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Rice, The Rate of Domestic Violence Arrests Among NFL Players

backseatLover12backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
in A Moving Train
Interesting that no one has started a thread on this hot topic… very interesting.

Last week, the NFL suspended Baltimore Ravens running back Ray Rice for two games over an incident in which Rice was charged with knocking his fiancee (now wife) unconscious during an altercation in a New Jersey casino. Many have criticized this suspension as too lenient, particularly compared to the usual four-game suspension handed down for violating the league’s substance abuse policy. Whether Rice’s punishment is fair touches on a number of delicate issues, including the NFL’s history and role in punishing off-field conduct, as well as its authority and obligations under the collective bargaining agreement.

But Rice’s offense — he pleaded not guilty and instead will participate in a pretrial intervention program — is indicative of a larger pattern in arrests of NFL players; they have been particularly prone to domestic violence arrests.

Although there seems to be an endless stream of stories about NFL player arrests and misconduct, this is largely because there are a lot of NFL players (and they’re famous). At the league’s peak (during training camps), there are about 2,560 players attached to NFL teams (limit 80 each). As I’ll show, arrest rates among NFL players are quite low compared to national averages for men in their age range — but there are some types of crimes that trail the pack significantly.

More at:
http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/the-rate-of-domestic-violence-arrests-among-nfl-players/
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Comments

  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    Interesting that you mention this, bsl, because just the other day I happened on a 49ers/Cowboys game and they were talking about one of the players having been accused of beating his pregnant girlfriend but because it hasn't gone to trial he was allowed to play the game. Doesn't surprise me that there is violence among some of these players because to excel in this sport, aggression is built into their psyche. And yet the article says arrest rates among NFL players are low compared to national averages. Is it because they are they are more shielded and protected from the law? One thing for sure, it's a violent sport. Very American. I won't be surprised if someone jumps down my throat for saying that but its true, isn't it?

    And I know I probably quote George Carlin too often but you all know his baseball vs football routine, right. Fits pretty well, doesn't it? ;-)
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 29,567
    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    Should be unacceptable - or at least consistent - across the board, regardless of profession. This assumes the violence occurred (ie, trial,etc.).

    By the same token, if some regular schlub smacks his woman (or vice versa on the gender side), should that person lose their job as well?

    I heard something the other day about how football fans are more likely to "tolerate" this shit given that it IS a violent sport. But who's playing the sport?

    (oh, and Brian - yup yup...helmet vs. cap says it all :D)
  • unsungunsung Posts: 9,487
    The NFL has known about the video for months but only not when it hit MSM have they done anything.

    Sports in general have become a waste if time to me, really they are just a distraction for the problems we face.
  • KatKat Posts: 4,871
    The NFL has kind of lost me ... this was just another nail in that coffin. They didn't know they have/had women fans too? Not that the men who have mothers, daughters, sisters, nieces, aunts, cousins, etc., shouldn't also be putting pressure on other men to stop domestic violence. I'd like to see more of that. I've seen some but it could be a lot better. Men educating men about this, more peer pressure, would be great. People need to leave each other alone...keep their unwanted hands off each other...it's pretty simple and that also means women shouldn't hit. I'm glad this issue is front and center. Have a good weekend everyone.
    Falling down,...not staying down
  • wall232wall232 Posts: 1,346
    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    NYPJ
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    I don't know a lot about Vick's case but certain questions (for which I don't have answers) do arise in my mind:

    Did Vick really become a different person or is he just trying to get out from under being busted?

    Will Vick be remembered for supporting a weak anti-dog fighting bill or for engaging in cruelty to animals?

    Having become fairly high-profile in the public eye, what kind of affect will/ has his actions have on young fans? Which trait will they mimic?

    The answers could go either way and if they go toward the negative, should Vick have been given a second chance?

    My own opinion is no tolerance for brutality (including no brutality toward those who brutalize).



    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • chadwickchadwick Posts: 21,157
    horse johnson

    brutalize brutal fucking bully punks like this rice clown or the welder at the tractor factory who beats his wife on a regular basis. actually, throw them both off hoover dam. just opinion, i could be wrong, but i'm not :bz
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    chadwick said:

    horse johnson

    brutalize brutal fucking bully punks like this rice clown or the welder at the tractor factory who beats his wife on a regular basis. actually, throw them both off hoover dam. just opinion, i could be wrong, but i'm not :bz

    I can understand the sentiment- the reasoning for feeling that way, Chadwick, but it's just not in my blood. I've been brutalized and yes, the thought of revenge crossed my mind but if I were given the power to retaliate in any fashion I chose, I would not be capable of brutality. To save my life or that of a loved one? Yes, very likely. As a form of revenge? Not possible.

