Sometimes when I read some of the hateful, spiteful posts on some of the threads on some of the forums here I get to feeling very depressed and hopeless. If we can't have be civil to our fellow fans on a forum based around a band that has done so much to promote civility, that has spoken out against hatred, that has championed the idea of working together, then what chance is there for this ailing world? I suppose I hope for too much, but I won't give in to the hate. I still believe in peace and I still think the world of this band and the majority of it's fans.
I don't see it that way at all. What I see is that some people on the 'Imagine that...' thread thought that they could dictate the terms of the discussion, and got upset when they failed. They weren't upset with certain posters trying to excuse and justify Israel's latest massacre of thousands of Palestinians - that was perfectly acceptable to them, because it played into their own lazy narrative which conveniently pretended that 'both sides are to blame', thereby allowing them to preach about 'love', and 'open-mindedness', and 'egos', and the need for 'understanding', while completely failing to grasp the reality of the situation in the occupied territories.
Thousands of people under occupation were being massacred by the fourth largest military in the World - a military given 100% support by the U.S government - their government - and yet they thought they could get away with dismissing the one-sided nature of the conflict by setting the framework for the discussion within boundaries that completely failed to appreciate or consider the basic truths of what was actually happening, and whilst completely disregarding the historical and political context.
Fortunately, for those people who were genuinely interested in the issue, they failed. Though I didn't see any evidence of any hatred. That's an exaggeration which reeks of pettiness. I did see a fair degree of annoyance and frustration though. Many people chose to address the real issues and to find concrete, constructive courses of action to take with which to protest the slaughter. It's perfectly understandable that they would get frustrated with other posters patronising them, and criticising them, and preaching to them that they should drop their anger and do nothing instead - all in the name of some one-eyed interpretation of Eddie Vedder's statement at the top of the page.
So many times I read posts on these forums that read like verbal bloodshed. Other times they read like gifts given freely. We all decide how we choose to respond to our fellow fans here.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I've definitey bristled at how some comments come across, but mostly just in the moment; off the board I may give further thought to the content of certain posts but won't / can't allow the heat or animosity of that time to have a greater or negative effect. It's just not worth it.
I don't want to dismiss information simply because of how it was conveyed...I've done so - it's tough not to - but am trying to get around that.
The given-freely gifts you mention? Now THOSE are worth the effort of holding onto.
When we post something here or anywhere, only we know truly what our intention is and the sense in which we are trying to communicate. So tone is important. If someone continuously posts in an antagonistic, argumentative fashion, it becomes harder for the reader to see through that tone and fully appreciate the substance of the message. And, at some point, it begins to seem like the argument itself, regardless of the topic, is what is really important. The need to one up the other guy, to get the last word, to "win". I think in any true discussion that attitude is damaging to someone's cause.
.i prefer even to get stoned and dream peace than do prapaganda
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
BB, what happened in Amsterdam? I never made it to the bars when I was there but the people and city itself were cool as hell.
Fucken some swedes we're hanging by me and dimi and getting a little "to close" if u know what I mean lol. Then my buddy started to burn 1 and the swede asks for some. Buddy gives it to him, guy takes 1 fucken puff and miss Debbie downer security tells him to put it out. In which I replied,"this is Amsterdam, right?" As for the rest of the story, I'll let dimi take care of it. Since it involved him hahhahahahaha. Let's just say dimi has groupies following him around from both sexes! Must be cause he's Greek! Lol
BB, what happened in Amsterdam? I never made it to the bars when I was there but the people and city itself were cool as hell.
Fucken some swedes we're hanging by me and dimi and getting a little "to close" if u know what I mean lol. Then my buddy started to burn 1 and the swede asks for some. Buddy gives it to him, guy takes 1 fucken puff and miss Debbie downer security tells him to put it out. In which I replied,"this is Amsterdam, right?" As for the rest of the story, I'll let dimi take care of it. Since it involved him hahhahahahaha. Let's just say dimi has groupies following him around from both sexes! Must be cause he's Greek! Lol
Don't keep us hanging, Dimi! We want the whole story! LOL!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
BB, what happened in Amsterdam? I never made it to the bars when I was there but the people and city itself were cool as hell.
