In other news...

fife

so hard to keep track of all the other important news that is happening in the world right now.  just wanted to share some other things that are happening right now.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/05/18/climate/antarctica-ice-melt-climate-change.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Halifax2TheMax

Would Hillary Clinton have allowed the increased release of methane gas on oil and gas drilling sites on public lands?

fife

Halifax2TheMax said:

Would Hillary Clinton have allowed the increased release of methane gas on oil and gas drilling sites on public lands?

To be honest I don't know.  are you asking that question as a response to article?

Halifax2TheMax

fife said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Would Hillary Clinton have allowed the increased release of methane gas on oil and gas drilling sites on public lands?

To be honest I don't know.  are you asking that question as a response to article?

I'm asking that question because elections matter. I don't think Hillary would withdraw from the Paris Climate Talks, allow more methane releases or gut the EPA and remove fact based science from its website, for starters.

PJ_Soul

Halifax2TheMax said:

fife said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Would Hillary Clinton have allowed the increased release of methane gas on oil and gas drilling sites on public lands?

To be honest I don't know.  are you asking that question as a response to article?

I'm asking that question because elections matter. I don't think Hillary would withdraw from the Paris Climate Talks, allow more methane releases or gut the EPA and remove fact based science from its website, for starters.

Definitely not. Hillary would not have been much different than Obama.

brianlux

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

fife

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

I think we should say that our politicians are not going to solve this problem on their own; however I do believe that the government can be a major player to have corporation do their part. 

PJ_Soul

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

Go Beavers

Halifax2TheMax said:

fife said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Would Hillary Clinton have allowed the increased release of methane gas on oil and gas drilling sites on public lands?

To be honest I don't know.  are you asking that question as a response to article?

I'm asking that question because elections matter. I don't think Hillary would withdraw from the Paris Climate Talks, allow more methane releases or gut the EPA and remove fact based science from its website, for starters.

Looks like Benghazi and emails were more important. 

fife

Question: 

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

the challenge to this is would those corporation be bought by the big oil companies we have now as they have alot of money?

PJ_Soul

fife said:

Question: 

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

the challenge to this is would those corporation be bought by the big oil companies we have now as they have alot of money?

The big oil companies will certainly go in that direction as alternative energy grows, but I think new or current alternate energy corps will grow too. And I think most of them will end up influencing government just like oil companies do now, because people generally suck when money is involved.

fife

PJ_Soul said:

fife said:

Question: 

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

the challenge to this is would those corporation be bought by the big oil companies we have now as they have alot of money?

The big oil companies will certainly go in that direction as alternative energy grows, but I think new or current alternate energy corps will grow too. And I think most of them will end up influencing government just like oil companies do now, because people generally suck when money is involved.

so a major question that people always raise when it comes alternative energy is how do you make sure that you grow that industry.  do you give tax incentives?  

jeffbr

fife said:

PJ_Soul said:

fife said:

Question: 

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

the challenge to this is would those corporation be bought by the big oil companies we have now as they have alot of money?

The big oil companies will certainly go in that direction as alternative energy grows, but I think new or current alternate energy corps will grow too. And I think most of them will end up influencing government just like oil companies do now, because people generally suck when money is involved.

so a major question that people always raise when it comes alternative energy is how do you make sure that you grow that industry.  do you give tax incentives?  

That's a really great question, and I think we're still trying to figure that out. I know Obama caught a lot of heat for his attempt to stimulate the alternative energy industry with guaranteed federal loans. I'm not sure where the number stands today, a couple of years ago WaPo was estimating a $2.2B cost to taxpayers for bankruptcies and defaulted loans. With the oil industry fighting against alternative energy research and development it is a tough space to make breakthroughs at scale. It is happening, though. I know Elan Musk just released relatively affordable solar panels for homes. It takes smart people, financial backing, and the ability to continue to hit your head against the wall until you break through. I personally think tax incentives would be a good start.