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • backseatLover12backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    brianlux said:

    Interesting that you mention this, bsl, because just the other day I happened on a 49ers/Cowboys game and they were talking about one of the players having been accused of beating his pregnant girlfriend but because it hasn't gone to trial he was allowed to play the game. Doesn't surprise me that there is violence among some of these players because to excel in this sport, aggression is built into their psyche. And yet the article says arrest rates among NFL players are low compared to national averages. Is it because they are they are more shielded and protected from the law? One thing for sure, it's a violent sport. Very American. I won't be surprised if someone jumps down my throat for saying that but its true, isn't it?

    Very American it seems. One thing I wonder is not about the uproar over Rice being thrown out of the NFL but how the law is seemingly OK with what he did to his wife...
  • backseatLover12backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    Kat said:

    The NFL has kind of lost me ... this was just another nail in that coffin. They didn't know they have/had women fans too? Not that the men who have mothers, daughters, sisters, nieces, aunts, cousins, etc., shouldn't also be putting pressure on other men to stop domestic violence. I'd like to see more of that. I've seen some but it could be a lot better. Men educating men about this, more peer pressure, would be great. People need to leave each other alone...keep their unwanted hands off each other...it's pretty simple and that also means women shouldn't hit. I'm glad this issue is front and center. Have a good weekend everyone.

    I don't know how true it is, but I briefly heard that Rice's own mother was a domestic abuse victim, which doesn't surprise me as the trend is cyclical in families. So how does one break the cycle and do the right thing for a change?
  • KatKat Posts: 4,871
    Just came across this. I have another hero. :)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6I1o3PEyVxE
    Falling down,...not staying down
  • backseatLover12backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    Kat said:

    Just came across this. I have another hero. :)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6I1o3PEyVxE

    He's awesome. :)
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 29,567
    edited September 2014
    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    If that's how you feel that's fine remember it's not a right to play a sport and get paid millions it's a privilege and they should be held to high standards of conduct .... There are no deterrents in place send a strong message and you will see a change in the culture in the case of Vick he should of been banned for life , you want a 2nd chance you got it get a job in the real world by being a criminal you've forfeited your privilege at least IMHO ....
    Post edited by josevolution on
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,138
    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,604
    heard on the radio today that the ONLY reason for the indefinite ban was the fact that video evidence has come to light regarding Rice and the other instances of other players behaving the same way arent on video.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 29,567
    http://www.tmz.com/2014/09/12/adrian-peterson-indicted-for-child-abuse/

    Norm posted this on AET i thought we should also take a look at this here , if this is true i say ban him for life no 2nd chance fuck that .....
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,604
    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,138
    mickeyrat said:

    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    Not sure what the question is. A year out is pretty substantial no matter what your earning capacity is in the NFL.

    But one other thing should be taken into consideration. The fines for abuse go right into Roger Goodell's pocket book. It's pure profit for the NFL. That money (as well as all the pink jersey sales that the NFL make during breast cancer awareness month) should go directly to the non-profit organizations that the NFL claim to support.

    The NFL makes a shitload of money pretending that they care about women's breast cancer. It expands their base and they only send a small fraction of profit back to the cause.
  • wall232wall232 Posts: 1,346
    mickeyrat said:

    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    He would have earned enough not to have to worry about working again, he probably already has made more than most of us will in a lifetime in his few playing years. I still don't think he should be banned for life, what he did was despicable but I feel he deserves a second chance after he completes counseling.


    NYPJ
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,604
    wall232 said:

    mickeyrat said:

    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    He would have earned enough not to have to worry about working again, he probably already has made more than most of us will in a lifetime in his few playing years. I still don't think he should be banned for life, what he did was despicable but I feel he deserves a second chance after he completes counseling.


    all too many players wind up broke due to taking bad advice from "advisors" and out right theft from same . Not to mention spending like there is no tomorrow.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,604
    mickeyrat said:

    wall232 said:

    mickeyrat said:

    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    He would have earned enough not to have to worry about working again, he probably already has made more than most of us will in a lifetime in his few playing years. I still don't think he should be banned for life, what he did was despicable but I feel he deserves a second chance after he completes counseling.