Fucken some swedes we're hanging by me and dimi and getting a little "to close" if u know what I mean lol. Then my buddy started to burn 1 and the swede asks for some. Buddy gives it to him, guy takes 1 fucken puff and miss Debbie downer security tells him to put it out. In which I replied,"this is Amsterdam, right?" As for the rest of the story, I'll let dimi take care of it. Since it involved him hahhahahahaha. Let's just say dimi has groupies following him around from both sexes! Must be cause he's Greek! Lol
Yikes! Sounds like you both did OK, so if it was a matter of losing a bit of herb, so be it long as you're safe.
BB, what happened in Amsterdam? I never made it to the bars when I was there but the people and city itself were cool as hell.
Fucken some swedes we're hanging by me and dimi and getting a little "to close" if u know what I mean lol. Then my buddy started to burn 1 and the swede asks for some. Buddy gives it to him, guy takes 1 fucken puff and miss Debbie downer security tells him to put it out. In which I replied,"this is Amsterdam, right?" As for the rest of the story, I'll let dimi take care of it. Since it involved him hahhahahahaha. Let's just say dimi has groupies following him around from both sexes! Must be cause he's Greek! Lol
Don't keep us hanging, Dimi! We want the whole story! LOL!
well..one of the 2 guys ,tried to kiss me like 2 times or something..i try to push him away nicely the first time and he came back to me after a few min but his boyfriend caught him when he tried to do it the second time and got angry,+ he was a huge tall dude..and start cursing and yell but the "cheater,said to him.."hey relax,,this is Dimi!!!" and the guy directly calm down..
then we all do a group hug - bro- gay thing whatever that was...hahahahhahahaha
fuckin Amsterdam...at 2012,some old dude,want to shoot me and me yelling ,"Amsterdam is Black"...
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
BB, what happened in Amsterdam? I never made it to the bars when I was there but the people and city itself were cool as hell.
Fucken some swedes we're hanging by me and dimi and getting a little "to close" if u know what I mean lol. Then my buddy started to burn 1 and the swede asks for some. Buddy gives it to him, guy takes 1 fucken puff and miss Debbie downer security tells him to put it out. In which I replied,"this is Amsterdam, right?" As for the rest of the story, I'll let dimi take care of it. Since it involved him hahhahahahaha. Let's just say dimi has groupies following him around from both sexes! Must be cause he's Greek! Lol
Don't keep us hanging, Dimi! We want the whole story! LOL!
well..one of the 2 guys ,tried to kiss me like 2 times or something..i try to push him away nicely the first time and he came back to me after a few min but his boyfriend caught him when he tried to do it the second time and got angry,+ he was a huge tall dude..and start cursing and yell but the "cheater,said to him.."hey relax,,this is Dimi!!!" and the guy directly calm down..
then we all do a group hug - bro- gay thing whatever that was...hahahahhahahaha
fuckin Amsterdam...at 2012,some old dude,want to shoot me and me yelling ,"Amsterdam is Black"...
Yup, that's what happened! Fucken funny shit. )
Wait! Edit Edit Edit-he fucken licked your neck dimi, THAT I remember no doubt )
Sometimes when I read some of the hateful, spiteful posts on some of the threads on some of the forums here I get to feeling very depressed and hopeless. If we can't have be civil to our fellow fans on a forum based around a band that has done so much to promote civility, that has spoken out against hatred, that has championed the idea of working together, then what chance is there for this ailing world? I suppose I hope for too much, but I won't give in to the hate. I still believe in peace and I still think the world of this band and the majority of it's fans.
Don't let the haters win, Brian. Perhaps take a break when the toxicity makes you sick. But don't ever quit. We're bigger than that and we'll carry on the peace message.
Online petitions are quite possibly the most useless thing ever.
Probably so. I sign them figuring it only takes a small amount of time and I hope they do some tiny bit of good, but signing them not leave me with a feeling of accomplishment.
