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Obamas Middle East Policy led to Paris and Brussels?

dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
edited March 2016 in A Moving Train
Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
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New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
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LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
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Post edited by dmaradona10 on
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Comments

  • callencallen Posts: 6,388
    dmaradona10 said:

    Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
    If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

    Obama didn't cause this mess. Really? You willing to take your ass to Syria and fight? Your family? What's your solution?
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    dmaradona10 said:

    Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
    If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

    Who made the documentary? It sounds incredibly biased by your description, any discussion on the rise of ISIS would necessarily start with the Bush administration, and the criticism that they don't say "terrorism" has been debunked to death.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 29,538
    Really so these attacks started happening when Obama came into office ok , how about the previous administration or that does not count ?
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Posts: 36,982
    laughable.
    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Posts: 10,767
    President Obama is to blame for everything

    D'uh

    :anguished:
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    rgambs said:

    dmaradona10 said:

    Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
    If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

    Who made the documentary? It sounds incredibly biased by your description, any discussion on the rise of ISIS would necessarily start with the Bush administration, and the criticism that they don't say "terrorism" has been debunked to death.
    Frontline. It's Public Broadcasting.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    I guess there is no chance for an "honest and civilized" discussion on this with these comments.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • myoung321myoung321 Posts: 2,855
    That was slow.... it took well over 3 hours, to Blame Obama..
    "The heart and mind are the true lens of the camera." - Yusuf Karsh
     


  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,840
    dmaradona10 said:

    I guess there is no chance for an "honest and civilized" discussion on this with these comments.

    Check out this article

    http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/04/the-obama-doctrine/471525/

    I view this very positively. He wants nothing to do with the Middle East.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Posts: 36,982
    dmaradona10 said:

    I guess there is no chance for an "honest and civilized" discussion on this with these comments.

    just because it's such a silly idea, don't you think? did obama start the wars in the middle east? no, he stopped them. how could he possibly be to blame for this mess? I'm not saying it's all on Bush; it's on the US foreign policy of the past several decades. But it sure as hell ain't Obama's fault.
    new album "Cigarettes" out Spring 2025!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    callen said:

    dmaradona10 said:

    Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
    If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

    Obama didn't cause this mess. Really? You willing to take your ass to Syria and fight? Your family? What's your solution?
    Nice Ad Hom attacks. You take everything so personally? I didn't even word this subject as my opinion. Weak sauce.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    Drowned Out said:

    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.

    I put the debate in the form of a question.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • JimmyVJimmyV Posts: 19,171
    Drowned Out said:

    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.

    Well said.
    ___________________________________________

    "...I changed by not changing at all..."
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    HughFreakingDillon said:

    dmaradona10 said:

    I guess there is no chance for an "honest and civilized" discussion on this with these comments.

    just because it's such a silly idea, don't you think? did obama start the wars in the middle east? no, he stopped them. how could he possibly be to blame for this mess? I'm not saying it's all on Bush; it's on the US foreign policy of the past several decades. But it sure as hell ain't Obama's fault.
    Every President has their own foreign policy that effects what happens during their term. It's not unreasonable to discuss whether or not Obamas policy have led to a positive or negative effect. Nobody stated that Obama started terrorism.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    myoung321 said:

    That was slow.... it took well over 3 hours, to Blame Obama..

    You see that symbol at the end of the title. That's called a question mark.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    JimmyV said:

    Drowned Out said:

    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.

    Well said.
    I never said it started in 2008. Your understanding of my statement is too narrow.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • JimmyVJimmyV Posts: 19,171
    dmaradona10 said:

    JimmyV said:

    Drowned Out said:

    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.

    Well said.
    I never said it started in 2008. Your understanding of my statement is too narrow.
    Always possible there is a misunderstanding. But if the claim is that Obama's middle east policy led to Paris and Brussels, that does point the finger at policy which began after 2008, yes?
    ___________________________________________

    "...I changed by not changing at all..."
  • dmaradona10dmaradona10 Posts: 915
    JimmyV said:

    dmaradona10 said:

    JimmyV said:

    Drowned Out said:

    Honest and civilized discussion would have to look at the historical record of terrorism, and it's root causes. None of this began post 2008, nor post 2001. your scope is too narrow.

