Turntable help for upgrading

tempo_n_groove

OK. I am going to purchase a turntable and have been reading tons of info on them. What I haven't found is which entry level TT is easily upgradeable?

I'm looking for an automatic.
I want to be able to change out the tone arm and upgrade.
Be able to change out the platter.
Not sure how difficult changing speeds on a belt driven TT from 33-45 is?
The cartridge can be debated for a long time but I will listen to that too.

I'm planning on getting an older tuner with a phono input.

Not sure about an amp. I'd like to do away with the pre amp though.

Speakers I was thinking older too. I'm sure there are deals to be had out there.

I've looked at the Rega RP1, MMF 2.2, Pro-ject carbon.

I'm comfortable with spending 1g for a TT as long as I can do the above.

All comments welcome.

Thanks

scurtis

I know the guy I chat with at one of the record shops in town swears by the Rega, I don't know enough about TT to offer much.

All I have heard is depending on how anal you are, that over time the automatic TT can throw off your balancing etc...

I don't know that from experience cause none of my TT are automatic, just what I heard.

Have fun.

tempo_n_groove

scurtis said:

I know the guy I chat with at one of the record shops in town swears by the Rega, I don't know enough about TT to offer much.

All I have heard is depending on how anal you are, that over time the automatic TT can throw off your balancing etc...

I don't know that from experience cause none of my TT are automatic, just what I heard.

Have fun.

That's a start! Thank you.

TinAnt

IMO everyone should start with a cheap used system. Get a used working turntable, receiver and speakers in good condition. Spend $200 on this and then work on upgrading components one at a time. The problem with buying a 1k turntable is that you really need a good receiver and speakers to hear the quality of the turntables output, and if you have cheap speakers or a poor amp the money is wasted.

Damiens

I'm in the same process and have decided on the Music Hall 2.2le (I like the red). Basically everything I've read says it's a solid turntable especially with the following upgrades:
Pro-ject Acrylic platter
Q-up (this allows you to have automatic lift on a manual table, and this will work with just about any manual table)
Project Speed Box S (this allows you to switch speed automatically between 33 and 45 without switching the belt, this also would work with other tables)
I'd also recommend a record clamp, check needle doctor you can get a bunch
For cartridge I'm looking between the Ortofon 2M Blue or 2M Bronze depending on how much I can swing

If you're worried about sound I'd probably skip automatic and just get a manual with Q-up, if the amp you get has a good phono input you probably shouldn't need a pre-amp IMHO. Anyways best of luck!

luismota123

I'd recommend what TinAnt mentioned, find a good working used TT, try craiglslist or ebay, upgrade the cartridge, and get it set right and calibrate it right.
http://gizmodo.com/5216965/how-to-calibrate-your-turntable-for-the-best-possible-sound
I'd start there and spend the bulk of the money on a tube pre-amp, decent speaker, and receiver.


I found a good working vintage Sansui from the 80's, upgraded the cartridge, calibrated it and it sounds awesome.

redstuff76

TinAnt said:

IMO everyone should start with a cheap used system. Get a used working turntable, receiver and speakers in good condition. Spend $200 on this and then work on upgrading components one at a time. The problem with buying a 1k turntable is that you really need a good receiver and speakers to hear the quality of the turntables output, and if you have cheap speakers or a poor amp the money is wasted.

^^^^^^


This, is good advice.

Definitely direct drive one IMO.

redstuff76

Also, check your local thrift stores.

I picked up an awesome vintage technics direct drive for 30 buckaroos!

tempo_n_groove

TinAnt said:

IMO everyone should start with a cheap used system. Get a used working turntable, receiver and speakers in good condition. Spend $200 on this and then work on upgrading components one at a time. The problem with buying a 1k turntable is that you really need a good receiver and speakers to hear the quality of the turntables output, and if you have cheap speakers or a poor amp the money is wasted.

Appreciate the advice but if I get a crappy TT won't it ruin the record?

Used amp, tuner and speakers are very easy to come by. It's the use or not of a pre amp that throws me.

I still am curious to what turntable is easiest to upgrade? Example. If I get a RP1 can it be turned into an RP6? Can an MMF 2.2 be upgraded to an 11.1?

A turntable seems to be like a Harley, it's never finished...

Damiens

In terms of amps a lot of the older amps are actually better than the new stuff. It's the idea that an 70's or 80's amp was designed for really one things: to deliver great sound typically out of 2ch with phono source. Modern amps have a million more features, video integration, surround etc. etc. They're awesome, but if you look at the wattage per channel most pale in comparison to an average amp from the 70's or 80's. As we've added features to amps/av receiver we've moved away from awesome sound 2ch sound as the main focus. More features, less focus on awesome sound quality. Older used amps have far left features but can deliver a ton of bang for you buck in terms of the wattage you're sending to the speakers. I'm more of the school of thought of get a great turntable and pair it with a used amp with dedicated phono that sends a ton of power to your speakers. (I agree with everyone on getting good speakers for sure). If the amp has dedicated phono you won't need a preamp.

In terms of upgrading you can buy add'l features for the MMF 2.2 (like a new platter, better cartridge, tonearm, etc. etc.) however you can't make it to a 5.1 or an 11.1 as they use a different plinth design to the table. So it's kind of a yes and no, you can upgrade the 2.2 but the 5.1 and up have distinct design differences that you can't upgrade up to. I"m not sure on the Rega or Projects but I would assume it's likely the same.

tempo_n_groove

^Thanks Damiens.

TinAnt

A Harley would be a poor choice for a new bike rider.

tempo_n_groove

TinAnt said:

A Harley would be a poor choice for a new bike rider.

I've had other turntables and now I want to get something better. Please leave this thread. Thanks.

HesCalledDyer

Damiens offers some really solid advice on vintage amps/receivers. I have the same basic philosophy - that stuff was built with a 2-channel stereo in mind and newer stuff is built around the multi-channel home theatre setup. And that honestly goes for both receivers and speakers.

I have a Technics SU-V98 receiver pushing a pair of Epi M-100's and the sound is incredible. And I spent $70 on the lot!

TinAnt

tempo_n_groove said:

TinAnt said:

A Harley would be a poor choice for a new bike rider.

I've had other turntables and now I want to get something better. Please leave this thread. Thanks.

It doesn't seem like you have had other turntables. Thought I would offer some advise, but it is clear you have your mind made up already.

aurynsdad

Appreciate the advice but if I get a crappy TT won't it ruin the record?

Depends on your definition of crappy. I paid $150 for a vintage Denon TT that many would consider an entry level audiophile TT. I bought it because the cheaper newer TT that I had did not have adjustable vertical tracking force, among other things. Ergo, my modern TT would have been more likely to damage a record than this Denon. Now, compare the Denon that I have with a modern Rega or Project. They will all get the job done, and done well, but one might consider my Denon "crappy" because it's older, is automatic, etc.

Considering that you want automatic and you will be using vintage other equipment, I really think you should consider a vintage TT. Save the money for the cartridge and good headphones and/or speakers.