    all too many players wind up broke due to taking bad advice from "advisors" and out right theft from same . Not to mention spending like there is no tomorrow.
    Left his senior year on the shelf. No Degree.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • wall232wall232 Posts: 1,346
    mickeyrat said:

    mickeyrat said:

    wall232 said:

    mickeyrat said:

    Jason P said:

    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    That sounds fair to me.

    but his earned living doesnt have to be football. What was he going to do after he retired? RB longevity is brief at best in NFL.
    He would have earned enough not to have to worry about working again, he probably already has made more than most of us will in a lifetime in his few playing years. I still don't think he should be banned for life, what he did was despicable but I feel he deserves a second chance after he completes counseling.


    all too many players wind up broke due to taking bad advice from "advisors" and out right theft from same . Not to mention spending like there is no tomorrow.
    Left his senior year on the shelf. No Degree.
    And who knows how well he really did in school, we all know how star athletes get special treatment.
    NYPJ
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,604
    I think business/economics should be required courses for these guys. At least the basics.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    Kat said:

    Just came across this. I have another hero. :)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6I1o3PEyVxE

    Excellent!! Thanks for posting it, Kat!

    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    wall232 said:

    josevolution said:

    yeah big problem for the NFL & commish who by the way has handle this issue atrociously at best he needs to go ....it should be Zero tolerance you punch your wife girlfriend kids or who ever you should be banned for life .......

    I don't think they should be banned for life. Suspended a year and forced to seek counseling yes, they have a right to make a living. Is there no second chance for Rice? Vick got a second chance, he tortured and brutalized animals and people are running around wearing his jersey today. They are people who fight for murders and rapist to get a second chance, so why can't Rice or anyone else in his position?

    A right to make a living? Get freaking real. You make a living don't you? Do you make 4 million dollars a year? Is that what it takes to "make a living"? Let him shovel shit with the rest of us. I could live my life out comfortably on 1 of his years salary. If he blew it all trying to look like a big shot, that's his problem. He isn't in jail, there's your second chance. Thousands of kids see the example he sets, ZERO TOLERANCE!
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    rg, gotta say I'm with you for the most part but I also get the second-chance side of it. Not necessarily a second chance to rake in a shitload, but to maybe learn from it, become a better person, restore integrity (and not necessarily in the same field or salary range as before, either..if it's all about money, then it's really about nothing).
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    hedonist said:

    rg, gotta say I'm with you for the most part but I also get the second-chance side of it. Not necessarily a second chance to rake in a shitload, but to maybe learn from it, become a better person, restore integrity (and not necessarily in the same field or salary range as before, either..if it's all about money, then it's really about nothing).

    I hear you, but he already has a famous name! Should he become that better person, with his fortune, if he wants to lend it to the effort to curb domestic violence, he should enjoy great success with it.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,042
    Also, these guys are in the spot light and supposedly are role models for kids. Supposedly.

    Here's a dicey friggin' question for you all: In the EXCELLENT James Brown speech Kat posted above , Mr. Brown reminds us that, among other things, we should be aware of our language. So what about the use of the word "bitch" and "bitchin"? I'm often puzzled by that one. When Miles used that word in the title of his great album, "Bitches Brew", it never really bothered me or anyone else as far as I know (accept maybe some of my parents generation- the G.I. generation). What about the its prolific use in rap and hip hop? I'm not a big fan of the genre so maybe there's something I'm missing (willing to be educated, here). Is it OK? Not OK?

    What about calling strangers "bitch"? When that black kid tried to knock me out he spit out the word "bitch" as he was punching me. Under other circumstances, I would have laughed. Bitch? WTF?

    I watched an old Carlin video recently where he was talking about inflammatory words and he said it was all about content, not the word itself. He said there are bad words- they're just words. Its the intent, the context. But sometimes that context is confusing. Back to hip hop again. Seems to me that that border of "not cool" is crossed from time to time- but what do I know? Educate me, ya'll.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    Yeah, you know I love and respect Carlin - in fact, I was so eager to respond to your third paragraph I totally missed the last one - and what I initially wrote spoke to both context and intent. After previewing, backspaced post-haste! ...but dig we see this similarly.

    As for Miles...doubt he was looking for trouble with that title. Dude's music never struck me that way, guessing you too.

    Plus, "bitchin" is kind of an 80s stoner thing :D

    Bitch though, often hurled.
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