. (Although that is a great interpretation, Bastet. Thanks for expanding my thoughts on this song!) I've always seen his "opponent" more as society, or a force in society, or a person who represents that force, something larger and less personal and all the more "unstoppable."







brokenarrow
9/15/99 9:56 PM
OH MY GOD, That was FUNNY....


....THAT....Made me laugh out loud....a few times...
My favorite interpretation is The Candle bit...
"Plus, it makes him look scary"......See???? You can't hear me, but I laughed out loud just typing in "It makes him look scary"....!!!!!

Thank You Moyboy.....That was the best........
brokenarrow>
I know someday you will have a beautiful Life


Jason
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • JDE-PJJDE-PJ Posts: 721
    wicca
    9/15/99 10:54 PM
    Re: EDDIE VEDDER IS A VAMPIRE


    Ok, I'm scrolling through the posts and oh, here's the song of the day...and it's about a vampire?! (Am I on the Savage Garden board?) Thanks moyboy - that was candle-of-thought-worthy! What a way to end the all-time favorite "fuck you" record. Animal - fuck you; Daughter - whispered fuck you; WMA - fuck you authority; Blood - really really fuck you; RVM - fuck you in my dust; Leash - I SAID FUCK YOU! Tell 'em Eddie!





    JDE-PJ
    9/16/99 01:56 AM
    Eddie Munster!


    Yes Moyboy, you nailed it on the head the irrefutable proof, that shows us his true self.
    So you know how in some stories about Ed they say he said he was a child actor, or so I here well this is the proof he starred on the Munsters and was so convincing as little Eddie that he joined a cult and became convinced he was a Nightwalker, then he left the cult and assumed another identity of rock Icon but in his lyrics he occasionaly slips up and let's us fans in on his true identity!

    Ah now I understand the true meaning of BLOOD!



    I know someday you will have a beautiful life

    Jason




    CandleOfThought
    9/16/99 07:00 AM
    Re: INDIFFERENCE


    First I have to tell Moyboy that I found his vampire theory absolutely BRILLIANT. As an Anne Rice Fan, I will forever chastise myself for not having figured out that one. But since that will from now on become the OFFICIAL undisputed interpretation, I have to use this last chance to express what the song used to mean to me... ;)

    I believe that the *story* behind this song is irrelevant, that it *doesn't* tell a story, that it merely describes a state of mind. 'Black' comes to my mind with this song; I sense the same "turned my world to black" emotion, the "why do I sear" numb attitude towards the world. Not that I think that there's a lost love situation behind it (as I said the story is irrelevant) but when I identified myself with the character in 'Black', I also felt myself totally in tune with "indifference".

    Don't we all feel like that sometimes? Like we don't have nothing to look forward to, like everything looks grey, sounds monochordic, tastes ashen, feels rough and smells sultry. Sometimes for a very specific reason, but often for a multitude of small reasons, mixed up in a nondescript feeling that you just can't point to a cause. And sometimes you don't fight it, instead you choose to plunge in it and indulge in self-pity, and that just amplifies the feeling of hopelessness

    To me, it was just one of those days when Eddie felt depressed and he decided to express it as a way of catharsis, of dealing with it, just poured and emptied his gloomy mood over the words of this song. And probably it helped him to get over it, to see the futility in it. At least to me it always does: I delve in my dark feelings, in my masochistic reverie, for some time, let it all out, ponder it, until it makes me feel clearer and relieved, and get on.

    Of course, only Vedder could put it into brilliant poetry like this. The opening line (the match in the darkness) is striking like none, and the succession of images is staggering. And only Pearl Jam could replicate the feeling in sound this way. When I put this song on, I can actually feel an ominous and oppressive presence around me, the air becomes viscous and sweltering as I breathe it, and the tension builds up in the room until I actually feel the urge to replace it with the scream the song suggests in the end ("I will scream my lungs out till it fills this room"). In fact, I often feel the need, after listening to this song, to go back a few tracks to RVM to cleanse my heart.

    And yet this song is also a promise to keep fighting, to keep trying to make a difference, even if only to oneself. From the first chorus on, it becomes an oath to stay true and faithful to one's principles, despite all adversity. And in that it is also mesmerizing, in all its images of self-sacrifice: the candle burning the arm, the sun burning the eyes, the poison, all of it; such exquisite beauty in the soul, even plunged in such poignant despair. The sacrifice of the people of East Timor invades my thoughts once more, but I will spare you to that.