Agreed. I went through my "petition" phase, but it comes to a point of actualization that it really changes nothing. I've actually pushed through to see and find out results of petitions. They stop dead, even when they meet their quota. But hey, if it makes you feel good. In addition to that, do something actually useful in helping other people. Listening. Understanding. Advocating. Actually leaving your computer and actually engaging with non-profits, victims, real people in the community. That's doing something.
I'm not a hippie giving people flowers, I've been active for years in several campaigns. I've seen what works and doesn't. Signing petitions doesn't really do any cause justice.
I've definitey bristled at how some comments come across, but mostly just in the moment; off the board I may give further thought to the content of certain posts but won't / can't allow the heat or animosity of that time to have a greater or negative effect. It's just not worth it.
I don't want to dismiss information simply because of how it was conveyed...I've done so - it's tough not to - but am trying to get around that.
The given-freely gifts you mention? Now THOSE are worth the effort of holding onto.
I've said this in the other thread. If you cannot treat me with respect, don't expect any in return. As for the validity of posts, even if they're "factual", the use of disrespect automatically shoots down any validity in what one writes. Because that attitudes speaks volumes louder. I won't deal with that. If you choose to overlook that, kudos to you hedonist. But personally, I think people should have more self-respect and self-love rather than choose to overlook how people treat each other on here and in the real world. (not saying that you don't!, was not meant for you, personally).
I don't overlook it (hard to!), I just try not to dwell on it.
And, I've chimed in on the in-fights here and there, but figure most folks do / have done a pretty good job clarifying and standing up for themselves. Letting them do so doesn't mean I don't love or respect myself.
I don't overlook it (hard to!), I just try not to dwell on it.
And, I've chimed in on the in-fights here and there, but figure most folks do / have done a pretty good job clarifying and standing up for themselves. Letting them do so doesn't mean I don't love or respect myself.
True. People need to take care of themselves, just as much hate should be called out.
When we post something here or anywhere, only we know truly what our intention is and the sense in which we are trying to communicate. So tone is important. If someone continuously posts in an antagonistic, argumentative fashion, it becomes harder for the reader to see through that tone and fully appreciate the substance of the message. And, at some point, it begins to seem like the argument itself, regardless of the topic, is what is really important. The need to one up the other guy, to get the last word, to "win". I think in any true discussion that attitude is damaging to someone's cause.
I fully agree.
Please, Pearl Jam, consider a Benaroya Hall vinyl reissue!
Sometimes when I read some of the hateful, spiteful posts on some of the threads on some of the forums here I get to feeling very depressed and hopeless. If we can't have be civil to our fellow fans on a forum based around a band that has done so much to promote civility, that has spoken out against hatred, that has championed the idea of working together, then what chance is there for this ailing world? I suppose I hope for too much, but I won't give in to the hate. I still believe in peace and I still think the world of this band and the majority of it's fans.
Don't let the haters win, Brian. Perhaps take a break when the toxicity makes you sick. But don't ever quit. We're bigger than that and we'll carry on the peace message.
I've often quote these words by Neil Young:
"Love and only love will endure Hate is everything you think it is. Love and only love will break it down, Love and only love."
I still believe that!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I am sorry I did not get a chance to post on the Gaza thread before it got closed. But the title of this thread attracted me because it the song was made popular by Elvis Costello, who chose to divest, not play a murderous state 4 years ago, he didn't wait until hell on earth visited (yet again) a people in the biggest open air jail cell on earth.
I understand your sentiment brianlux, I do, but what Brynzie and Eddie were and are trying to say with lots of passion and yes, anger, is that this has to stop. You can be angry and passionate about peace, sometimes nothing can change us but disgust or desperation. Aren't Americans sick to know and see what is being done with their tax dollars? What your representatives are voting for and supporting? I read that the majority of Americans do not support America's foreign policy regarding israel. Then why are they getting 2 million dollars a day?
