Who the fuck goes over to their friend's house to watch the game packing heat?
A lot of people who carry live in a state of mind where they expect and plan for random violence to occur anywhere they are. Not a way I'd choose to live.
It's pretty tragic, and telling, that a considerable number of people believe that the answer to a gun massacre like this is for more people to have guns.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Once again - police act as judge, jury and executioner; summarily murdering another black man without due process.
How ironic that you are condemning the police and calling it a "murder" without due process. Where in the article does it even mention the race of the asshole? Why do you not condemn the person that shot 8 people? You are being ridiculous...
...I just assumed bc he wasn't taken alive...
Well, you know, ASSumptions....
Well it's just a shame there weren't anymore guns in the house. Bc as we all know. More guns = more safety!
Hmm, I don't know if there were any gun owners/carriers among the victims. If a few did have a gun, odds are there wouldn't be 8 dead.
Okay, I will bite...what are these odds you speak of?
I don't know the odds specifically of course. Using rational thinking, if any of the 8 were armed there would be a higher chance of survival and they could defend themselves against someone else with a gun. It also means they could all still die, which is the worst case scenario we are already dealing with. I am not a gun advocate or supporter, but this only makes sense.
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
What does that have to do with accusing police of murder who killed an ARMED man who just killed 8 people, barricaded inside a house with victims? The article lacks details, but those victims would not be able to receive help until the threat was eliminated. Killing the guy was most likely the only way to aide any of the survivors. But you're worried about the poor guy who just shot 8 people instead? I'm more concerned about the people he just shot and will likely keep shooting, but hey, that's just me.
By continually reaching so much to make your point stick (like this ridiculous assertion)... you have actually weakened your position by demonstrating you are a person incapable of objective thought when it comes to this issue.
There will be no BLM demonstrations protesting the use of force in this case... unless they can gather a group of members as devout as yourself for cause that is (very unlikely).
Stats are awesome...when they actually apply to the situation.
So you're saying the only logical explanation is the officer was upset all the black men in the room had already been shot?
WI 6/27/98 WI 10/8/00 MO 10/11/00 IL 4/23/03 MN 6/26/06 MN 6/27/06 WI 6/30/06 IL 8/5/07 IL 8/21/08 (EV) IL 8/22/08 (EV) IL 8/23/09 IL 8/24/09 IN 5/7/10 IL 6/28/11 (EV) IL 6/29/11 (EV) WI 9/3/11 WI 9/4/11 IL 7/19/13 NE 10/09/14 IL 10/17/14 MN 10/19/14 FL 4/11/16 IL 8/20/16 IL 8/22/16 IL 08/18/18 IL 08/20/18 IT 07/05/2020AT 07/07/2020
Not sure what arguing with people online has to do with it, but I did think this was a great quote from the article. "If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Stats are awesome...when they actually apply to the situation.
So you're saying the only logical explanation is the officer was upset all the black men in the room had already been shot?
WTF are you even talking about now? How about leaving the police abuse topics in the police abuse thread. This situation has nothing to do with police abuse...It is a discussion about gun violence. Your responses would make sense if the incident being discussed was related to racism...but it was not...
Not sure what arguing with people online has to do with it, but I did think this was a great quote from the article. "If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Knowledge and education...
Many gun owners on this forum have expressed in no uncertain terms that they do not keep their guns and ammunition locked separate from each other in their house. They state that by making their house safe in such a way... they would limit their chances of getting the bad guy whenever they might need to do so.
If people that can log on to a site and write such a thought process down... think of how many simple bastards incapable of turning a computer on leave their pistol sitting there ready for action. The stats do not lie... when you introduce a gun to your home... the chances of someone inside that home getting hurt or killed by a gun increase exponentially.
Not sure what arguing with people online has to do with it, but I did think this was a great quote from the article. "If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Knowledge and education...
Absolutely. When I was single I left guns hidden in a closet with a trigger lock. But after my first kid I got an actual gun safe.
Not sure what arguing with people online has to do with it, but I did think this was a great quote from the article. "If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Knowledge and education...
Many gun owners on this forum have expressed in no uncertain terms that they do not keep their guns and ammunition locked separate from each other in their house. They state that by making their house safe in such a way... they would limit their chances of getting the bad guy whenever they might need to do so.
If people that can log on to a site and write such a thought process down... think of how many simple bastards incapable of turning a computer on leave their pistol sitting there ready for action. The stats do not lie... when you introduce a gun to your home... the chances of someone inside that home getting hurt or killed by a gun increase exponentially.
I must have missed that portion. I remember a discussion a while back where a lot of gun owners were advocating getting a quick access biometric or coded safe for (plenty options under $200), but anyone advocating leaving loaded firearms laying around where a 4-year-old can get to them is an idiot. Introducing cleaning chemicals to a home increases the chance of a child poisoning themselves exponentially as well, that's why you make it inaccessible to children...but they do increase the odds of your home being safe and germ free as well (hopefully you get the analogy). I just read a story about some assholes gagging and duct taping their babies to a wall, so it really doesn't surprise me when abuse or neglect leads to children being hurt in any form or fashion. Unfortunately people can be real shitheads...but how are you going to stop those shitheads from owning firearms...or bathroom cleaners...or duct tape...? I know it is hard for some of you to believe, but the majority of gun owners are safe and have safes. Gun ownership 101- "secure your firearm"!
