Back in the 80s, there was a class action lawsuit against those of us who used Union 76 credit cards to pay for gas. The lawsuit stated that we were being overcharged on our cards since many of the 76 gas pumps were dispensing gasoline at a higher rate than the pump showed. I filled out the paper work since that was the only gas i ever bought because I could use a credit card to pay. A couple of years later... i got a check in the mail for 23 cents. Class Action Lawsuits make lawyers rich. That is why you see those lawyers on T.V. trying to get people with bad hip replacements to call them. ... Now, if only Senator Paul were in a seat of power... maybe he could draft amendments to the Patriot Act restricting the use of wholesale data gathering/data mining by the NSA. Too bad he is not a Senator or Congressman... oh, wait...
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Funny, ALL of you take a shot at him for doing something but sit silent on the actions of your President.
... No. We... er... I am saying tha Senator Paul should take advantage of his rare position as a U.S. Law Maker to attack that part of the Patriot Act and the rubber stamping of FISA warrants which allows the NSA to conduct these data mining operations. The Class Action Lawsuit is more of a political grand standing to gain exposure, rather than actually doing something about what he is complaining about. He is going to lose the in court because the Patriot Act and the issues FISA Warrant makes it legal... and he has the power to change the law... if he chooses to do so. He is a U.S. Senator... he knows how Washington works... he knows this won't fly because it is part of the law and covered by the courts... and he know the Ace in the Hole is 'National Security'. It just seems like he is getting his name out there... for 2016. That's all I'm saying. I don't agree with or defend the use of these NSA tactics... didn't like them when President Bush was doing it... still don't like it when President Obama does it. If I were a Senator... I would try to amend the Patriot Act to be specific on who they spy on... not just all of us and see which ones want to blow up the Super Bowl. But, alas... I am just a lowly database administrator and not a U.S. Law Maker.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
So here's the problem I have with Rand Paul. He's definitely more about self promotion than actually doing anything. I heard he was suing Obama and the NSA. See? Right there, he had to sue Obama. Why? Because it gives him street cred with his lunatic fringe. Anyway, I figure I'll go to Rand's senate website and be able to read a press release, perhaps with a link to the lawsuit as it was actually filed, instead of the usual canned press conference and "liberal" media reports. I mean, if this is such an issue, one he's been talking about since January and maybe before, he and his staff would be ready to roll this out and convince skeptics like me. Except, except, except, there's nothing on his senate website (as of 12:27 a.m. 02-13-2014) announcing his filing of said lawsuit against the NSA. There's no press release, No link to the suit. No statement from the senator outlining his argument, why he thinks it has merit and should rise to the Supreme Court. Nothing.
But I did find these gems when I fired up the Google machine:
WASHINGTON — Senator Rand Paul, Republican of Kentucky, on Wednesday filed a lawsuit against President Obama and the leaders of several intelligence agencies. The suit challenges as unconstitutional the National Security Agency’s once-secret program that is collecting bulk records about Americans’ phone calls.
Mr. Paul, who had announced his intention to file the lawsuit in early January, joins an increasingly crowded set of plaintiffs, with several similar cases already pending.
But because of Mr. Paul’s status as a rising star of the Tea Party faction of the Republican Party — one who staged a nearly 13-hour filibuster on the floor of the Senate in March raising concerns about the rules governing “targeted killings” using drone strikes — his lawsuit may attract particular attention.
“Today we ask the question for every phone user in America: can a single warrant allow the government to collect all your records, all the time?” Mr. Paul said in a statement. “I don’t think so.”
FreedomWorks, the conservative and libertarian advocacy group, is listed as a co-plaintiff in the lawsuit. The lead lawyer is Kenneth T. Cuccinelli II, the former attorney general of Virginia. Bruce Fein, a former Reagan administration attorney, is also among the lawyerson the case.