    Well said.
    I never said it started in 2008. Your understanding of my statement is too narrow.
    Always possible there is a misunderstanding. But if the claim is that Obama's middle east policy led to Paris and Brussels, that does point the finger at policy which began after 2008, yes?

    The first statement on this thread with substance! Yes, I am bringing up Obama's foreign policy, which is different from his predecessor, and effects world events. For better or worse, he seems less reactionary toward terrorism.
    Las Cruces, NM Pan Am Center September 14, 1995
    Albuquerque, NM Tingley Coliseum July 7, 1998
    New York City, NY MSG May 20, 2010
    Eddie Vedder Solo Albuquerque, NM November 9, 2012
    Wrigley Field July 19, 2013
    LA Nov. 23: 24, 2013
    Denver 10-22-14
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,840
    edited March 2016
    I posted a significant article that very specifically highlights his entire foreign policy and view.

    I think he is much more reactive to actual terrorism than his predecessor. Just because we are not in wars does not mean he isn't heavily invested in killing these fuckers.

    Occupation does nothing to fight terrorism and just creates more terrorists.
    Post edited by Cliffy6745 on
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,038
    Obama did it. Got it. More rancid comments. Adios amigos!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,840
    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
    With security provided by a professional fighting force a moderate populace is able to rise up and weed out the extremists. The mistake was thinking this was just a 10 year project. Something like this would take at least one generation such as Germany and Japan.
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 29,538
    BS44325 said:

    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
    With security provided by a professional fighting force a moderate populace is able to rise up and weed out the extremists. The mistake was thinking this was just a 10 year project. Something like this would take at least one generation such as Germany and Japan.
    You say Germany & Japan did we stay there after the war and bring democracy way of life to them or did we leave them to pick up the pieces ?
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    josevolution said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
    With security provided by a professional fighting force a moderate populace is able to rise up and weed out the extremists. The mistake was thinking this was just a 10 year project. Something like this would take at least one generation such as Germany and Japan.
    You say Germany & Japan did we stay there after the war and bring democracy way of life to them or did we leave them to pick up the pieces ?
    You are still there now.
  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,840
    BS44325 said:

    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
    With security provided by a professional fighting force a moderate populace is able to rise up and weed out the extremists. The mistake was thinking this was just a 10 year project. Something like this would take at least one generation such as Germany and Japan.
    There is no possible way a generation long occupation was going to happen, especially with a global economy in tatters.
  • BS44325BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Cliffy6745 said:

    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    And the other option was nation building? How would that have worked after a decade of being there?
    With security provided by a professional fighting force a moderate populace is able to rise up and weed out the extremists. The mistake was thinking this was just a 10 year project. Something like this would take at least one generation such as Germany and Japan.
    There is no possible way a generation long occupation was going to happen, especially with a global economy in tatters.
    Nobody thought it was possible after World War 2 either but sometimes we must do what is necessary.
  • callencallen Posts: 6,388
    dmaradona10 said:

    callen said:

    dmaradona10 said:

    Recently, I watched a PBS documentary on what seemingly looks like a disastrous Obama foreign policy on the Israeli and Palestinian conflict. Pundits criticize his reaction (or lack thereof) to ISIS and terrorist attacks around the world. According to critics, Obama and his staff have a difficult time even using the word "terrorism." What will Obama's foreign policy legacy be?
    If possible, I'm hoping for an honest civilized discussion...

    Obama didn't cause this mess. Really? You willing to take your ass to Syria and fight? Your family? What's your solution?
    Nice Ad Hom attacks. You take everything so personally? I didn't even word this subject as my opinion. Weak sauce.
    Okay true. Need to watch this. Front lines pretty spot on most of the time.

    Now as you've offered up this post, do you feel Obama's responsible? What are your solutions? Do you feel Obama has trouble saying terrorism?
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • callencallen Posts: 6,388
    BS44325 said:

    Obama didn't cause this problem but withdrawal from Iraq absolutely made it worse and his Libyan policy absolutely made it worse.

    What would you have done different?
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
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