Let me pose this as peacefully as possible, Americans, I ask you why are your representatives sending money over to kill us, to maim and torture us, to literally decapitate our children, to basically wipe us off this planet?
If what you have been seeing does not make you angry, does not make you use whatever platform you have, whether it be a stage, a forum, a pen and paper, and do something to make this stop and never happen again, then there will never be peace for a lot of us and no there is nothing funny about that.
Comments
They weren't upset with certain posters trying to excuse and justify Israel's latest massacre of thousands of Palestinians - that was perfectly acceptable to them, because it played into their own lazy narrative which conveniently pretended that 'both sides are to blame', thereby allowing them to preach about 'love', and 'open-mindedness', and 'egos', and the need for 'understanding', while completely failing to grasp the reality of the situation in the occupied territories.
Thousands of people under occupation were being massacred by the fourth largest military in the World - a military given 100% support by the U.S government - their government - and yet they thought they could get away with dismissing the one-sided nature of the conflict by setting the framework for the discussion within boundaries that completely failed to appreciate or consider the basic truths of what was actually happening, and whilst completely disregarding the historical and political context.
Fortunately, for those people who were genuinely interested in the issue, they failed. Though I didn't see any evidence of any hatred. That's an exaggeration which reeks of pettiness. I did see a fair degree of annoyance and frustration though. Many people chose to address the real issues and to find concrete, constructive courses of action to take with which to protest the slaughter. It's perfectly understandable that they would get frustrated with other posters patronising them, and criticising them, and preaching to them that they should drop their anger and do nothing instead - all in the name of some one-eyed interpretation of Eddie Vedder's statement at the top of the page.
I don't want to dismiss information simply because of how it was conveyed...I've done so - it's tough not to - but am trying to get around that.
The given-freely gifts you mention? Now THOSE are worth the effort of holding onto.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Been digging into some of the music that connects us...that I think connects us.
It's a thread, at least.
Watching the SVT version of Given to Fly, caught myself smiling.
"still give your love, just give it away"
(and never apologize for doing so
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
"Given to Fly", yes, Hedonist!
Amsterdamn!!
but his boyfriend caught him when he tried to do it the second time and got angry,+ he was a huge tall dude..and start cursing and yell
but the "cheater,said to him.."hey relax,,this is Dimi!!!"
and the guy directly calm down..
then we all do a group hug - bro- gay thing whatever that was...hahahahhahahaha
fuckin Amsterdam...at 2012,some old dude,want to shoot me and me yelling ,"Amsterdam is Black"...
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Wait! Edit Edit Edit-he fucken licked your neck dimi, THAT I remember no doubt
D,I knew I could slip a Duece Bigalo reference in somewhere,sorry it wasn't in the prostitution thread.
I'm not a hippie giving people flowers, I've been active for years in several campaigns. I've seen what works and doesn't. Signing petitions doesn't really do any cause justice.
And, I've chimed in on the in-fights here and there, but figure most folks do / have done a pretty good job clarifying and standing up for themselves. Letting them do so doesn't mean I don't love or respect myself.
"Love and only love will endure
Hate is everything you think it is.
Love and only love will break it down,
Love and only love."
I still believe that!
"Dream the dreams of other men… You'll be no ones rival."
Take a break from the war and fire this up.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I understand your sentiment brianlux, I do, but what Brynzie and Eddie were and are trying to say with lots of passion and yes, anger, is that this has to stop. You can be angry and passionate about peace, sometimes nothing can change us but disgust or desperation. Aren't Americans sick to know and see what is being done with their tax dollars? What your representatives are voting for and supporting? I read that the majority of Americans do not support America's foreign policy regarding israel. Then why are they getting 2 million dollars a day?
Let me pose this as peacefully as possible, Americans, I ask you why are your representatives sending money over to kill us, to maim and torture us, to literally decapitate our children, to basically wipe us off this planet?
If what you have been seeing does not make you angry, does not make you use whatever platform you have, whether it be a stage, a forum, a pen and paper, and do something to make this stop and never happen again, then there will never be peace for a lot of us and no there is nothing funny about that.