The Obama administration has defended the program as lawful, noting that 15 judges on the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court have authorized it for 90-day intervals dating back to 2006. A 1979 Supreme Court ruling held that “metadata” — records showing that calls took place, but not their content — is not protected by the Fourth Amendment.
“We remain confident that the program is legal, as at least 15 judges have previously found,” Peter Carr, a Justice Department spokesman, said on Wednesday.
The Bush administration began the bulk call records program in 2001 based on a secret claim of presidential power, and it operated outside of any statutory or judicial framework until the court in 2006 granted a Justice Department motion to issue orders to phone companies for the records. The Justice Department motion was based on the argument that a provision of the Patriot Act that allows the F.B.I. to collect business records deemed relevant to an investigation could allow the N.S.A. to collect records in bulk.
Mr. Paul filed his lawsuit in the Federal District Court for the District of Columbia. In December, Judge Richard J. Leon of that court ruled in a similar lawsuit brought by Larry Klayman, a conservative legal activist, that the program probably violates the Fourth Amendment because its expansive scope makes it different from case considered by the Supreme Court in 1979. The Justice Department has appealed the decision.
In a separate case brought by the American Civil Liberties Union in the Southern District of New York, Judge William H. Pauley III in December concluded that the program is legal and complies with the Fourth Amendment. The A.C.L.U. has appealed that ruling.
There are also similar cases in the Northern District of California and the District of Idaho that are raising similar claims, including litigation in California that dates back to earlier revelations during the Bush administration era about domestic surveillance programs and has been stalled in disputes over state secrets.
And this, which reports that it seems Rand "stole" the lawsuit and canceled a press conference when the press began asking pointed questions or was asking for comment, pretty weak if you ask me:
Seems another epic fail to me. Grandstanding at its worse. And this is why he'll never be president. You can't get elected by pulling stunts. You actually have to do something. Get down in the trenches, compromise, stop demonizing your colleagues and the other side, roll up your selves and pass meaningful legislation that actually changes the current law as written. To think that this won't be scrutinized in a presidential bid is asinine, insulting to the intelligence of the American voting public and illustrates a lack of leadership and an ego that knows no bounds. It all makes for great sound bites, fires up your base but doesn't do a damn thing as far as changing the status quo.
Me personally? I'm undecided on the NSA's collection of my phone records. I don't call anyone anyway, I have nothing to hide and I think it helps protect us from the really, really, really bad guys. And Google and every website you visit is collecting our data and personal info and selling it and not safe guarding it anyway. How many of his supporters have a FaceBook page, I wonder? Seems to me the 4th amendment was sold out long ago. Welcome to the new reality. Unless of course you want to introduce meaningful legislation that might change things and then be branded soft on terrorism (if you're not with us, you're with the terrorists) and lose re-election from a candidate further to the right than you. Sleep tight.
rand paul- seeking publicity for run for 2016. just like with his epic failed filibuster.
will blame the media when he fails.
With the filibuster I thought he did a great job. Stayed on topic and played by the old rules and actually did it rather than threaten it. Kudos to him for that. Boo to him for giving the idea to Cruz who read a Dr Suess story.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Funny, ALL of you take a shot at him for doing something but sit silent on the actions of your President.
... No. We... er... I am saying tha Senator Paul should take advantage of his rare position as a U.S. Law Maker to attack that part of the Patriot Act and the rubber stamping of FISA warrants which allows the NSA to conduct these data mining operations. The Class Action Lawsuit is more of a political grand standing to gain exposure, rather than actually doing something about what he is complaining about. He is going to lose the in court because the Patriot Act and the issues FISA Warrant makes it legal... and he has the power to change the law... if he chooses to do so. He is a U.S. Senator... he knows how Washington works... he knows this won't fly because it is part of the law and covered by the courts... and he know the Ace in the Hole is 'National Security'. It just seems like he is getting his name out there... for 2016. That's all I'm saying. I don't agree with or defend the use of these NSA tactics... didn't like them when President Bush was doing it... still don't like it when President Obama does it. If I were a Senator... I would try to amend the Patriot Act to be specific on who they spy on... not just all of us and see which ones want to blow up the Super Bowl. But, alas... I am just a lowly database administrator and not a U.S. Law Maker.