Edit: I over read your mention of storing guns and ammo together. I actually have no issue with this as long as they are SECURE! In an unlocked nightstand is not secure.
Not sure what arguing with people online has to do with it, but I did think this was a great quote from the article. "If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Knowledge and education...
Many gun owners on this forum have expressed in no uncertain terms that they do not keep their guns and ammunition locked separate from each other in their house. They state that by making their house safe in such a way... they would limit their chances of getting the bad guy whenever they might need to do so.
If people that can log on to a site and write such a thought process down... think of how many simple bastards incapable of turning a computer on leave their pistol sitting there ready for action. The stats do not lie... when you introduce a gun to your home... the chances of someone inside that home getting hurt or killed by a gun increase exponentially.
I must have missed that portion. I remember a discussion a while back where a lot of gun owners were advocating getting a quick access biometric or coded safe for (plenty options under $200), but anyone advocating leaving loaded firearms laying around where a 4-year-old can get to them is an idiot. Introducing cleaning chemicals to a home increases the chance of a child poisoning themselves exponentially as well, that's why you make it inaccessible to children...but they do increase the odds of your home being safe and germ free as well (hopefully you get the analogy). I just read a story about some assholes gagging and duct taping their babies to a wall, so it really doesn't surprise me when abuse or neglect leads to children being hurt in any form or fashion. Unfortunately people can be real shitheads...but how are you going to stop those shitheads from owning firearms...or bathroom cleaners...or duct tape...? I know it is hard for some of you to believe, but the majority of gun owners are safe and have safes. Gun ownership 101- "secure your firearm"!
Edit: I over read your mention of storing guns and ammo together. I actually have no issue with this as long as they are SECURE! In an unlocked nightstand is not secure.
Agree 100%. My firearms are in a safe and also have a trigger lock on them. (I actually take the bolts out of my bolt actions and lock them in a separate place). The only gun that does not have a trigger lock on it is my handgun but I am the only person that has the key to the safe. The handgun is not loaded but does have mags in the safe.
According to ABC, 57% of parents in a NC study have guns locked up. While that is not enough, it is more than half. It also failed to mention if the other 43% even owned guns or not..... http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117480&page=1
According to ABC, 57% of parents in a NC study have guns locked up. While that is not enough, it is more than half. It also failed to mention if the other 43% even owned guns or not..... http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117480&page=1
While it brings up interesting discussion points, the results aren't valid to where you can extrapolate that data out to the public at large.
Who the fuck goes over to their friend's house to watch the game packing heat?
A lot of people who carry live in a state of mind where they expect and plan for random violence to occur anywhere they are. Not a way I'd choose to live.
I'd be more scared of that person than I would of random violence. I only ever met one person (that I know of) who carried a gun with him, and that was just when he was camping, and he completely sketched everyone out because of it. Even his own friends became scared of him. It just isn't something people do up here, and if they do, most would assume they're a gang member or a thug or crazy, because they probably are.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I agree. I was just curious about the number and didn't feel like digging any deeper into more articles. But if it is close to 57% that would surprise me. Everyone I know who is a gun owner keeps them locked up.
I hate the arguement of "well guns should be stored in X manner and then people would be safe." It makes no logical sense, you can tell people about gun safety on the internet, the NRA can put commercials on every TV station about securing guns properly but it isn't going to make anyone do squat shit. Unless some law is made or something then there's no one that's going to change their habits because of instructions from responsible gun owners on the internet. And you can't make a law because what would you do? Have the government go door to door to check for safes? That's not realistic. So what's the answer? It's not to tell people how to be safer, so quit using it as a cop out.
I agree it's totally stupid to say that guns bought for protection should be locked up. If they're locked up with the ammo kept separate then they aren't really for home defense anymore, so what's the point? Gun advocates know that. They just spew that shit as a defense mechanism.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I agree it's totally stupid to say that guns bought for protection should be locked up. If they're locked up with the ammo kept separate then they aren't really for home defense anymore, so what's the point? Gun advocates know that. They just spew that shit as a defense mechanism.
I advocate locking the gun and ammo/magazine in a quick access biometric or coded pistol safe. Those can be accessed in less than 5 seconds if needed. Most gun owners I know do this, if for nothing else, to keep them from being stolen. You are not going to get rid of guns, so educating more on the appropriate storage/usage and possible consequences for being irresponsible is imperative.
I agree it's totally stupid to say that guns bought for protection should be locked up. If they're locked up with the ammo kept separate then they aren't really for home defense anymore, so what's the point? Gun advocates know that. They just spew that shit as a defense mechanism.