    Music is emotion, and emotion doesn't need facts or stories behind it. Just let yourselves go in the blur...


    *** CandleOfThought ***
    "Shower the people you love with love, show them the way you feel"




    cheekywombat
    9/16/99 09:34 AM
    To me, this song sums up the whole album...


    "Vs." - just about every song on this album is about adversity & rebellion. Rising up to face one's "enemies", so to speak. This song is about just that, sorta...taking on the everyday drudgery that life can so often deal us. Its difficult to understand what Vedder is trying to convey for many of us, because most, if not all of us aren't artists like he is...we have so called "lives" on which we depend...jobs that take us from day to day...routine....bills....stress..."Hell"...

    In this song, Ed is simply saying that instead of letting the sham of today's media controlled "nobody move & nobody gets hurt", "ordinary" life get you down, try to live a little...For example:
    "Stare the sun down" - Its a well known fact that artists have been referring to sunshine & rain for centuries..they are metaphores for "good times" & "bad times"...right? What he's saying here is he'll ignore the crap (eyes go blind) & enjoy life no matter what...

    "Swallow poison" - he's talking about alcohol & drugs here folks...to numb the pain..I mean c'mon...why do people drink & take drugs?? He's saying that amongst all the treachery, dishonesty & evil in the world...where's the harm in "poisoning" himself...how much difference does it make anyway?

    A great tune, which really truly is about apathy in the face of all aridity that our society has to offer..."fuck it....enjoy."

    Sure, its just a song & obviously must be taken with a sarcastic grain of salt..I mean, everyone cares, at least a little, right?







    PJMom
    9/16/99 1:35 PM
    Re: Eddie Munster!


    Thank you thank you thank you for the laughs...I needed that. The Vedder is a Vampire...LOVE IT!
    I know someday you will have a beautiful Life


    Jason
  • VEDHEAD27VEDHEAD27 Posts: 3,091
    LOL! Awesome post. Thanks JDE-PJ. Yeah, I'm actually sitting here listening to MSG 1 in complete fuckin celebration of that dvd being released...once Indifference came on I thought to myself, "Is there even a thread about this song here?"...well there is now. Thank you.

    This song is amazing and the MSG 1 version with Ben Harper captures all it's intensity, and then some! INCREDIBLE!

    I definitely agree with this posted by brokenarrow ~

    "emotionally, this song makes feelings just spill out over the top, such passion"

    Indeed!
    ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤

    "Lo√e, you know the word
    ...YOU invented it!" ~ E√

    ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤
    ...::STONE--YOU--OWN!::...
    ••••••••••••••••••••••••••••
  • JDE-PJJDE-PJ Posts: 721
    RrVwMirror
    1/22/01 08:04 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    I hope everybody reads this thread......it is a classic!

    I let my music take me where my heart wants to go....
    ~C.S.




    StephK10
    1/22/01 08:09 AM
    thanks, rearviewmirror!


    i love this song so much.... and reading these interpretations was pretty helpful... especially the vampire one. ;)



    'why can't we overcome this wall/well, maybe it's just because i didn't know you at all' j.b.





    hedonist
    1/22/01 09:15 AM
    classic


    Sure is good to read moyboy's vampire theory again :)

    Loved all the interps...and I can never resist Candle's words.....

    Speaking of being unable to resist...I could completely lose myself in this bassline alone...hands down, one of most sensual songs in the PJ catalog.....






    share
    1/22/01 1:33 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    such a beautiful song

    thanks for bringing back the infamous post !

    now we just need the link to that silly ev vampire site - though it was nuts first
    time round - now i just need a chuckle

    :)

    "so glad to see you, i've missed you so much"




    Overboard
    1/22/01 2:08 PM
    an explanation of grunge songwriting


    One of the concepts of "grunge" or whatever you wanna call it
    is that the meaning, the story, the plot is often irrelivent... it is the feeling and the melody conveyed to the listener. Not does each line talk about the same thing. This is actually a much more difficult form of songwriting, because writers have to connect many disacosiated thoughts and string them togeather with music and often the chorus...






    intoyourgarden
    1/22/01 2:16 PM
    Re: an explanation of grunge songwriting


    so it is a more complex thought dressed up as "nothing" unless you really study it?