Someone did try to end that but it didn't pass the Democratic controlled Senate.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Someone did try to end that but it didn't pass the Democratic controlled Senate.
... So? Why quit at one try? Haven't they tried to repeal Obamacare 40 times already? He should sponsor a bill to amend the Patriot Act becase we all know there is way too much money in that law to abolish it. And he needs to discuss it with his fellow Senators and possibly (ACK!) COMPROMISE some parts, rather than trying to ramrod it through the political divide. There are many regular Americans, from both side of the aisle, that think this whole NSA data mining is government overreach. Hell, you and I completely agree on this issue. I think the FISA Cout Warrants are a joke... they ALL get approved, which (technically) makes it legal. The drafters of the Patriot Act were cunning in their design of the law. That is how they were able to keep the warrantless wire taps in play. They devised the plan to have the FISA courts issue the warrants to protect agencies, such as the NSA, from carrying out their wholesale dragnets. ... Back to the topic... Class Action Lawsuits are cheap gimmicks. He knows he will fail because the searches have warrants attached... and he know that all the government has to say is, 'National Security' and it's game over. He might as well make commercials and air them on the cable between 2:00 A.M to 5:00 A.M., along with all of those other commercials of lawyers soliciting takers in their Class Action Suits against hip replacement manufacturers. He is a U.S. Senator. He needs to do his job as a Senator, that is, seeking a bill to amend that specific part of the Patriot Act on data mining. Trying to abolish it completely will NEVER happen... even if all the terrorits in the wold turn into hippies and go to Phish concerts.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
pardon me? That sounds suspiciously like a personal attack.
What we do here is discuss issues, not make snarky comments at each other and get personal. OK? Thanks. Really don't want to do that Enforcer thing but if you want it...I'll do it. Mind those manners please.
As for this issue, the President, whoever it is in any given year, is president for all Americans, not just some of us. I think there's a lot of agreement about what all Americans of every party don't want the NSA doing but it's not just one part of the government doing it. Change needs to be from all sides, all appropriate agencies on this one, and the people who made the law that allowed them to do it...my personal thoughts.
while an important thing to address and I appreciate how he presented himself at this press conference , I believe its better done in debate on the hill. make this your signature issue. At present its the law. you dont like the law , change as needed via amendment to that very law.
also , wouldnt those that have filed suit already and been denied in lower fed courts have better standing in appeal to reach SCOTUS?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Shouldn't Rand be suing them? What if the corporations had just said no, we're not giving you the goods for any amount of dollars because we value the Constitution and our customers' privacy?
Rand knows which side his bread is buttered on. Let the markets decide indeed.
So here's the problem I have with Rand Paul. He's definitely more about self promotion
And that is different from Obama, Hillary, Boehner, Reid, etc how exactly?
And here's the rest of the sentence, "than actually doing anything." Adds a little more context to my point doesn't it? The folks you mentioned have actually accomplished something in their public life. What's Rand Paul actually gotten done other than to grandstand and draw attention to himself with plagerized lawsuits and stunts? What has he actually gotten done to better the lives of his constituents or Americans in general? Getting elected to the senate is just half of it in my opinion. You should accomplish something or go home.
Comments
during the war on turr this would have been completely fine.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
A couple of years later... i got a check in the mail for 23 cents.
Class Action Lawsuits make lawyers rich. That is why you see those lawyers on T.V. trying to get people with bad hip replacements to call them.
...
Now, if only Senator Paul were in a seat of power... maybe he could draft amendments to the Patriot Act restricting the use of wholesale data gathering/data mining by the NSA. Too bad he is not a Senator or Congressman... oh, wait...