I advocate locking the gun and ammo/magazine in a quick access biometric or coded pistol safe. Those can be accessed in less than 5 seconds if needed. Most gun owners I know do this, if for nothing else, to keep them from being stolen.
Are you the one who pretended that tons and tons of gun owners have these things? Or was that someone else? But anyway, even if stored in one of these... so where you do you keep it? Say it's in your den. And you're in bed when someone breaks in. That's going to take a lot more than 5 seconds even if the criminal isn't between you and the safe. Or say you keep it right next to your bed? So the criminal breaks in at night, you wake up, take a bit to come to and realize what's going on, you have to get out of bed, open the safe.... great. Hopefully the criminal didn't start in the bedroom and wake you up by coming in there, because then you're dead before you can even reach your safe. Or say you keep it next to your bed and you would have gotten to it on time because the criminal is still somewhere else in the house. Perfect! But only if you're in bed. If they bust in while you're anywhere but your bedroom, suddenly your chances of reaching that gun in time go back to slim. I personally think that the only sure way to always be protected by your gun is to have it on your person (or under your pillow) at all times (not that I'm recommending that... It's easy for people in a society that isn't obsessed with guns to feel secure without a gun. Of course, they aren't generally terrified of home invasions either, so it's a moot point).
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
When the starting position is "of course you're not going to get rid of guns", then there's hardly any point in continuing the conversation.
True. America's gun problem = America's gun culture. That culture might fade away someday, but it would take probably 200+ years, and probably will never happen just because of the same shit we see now. They're mired in it. It's very unfortunate.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
Wow does it reek of inherent bias.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/shootings/las-vegas-parents-charged-after-4-year-old-shoots-kills-self/
Black men nearly 3 times as likely to die from police use of force
Young black men again faced highest rate of US police killings in 2016
The article lacks details, but those victims would not be able to receive help until the threat was eliminated. Killing the guy was most likely the only way to aide any of the survivors. But you're worried about the poor guy who just shot 8 people instead? I'm more concerned about the people he just shot and will likely keep shooting, but hey, that's just me.
By continually reaching so much to make your point stick (like this ridiculous assertion)... you have actually weakened your position by demonstrating you are a person incapable of objective thought when it comes to this issue.
There will be no BLM demonstrations protesting the use of force in this case... unless they can gather a group of members as devout as yourself for cause that is (very unlikely).
"If people can afford a gun and ammunition, she said, they can afford a safe. Mohler said she encourages parents to ask the parents of their children’s friends whether they have unsecured guns at home."
Knowledge and education...
So you're saying the real villain was the cop who shot the mass murderer wielding a weapon?
If people that can log on to a site and write such a thought process down... think of how many simple bastards incapable of turning a computer on leave their pistol sitting there ready for action. The stats do not lie... when you introduce a gun to your home... the chances of someone inside that home getting hurt or killed by a gun increase exponentially.
Introducing cleaning chemicals to a home increases the chance of a child poisoning themselves exponentially as well, that's why you make it inaccessible to children...but they do increase the odds of your home being safe and germ free as well (hopefully you get the analogy).
I just read a story about some assholes gagging and duct taping their babies to a wall, so it really doesn't surprise me when abuse or neglect leads to children being hurt in any form or fashion. Unfortunately people can be real shitheads...but how are you going to stop those shitheads from owning firearms...or bathroom cleaners...or duct tape...? I know it is hard for some of you to believe, but the majority of gun owners are safe and have safes. Gun ownership 101- "secure your firearm"!
Edit: I over read your mention of storing guns and ammo together. I actually have no issue with this as long as they are SECURE! In an unlocked nightstand is not secure.
The only gun that does not have a trigger lock on it is my handgun but I am the only person that has the key to the safe. The handgun is not loaded but does have mags in the safe.
It also failed to mention if the other 43% even owned guns or not.....
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117480&page=1
Most gun owners I know do this, if for nothing else, to keep them from being stolen.
You are not going to get rid of guns, so educating more on the appropriate storage/usage and possible consequences for being irresponsible is imperative.
But anyway, even if stored in one of these... so where you do you keep it? Say it's in your den. And you're in bed when someone breaks in. That's going to take a lot more than 5 seconds even if the criminal isn't between you and the safe. Or say you keep it right next to your bed? So the criminal breaks in at night, you wake up, take a bit to come to and realize what's going on, you have to get out of bed, open the safe.... great. Hopefully the criminal didn't start in the bedroom and wake you up by coming in there, because then you're dead before you can even reach your safe. Or say you keep it next to your bed and you would have gotten to it on time because the criminal is still somewhere else in the house. Perfect! But only if you're in bed. If they bust in while you're anywhere but your bedroom, suddenly your chances of reaching that gun in time go back to slim. I personally think that the only sure way to always be protected by your gun is to have it on your person (or under your pillow) at all times (not that I'm recommending that... It's easy for people in a society that isn't obsessed with guns to feel secure without a gun. Of course, they aren't generally terrified of home invasions either, so it's a moot point).