Parking Ticket: Multiple Signs \ Multiple Locations=Bullshit

DriftingByTheStorm

Seriously,
I live in Raleigh, and I just got a $30 parking ticket in a "2hr parking zone".
I am about to start the appeals process, and I am so livid.

Check this out, and someone tell me i am
a. a brain-dead idiot who should have known better
b. not too far off the money.

Okay.
I park on a major street, on friday afternoon (just before 4pm), DIRECTLY BEHIND a sign.
By directly behind, i mean, my front bumper is touching a parking sign.
That sign reads: "2hr parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri". Arrow pointed towards me. period. that is IT.
it was around 4 or just after 4pm (i think my ticket is from 4:15pm)
So i get this ticket and am like, WTF?
Not only is it 2hr parking, and i've only been here one hour, it's AFTER the time limit, so i SHOULD BE GOOD.
I mean. this should be UNRESTRICTED parking after 4pm. Right? Right? (those who live in NYC, just hold on a sec)
Nope. Not according to this ticket, i have been cited in a "no parking 4pm to 6pm" zone.

Hmm. Sign in front of my truck, "2hr parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri" and I am in a "no parking 4pm-6pm" zone?
Aha! There is a sign in front of my truck, in front of the sign in front of my truck, in front of a driveway in front of the sign, that reads "no parking 4pm-6pm, mon-fri" with an arrow pointed my way.

OKAY WHAT?
TWO SIGNS?
not together. SEPERATE. one in front of the other by 10-15ft.

In my experience almost ALL SEPERATE signs (signs not posted ON THE SAME POST) ***NEGATE*** eachother.
In other words a sign with a "bus loading only" and an arrow pointed foward will be NEGATED by the sign AFTER it reading "2hr parking". RARELY IF EVER (okay, TRUE "no parking" zones seem to be the major exception) do i see a sign with an arrow pointed one way, and then the SAME sign after it with an arrow pointed forward (visually impaired: "noparking this way

---

>" and another sign over here "<

---

no parking that way", space in between is no parking)

BUT THESE SIGNS ARE STACKED?
[sign: "No Parking 4pm-6pm"------------->] [drive way] [sign:"2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"--------->]


In YOUR opinion, or said another way, if YOU saw this situation, what would you logically conclude?
Answer here.
Let me ask you another question,
if you pulled up to a spot, AND SAW A SIGN AT YOUR DAMN SPOT,
***WOULD YOU GO LOOKING AROUND FOR ANOTHER SIGN BEFORE IT?***
PLEASE ANSWER THIS QUESTION AND THE FOLLOWING:
***WHY WOULD YOU GO LOOKING FOR ANOTHER SIGN***
i'm not being obtuse, THIS IS VITALLY IMPORTANT to my case.
I need to know specifically, "yes i would go looking for another sign because when I applied for my drivers license, part of my driver's test was: multiple signs, and their interpretation". or "yes. i would go looking for another sign because i was taught as part of my city's municiple code outreach program(???lol???) this was the case"

I need to know WHY you think i am wrong. Is it well known in your town (and WHY?) that multiple signs in SEPERATE locations can override, negate, and cause you financial penalty? I looked up our city ordinance and there is NOTHING. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about this. There are 3 seperate code sections referenced for EXCEPTIONS to "limited hourly parking" and NONE of those exceptions apply.

Conversely if you look up NYC city ordinance over "parking and standing" THE FIRST DAMN SENTENCE IS "IF THERE ARE MULTIPLE SIGNS FOR THE SAME AREA, THE MOST RESTRICTIVE APPLIES"

Okay. Thats bullshit, BUT ATLEAST YOU SAID IT.
My town says NOTHING.
Yet their parking department claims i will "lose my appeal because" i 'should be aware of my surroundings at all times". THATS GREAT AND ALL. BUT AWARE OR NOT (i was not? I mean. i saw A SIGN. not TWO) I DID NOT KNOW THERE WAS A MULTIPLE SIGNS LAW. and apparently THERE IS ***NOT*** ONE.

ANYONE?
i'm so fucking miffed.
SOOOOOOOOoOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooo miffed.

mickeyrat

Around here, the break of a driveway or side street , necessitates another same sign after the break. So, it sounds like you would be in the right here. On principle , I would fight it. Who knows how many other people are getting "caught" like this.

If nothing else, would it be worth it to pay costs and the fine if you were wrong?

DriftingByTheStorm

mickeyrat wrote:

Around here, the break of a driveway or side street , necessitates another same sign after the break. So, it sounds like you would be in the right here. On principle , I would fight it. Who knows how many other people are getting "caught" like this.

If nothing else, would it be worth it to pay costs and the fine if you were wrong?

yeah. i think if i'm wrong, i still just pay the $30, so i am DEFINITELY "appealing" this."
My first appeal (in a two step process) is two the Parking Authority, so i have every reason to expect that i will LOSE that appeal. My SECOND appeal is to "a independent authority", which hopefully is not Diebold, but we shall see. lol. omfg.

I HATE our parking authority, which, BTW, IS PRIVATE (seriously, it's called ParkLink or some horseshit) ... i used to have a parttime Valet job and i not only did i get to know (and loathe) some of the asshole parking attendants, but I WATCHED PLAIN AS DAY as one ***physically removed** a temporary police ordinance sign which was inadvertently covering an actual parking sign (so the poor person parking there had no hope, it was covered, and in theory, invalid) TOOK A PICTURE of the sign that had been covered, and issued the lady a ticket. She was PISSED when she came out, and i told her everything and told her she should get the real cops out there ASAP. (unfortunately she did not listen to me) ... all that to say, i know these people are (some of them anyhow) pretty fucking douchbag-ish. GRR.