Hail, Hail!!!
No. We... er... I am saying tha Senator Paul should take advantage of his rare position as a U.S. Law Maker to attack that part of the Patriot Act and the rubber stamping of FISA warrants which allows the NSA to conduct these data mining operations.
The Class Action Lawsuit is more of a political grand standing to gain exposure, rather than actually doing something about what he is complaining about. He is going to lose the in court because the Patriot Act and the issues FISA Warrant makes it legal... and he has the power to change the law... if he chooses to do so. He is a U.S. Senator... he knows how Washington works... he knows this won't fly because it is part of the law and covered by the courts... and he know the Ace in the Hole is 'National Security'. It just seems like he is getting his name out there... for 2016.
That's all I'm saying. I don't agree with or defend the use of these NSA tactics... didn't like them when President Bush was doing it... still don't like it when President Obama does it. If I were a Senator... I would try to amend the Patriot Act to be specific on who they spy on... not just all of us and see which ones want to blow up the Super Bowl. But, alas... I am just a lowly database administrator and not a U.S. Law Maker.
Hail, Hail!!!
will blame the media when he fails.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
But I did find these gems when I fired up the Google machine:
WASHINGTON — Senator Rand Paul, Republican of Kentucky, on Wednesday filed a lawsuit against President Obama and the leaders of several intelligence agencies. The suit challenges as unconstitutional the National Security Agency’s once-secret program that is collecting bulk records about Americans’ phone calls.
Mr. Paul, who had announced his intention to file the lawsuit in early January, joins an increasingly crowded set of plaintiffs, with several similar cases already pending.
But because of Mr. Paul’s status as a rising star of the Tea Party faction of the Republican Party — one who staged a nearly 13-hour filibuster on the floor of the Senate in March raising concerns about the rules governing “targeted killings” using drone strikes — his lawsuit may attract particular attention.
“Today we ask the question for every phone user in America: can a single warrant allow the government to collect all your records, all the time?” Mr. Paul said in a statement. “I don’t think so.”
FreedomWorks, the conservative and libertarian advocacy group, is listed as a co-plaintiff in the lawsuit. The lead lawyer is Kenneth T. Cuccinelli II, the former attorney general of Virginia. Bruce Fein, a former Reagan administration attorney, is also among the lawyerson the case.
The Obama administration has defended the program as lawful, noting that 15 judges on the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court have authorized it for 90-day intervals dating back to 2006. A 1979 Supreme Court ruling held that “metadata” — records showing that calls took place, but not their content — is not protected by the Fourth Amendment.
“We remain confident that the program is legal, as at least 15 judges have previously found,” Peter Carr, a Justice Department spokesman, said on Wednesday.
The Bush administration began the bulk call records program in 2001 based on a secret claim of presidential power, and it operated outside of any statutory or judicial framework until the court in 2006 granted a Justice Department motion to issue orders to phone companies for the records. The Justice Department motion was based on the argument that a provision of the Patriot Act that allows the F.B.I. to collect business records deemed relevant to an investigation could allow the N.S.A. to collect records in bulk.
Mr. Paul filed his lawsuit in the Federal District Court for the District of Columbia. In December, Judge Richard J. Leon of that court ruled in a similar lawsuit brought by Larry Klayman, a conservative legal activist, that the program probably violates the Fourth Amendment because its expansive scope makes it different from case considered by the Supreme Court in 1979. The Justice Department has appealed the decision.
In a separate case brought by the American Civil Liberties Union in the Southern District of New York, Judge William H. Pauley III in December concluded that the program is legal and complies with the Fourth Amendment. The A.C.L.U. has appealed that ruling.
There are also similar cases in the Northern District of California and the District of Idaho that are raising similar claims, including litigation in California that dates back to earlier revelations during the Bush administration era about domestic surveillance programs and has been stalled in disputes over state secrets.