fife

I think a challenge in getting the government to make it easier for alternative energy to grow is that there are major states that have so many jobs is the coal industry and the oil industry and it will be hard for the senate and the house to pass these things cause of the backlash that they will get at home.   I still think that Trump won the election because of things like saying that he is going to bring back those coal jobs back. 

you have to show those workers that they can have jobs in the new economy to make them ok with losing these old jobs.  but to promise them these things you have to train these workers and that means spending money on education and right now it doesn't look like that will be happening.

brianlux

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

Well, here I am hopping the freight train again,

Yes, alternative energy companies could do much to help but my belief is that what is needed even more is a major change in  how we live. Important changes that would help reduce global warming would include:

-Reduction in consumption of goods leading to reduction in consumption of natural resources
-Production of durable goods rather than throw-away items
-Walkable, bicycle friendly downtown areas and small cities
-Major improvements to mass transit (including, in the U.S., rejuvenation and expansion of railway systems more moving trains!)
-Greatly reduced consumption of cow and dairy products
-Reduced human population
-Huge efforts to reduce pollution of oceans with a moratorium of harvesting life from the sea.  If life in the oceans go, so go we.

fife

brianlux said:

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

Well, here I am hopping the freight train again,

Yes, alternative energy companies could do much to help but my belief is that what is needed even more is a major change in  how we live. Important changes that would help reduce global warming would include:

-Reduction in consumption of goods leading to reduction in consumption of natural resources
-Production of durable goods rather than throw-away items
-Walkable, bicycle friendly downtown areas and small cities
-Major improvements to mass transit (including, in the U.S., rejuvenation and expansion of railway systems more moving trains!)
-Greatly reduced consumption of cow and dairy products
-Reduced human population
-Huge efforts to reduce pollution of oceans with a moratorium of harvesting life from the sea.  If life in the oceans go, so go we.

Hey Brian, question, if we as people do these things but big corporation continue what they are doing, do you believe we can reverse what is happening now to our planet? 

HesCalledDyer

If you haven't seen the documentary Blood on the Mountain, I highly recommend it.  I grew up in this area and I can tell you this doc is accurate as hell!  It's not propaganda by any means.  This shit happened and it still happens to these good, hard-working people.  The coal industry, at least in WV/MD/PA has basically treated its workers like slaves since the industrial revolution.  It's a really excellent narrative on corruption in the corporate & political world.

Speaking of which, I see Don Blankenship got himself in the news yesterday.

brianlux

fife said:

brianlux said:

PJ_Soul said:

brianlux said:

Our politicians are not going to solve this problem.  You can't get to that level without corporate backing and corporations do not thrive on fighting global warming.

Alternative energy corporations would benefit bigly. I think we will see those grow fairly quickly over the next 50 years.

Well, here I am hopping the freight train again,

Yes, alternative energy companies could do much to help but my belief is that what is needed even more is a major change in  how we live. Important changes that would help reduce global warming would include:

-Reduction in consumption of goods leading to reduction in consumption of natural resources
-Production of durable goods rather than throw-away items
-Walkable, bicycle friendly downtown areas and small cities
-Major improvements to mass transit (including, in the U.S., rejuvenation and expansion of railway systems more moving trains!)
-Greatly reduced consumption of cow and dairy products
-Reduced human population
-Huge efforts to reduce pollution of oceans with a moratorium of harvesting life from the sea.  If life in the oceans go, so go we.

Hey Brian, question, if we as people do these things but big corporation continue what they are doing, do you believe we can reverse what is happening now to our planet? 

Yes and no.  Those big corporations do what they do because we support them.  I know we are not going to change how we live overnight but the first step is to start looking at and thinking about how we might do that.  Most of us on places like AMT think about these things but do most people in general?  I'm not so sure.  We would do well to do our homework, become better educated about environment and the ecological sciences, and get the word out about how to lessen our negative impact on the planet.  The next step is to take personal action.  Reduce our consumption in as many ways as possible and definitely give as few of our dollars as possible to the corporations that are the most egregious environmental offenders (they are easily found by a quick internet search).