Cosmo

Here in L.A., those signs would be posted on the same pole, on above the other. That would make it clear that it is okay to park on the designated side from 8 AM to 4 PM for a maximum of 2 hours... AND there is NO Parking from 4 PM to 6 PM (rush hours). Which means, unlimited parking would be allowed after 6 PM until 8 AM on a Week Day.
...
Fight that bullshit.

hedonist

Yeah, Cos is right. In my area, it's pretty difficult to get fucked or flummoxed by the parking signs.

If you can, go back, walk the stretch with the signs you're talking about, and videotape the whole thing.

Couldn't hurt.

DriftingByTheStorm

thanks guys. i just needed some outside opinons.
good to know some (major, no less) municipalities are still running an honest racket.
This shit is just beyond the pale. Either it is a deliberate trap for revenue, or it was set up by serious dimwits (which i tend to doubt, since the lady on the phone seemed well aware of what i was talking about, but only that i was wrong, and would pay. hmm. we'll see. grr)

any further opinions more than welcome,
ESPECIALLY by anyone who may think i am wrong,
since understanding what grounds you think i'm wrong on may actually help me in my specific case.
again, we shall see. i got 21 days to do this shit. me thinks it will be done by tomorrow night. lol

Last-12-Exit

did u take a picture of your car in relation to the sign?

DriftingByTheStorm

Last-12-Exit wrote:

did u take a picture of your car in relation to the sign?

no. i will confess i have the shittiest phone you can imagine. it flips open, if that helps you picture it.
it is defintely NOT smart. but have no fear, The Parking Authority TOOK A PICTURE FOR ME.
Seriosly. Their clipboard they write on has a camera built in, and they take a picture from the front and back. I'm good on the visual documentation of WHERE i was. Like hedonist said, i probably need to video tape the entire street, also probably need to note locations of all signs, and try to explain just how fucked confusing it is.

I still am wondering, and wish i knew the answer, was there as second "no parking 4-6pm" sign somewhere behind my truck with an arrow pointed towards us. In other words, was it:

[sign: "No Parking 4pm-6pm"------------->] [drive way] [sign:"2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"--------->] [Sign: <---------- No Parking 4pm-6pm"]

really curious about that. And then. IF that was the case. IS there YET ANOTHER sign in FRONT of that sign, (or could it be behind it as well, see how absurd this could get) denoting where the 2hr parking ended.

In other words.
Could it be this?
[sign: "No Parking 4pm-6pm"------------->] [drive way] [sign:"2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"--------->] [sign:"<----------------2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"] [Sign: <---------- No Parking 4pm-6pm"]

Or even this??? WHAT ???
[sign: "No Parking 4pm-6pm"------------->] [drive way] [sign:"2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"--------->] [Sign: <---------- No Parking 4pm-6pm"] [sign:"<----------------2hr Parking 8am-4pm, mon-fri"]

I mean. I see no limit to the absurdity of "stacked signs" if this were the case????

Ahh shit. i just need to drive back there. grrr.

mickeyrat

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

thanks guys. i just needed some outside opinons.
good to know some (major, no less) municipalities are still running an honest racket.
This shit is just beyond the pale. Either it is a deliberate trap for revenue, or it was set up by serious dimwits (which i tend to doubt, since the lady on the phone seemed well aware of what i was talking about, but only that i was wrong, and would pay. hmm. we'll see. grr)

any further opinions more than welcome,
ESPECIALLY by anyone who may think i am wrong,
since understanding what grounds you think i'm wrong on may actually help me in my specific case.
again, we shall see. i got 21 days to do this shit. me thinks it will be done by tomorrow night. lol

research the state or municipality laws regarding traffic shit. Maybe see if you can ask the the state their opinion, in general, via email. That way their reply is in writting!!!!

Last-12-Exit

I realize this is the attitude they want you to have but, is fighting it worth the $30? MIssed time from work, the drive to the courthouse, the waiting....

Abe Froman

Sounds like you're in the right. Fight it. I hate fucking bullshit like this. Actually not many things piss me off more than little city money making fucking scams.

DriftingByTheStorm

Abe Froman wrote:

Sounds like you're in the right. Fight it. I hate fucking bullshit like this. Actually not many things piss me off more than little city money making fucking scams.

thanks man.
that means a lot, coming from the Sausage King of Chicago!

Last-12-Exit

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Abe Froman wrote:

Sounds like you're in the right. Fight it. I hate fucking bullshit like this. Actually not many things piss me off more than little city money making fucking scams.

thanks man.
that means a lot, coming from the Sausage King of Chicago!

i laugh every time i see that name

Abe Froman

Last-12-Exit wrote:

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Abe Froman wrote:

Sounds like you're in the right. Fight it. I hate fucking bullshit like this. Actually not many things piss me off more than little city money making fucking scams.

thanks man.
that means a lot, coming from the Sausage King of Chicago!

i laugh every time i see that name

It's such a great movie! One of my all time favs.

brianlux

I parked in Sacramento about seven months ago in front of a record store that for many years had free street parking. It had been a while since I'd been there and a new parking fee required sign was put up half way down the block- not even close to where I was parked. I appealed the ticket, waited six months for a relpy and then was told I had to pay anyway. $42.50 down the drain. :(

Hugh Freaking Dillon

in Winnipeg at least, those two signs would have been on the same pole. Maybe even on the same sign. that's garbage.

ajedigecko

Just consider it a forced donation.

We must fund programs.