And this:
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/DC-Decoder/Decoder-Buzz/2014/0212/Sen.-Rand-Paul-files-NSA-lawsuit.-Can-he-win-video
And this, which reports that it seems Rand "stole" the lawsuit and canceled a press conference when the press began asking pointed questions or was asking for comment, pretty weak if you ask me:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/dana-milbank-rand-paul-and-ken-cuccinelli-accused-of-stealing-nsa-lawsuit/2014/02/12/058675aa-942b-11e3-83b9-1f024193bb84_story.html
Seems another epic fail to me. Grandstanding at its worse. And this is why he'll never be president. You can't get elected by pulling stunts. You actually have to do something. Get down in the trenches, compromise, stop demonizing your colleagues and the other side, roll up your selves and pass meaningful legislation that actually changes the current law as written. To think that this won't be scrutinized in a presidential bid is asinine, insulting to the intelligence of the American voting public and illustrates a lack of leadership and an ego that knows no bounds. It all makes for great sound bites, fires up your base but doesn't do a damn thing as far as changing the status quo.
Me personally? I'm undecided on the NSA's collection of my phone records. I don't call anyone anyway, I have nothing to hide and I think it helps protect us from the really, really, really bad guys. And Google and every website you visit is collecting our data and personal info and selling it and not safe guarding it anyway. How many of his supporters have a FaceBook page, I wonder? Seems to me the 4th amendment was sold out long ago. Welcome to the new reality. Unless of course you want to introduce meaningful legislation that might change things and then be branded soft on terrorism (if you're not with us, you're with the terrorists) and lose re-election from a candidate further to the right than you. Sleep tight.
Peace.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Shocking
Shocking I say :O)
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
So? Why quit at one try? Haven't they tried to repeal Obamacare 40 times already?
He should sponsor a bill to amend the Patriot Act becase we all know there is way too much money in that law to abolish it. And he needs to discuss it with his fellow Senators and possibly (ACK!) COMPROMISE some parts, rather than trying to ramrod it through the political divide. There are many regular Americans, from both side of the aisle, that think this whole NSA data mining is government overreach. Hell, you and I completely agree on this issue. I think the FISA Cout Warrants are a joke... they ALL get approved, which (technically) makes it legal.
The drafters of the Patriot Act were cunning in their design of the law. That is how they were able to keep the warrantless wire taps in play. They devised the plan to have the FISA courts issue the warrants to protect agencies, such as the NSA, from carrying out their wholesale dragnets.
...
Back to the topic... Class Action Lawsuits are cheap gimmicks. He knows he will fail because the searches have warrants attached... and he know that all the government has to say is, 'National Security' and it's game over. He might as well make commercials and air them on the cable between 2:00 A.M to 5:00 A.M., along with all of those other commercials of lawyers soliciting takers in their Class Action Suits against hip replacement manufacturers.
He is a U.S. Senator. He needs to do his job as a Senator, that is, seeking a bill to amend that specific part of the Patriot Act on data mining. Trying to abolish it completely will NEVER happen... even if all the terrorits in the wold turn into hippies and go to Phish concerts.
Hail, Hail!!!
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As for this issue, the President, whoever it is in any given year, is president for all Americans, not just some of us. I think there's a lot of agreement about what all Americans of every party don't want the NSA doing but it's not just one part of the government doing it. Change needs to be from all sides, all appropriate agencies on this one, and the people who made the law that allowed them to do it...my personal thoughts.
also , wouldnt those that have filed suit already and been denied in lower fed courts have better standing in appeal to reach SCOTUS?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
http://www.marketplace.org/topics/tech/data-our-data-cost-surveillance
Shouldn't Rand be suing them? What if the corporations had just said no, we're not giving you the goods for any amount of dollars because we value the Constitution and our customers' privacy?
Rand knows which side his bread is buttered on. Let the markets decide indeed.
Peace.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Peace.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©