    "This is my fucking trip and I don't have to listen to anyone else's." Neil Young




    wicca
    1/22/01 6:04 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    One of my all-time favorite SOTD posts - I've been waiting on this one to make it's return! Thanks so much for having the foresight to save these RrVw! (I still laughed out loud at broken laughing out loud - "it makes him look scary" - hehehe.)

    dawnie




    gardenofstone13
    1/22/01 6:12 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    for some reason, this song always brings me to tears...everytime...






    RedSun
    1/22/01 6:34 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    truly, truly one of pj's all-time bests. just thinking about the song brings back emotions and floods my head with memories--both good and bad.

    i know that there have been a lot of posts that have talked about the song being optimistic, kind of like a rallying cry to keep pushing in the face of adversity. however, i cannot escape the thought that this song, more than perhaps any other in the catalog, is just sad and depressing as hell. sure eddie will keep taking punches and screaming, but he returns every time to the conclusion that it doesn't make any difference. i believe the title of the song is telling. it seems to be a conclusion that is arrived at through the logic built up in the song--that even though we can try and try, it really doesn't make any difference in the end. to this the only appropriate response is indifference, to not care, to not get caught up in ups and downs of life.

    the only real satisfaction i can derive from this song is to not really focus on the meaning behind the words but to instead try to immerse myself in the song. then it is a catharsis, sort of like the ancient greeks who would go watch the most poignant tragedies in order to cleanse themselves of sadness. this is how i choose to approach this song, to revel in the beauty of the bass line and the tortured emotion of eddie's voice. then i can leave vs. and think that it's really not so bad after all. but taken literally, my god, i think this song would make me want to blow my head off.








    jamearl
    1/22/01 8:24 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    never quitting, never giving up,
    at the time of the album, 5 against 1, the message was that the band would not stop or fall to the corporate (mtv, ticketmaster, etc) powers & that they "not change directions or change my mind"
    it was a great closer in indio, when all along shoes were being thrown at them, as ed sang he will keep on taking punches, a boot hits the mike, until our will grows tired...
    one of my top 7 all time pj songs...






    ballsdeep
    1/22/01 8:31 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    i think it is about not giving up no matter what...but...sometimes you just cant achieve what you want to

    i wish i was as fortunate as fortunate as eddie




    brokenarrow
    1/22/01 11:35 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE



    :-)

    Dammit that Moyboy made me laugh!
    Thanks RrVw.....

    Hey guys! It's so nice to see some folks adding their interpretations to these.....~~~~~~~~~!







    thelateman80
    1/22/01 11:38 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    I was just listening to that a while ago on the Berlin boot, great song. Good concert closer!






    PJMom
    1/23/01 00:03 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    A classic board moment! Eddie Munster, Ed is a vampire, great interps., smiles.

    These are great to read again RrVwMIRROR. :)

    _______

    Times spent wasted are not wasted times.





    RrVwMirror
    1/23/01 07:44 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    :-)
    Big smile from ear to ear today.....

    so good to see that people are adding their interps to these!!!

    so good to see WICCA again!!!!

    :-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-)

    I let my music take me where my heart wants to go....
    ~C.S.




    Maite
    1/23/01 08:12 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    How much difference, does it make?

    "and now my bitter hands, craddle broken glass"




    riley1223
    3/27/01 10:12 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    this is my song of the day :) (since i'm wearing it out on the T.O boot) so i'm bumping it up to share
    just because
    besides the vampire theory cracks me up.






    JDE-PJ
    5/31/01 2:50 PM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    Here you go Hed, at least the first part of moyboy's theory, which I whole heartily agree with, Eddie is really Eddie Munster, a blood sucking night crawler! ;)

    I know someday you will have a beautiful life

    Jason




    oo
    7/26/01 00:11 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    I have nothing meaningful to add, but this is song is so breathtaking for me right now. :)

    shave my poodle




    Yeild2PearlJam
    7/26/01 00:22 AM
    Re: SOTD: ....INDIFFERENCE


    i second every wonderful thing that was said about this song. I LOVE IT! AND MY BIGGEST DREAM IS TO SEE THIS SONG LIVE ONE DAY... THAT WILL BE THE MOST AMAZING DAY OF MY LIFE!

    "Little time in this life sometimes it seems
    twilight world, dark living dream..." *Mystery
    I know someday you will have a beautiful Life


    Jason
  • great song :D best off vs
    Don't let me know we're invisible
    Don't let me know we're invisible
    We could dance, dance, dance thru' the fire
    Dance, dance, dance thru' the fire
  • Indifference is a touching, intriguing song.
    After reading all the posts, I see different
    views from those I have. To me, this song
    is about being a rock star.
    Have a listen with that perspective,
    perhaps you'll consider it a possibility.
    And it obviously does
    make a huge difference to us all.
    Pearl Jam rules.
  • I will light a match this mornin', so I won't be alone
    ( Even though he's lying beside his g/f he feels alone)
    Watch as she lies silent, for soon night will be gone
    ( The only time she's silent is when she's sleeping, when she wakes the arguing will replace their silence)
    Oh, I will stand arms outstretched, pretend I'm free to roam
    (He's put up such a rigid box around his reality that he thinks he can only "pretend" to be free again)
    Oh, I will make my way through one more day in Hell
    (He hates the relationship, to him the situation feels like a catch 22, he feel's like he's being imprisoned in Hell with no escape)
    How much difference does it make
    (He's asking himself "how much am I missing, how different would life be if I ended this relationship- How much different is that Hell from this Hell?")
    How much difference does it make, yeah


    I will hold the candle til it burns up my arm
    (The candle is the relationship and he's saying he knows he's fucking himself, but he doesn't have the will power to put an end to it even though it's killing him)
    Oh, I'll keep taking punches until their will grows tired
    (He knows he won't end the relationship for fear the hell of being alone would be worse, so he's saying that he's going to stay in his "comfort zone" and hope someday his unhappiness (the punches) will fade)
    Oh, I will stare the sun down until my eyes go blind
    (All of these lines are thoughts in his head and at this point he's ending the conversation with himself and has decided he will ignore the problem even though he knows it's not the right thing to do)
    Hey, I won't change direction and I won't change my mind
    (He's giving into his insecurities and admitting he's not going to risk change)
    How much difference does it make
    Mmmm, how much difference does it make
    How much difference

    I'll swallow poison until I grow immune
    (I'll put up with my unhappiness)
    I will scream my lungs out til it fills this room
    (I'll lie to myself until I convince myself)
    How much difference (2X)
    How much difference does it make (2X)
  • I think it's about someone with a handicap. At first, he is describing lighting the match so he won't be alone - because he's always feeling alone with his handicap. Then he watches her shortly because sometimes people are most beautiful when they sleep - and this is his last chance before she wakes. Standing arms outstretch and pretending to roam may mean he is confined to a wheelchair and it is just him pretending to be able to do everything like everyone else...uninhibited by the mechanism to which he is attached. Each day in the wheelchair or with the handicap is just another day in hell, but how much difference does it make to keep on living?

    I think the following two verses show how he will do anything to put up a fight against his handicap or illness, even if it means burning up his arms, going blind, or drinking poison to become immune...but in the end, what is the difference? I can sense the emotion in the song, especially the lines about drinking the poison - because nothing else has worked, so he will go to desparate measure to make it all go away so he can get on living like a normal person. It's just the fighting spirit that won't give up and will do whatever it takes.

    I too love this song, no matter what it means.
  • Aaah, a blast from the past - I remember that original thread with the vampire theory. Thanks for posting it again, it gave me a chuckle and reminded me of the silliness of the old days, back when I was plain old 'Purple'...

    *Shakes herself out of yearning for the good ole days because she's not actually a grizzled 100 year old*

    Indifference is a majestic song. Love it.
  • From ages 4 till 18 I was a dancer and took many different types of dance classes such as tap, jazz, ballet, hip hop, lyrical, modern, etc.

    Anyway, I have always wanted to do a lyrical dance to that song. It is just so... perfect... so.... emotional that it is a dancer's dream. Too bad most dancers probably have never heard of that song.

    ~How much difference does it make?
    "Mona Lisa must have had the highway blues you can tell by the way she smiles."
  • Man I hate that song :)

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  • :D This post is SO OLD!

    Friggen' Moyboy, that was such a great interpretation of this tune...
    I'll need to let him know it was resurrected!




    Purple!! Holy Crap!!!!! You need to write to me and let me know how you're doing. Wasn't I supposed to kick someone's ass for you a long time ago? ....or was that someone else? ;):D


    Tuesday while driving home from work, this song, with Alive preceding it, was played from Matt Cord's iPod. It was such a treat hearing it on the radio, and here I had forgotten all about the candle bit and ed wanting to look scary. :p
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