Military tuition assistance cut

mikepegg44

Cosmo wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

If you want to complain to someone, start with Rep. Bohner. He's the one that did not want to discuss anything on the cutting board.

didn't the republicans offer Obama the ability to make all the decisions on the cuts?

wouldn't have been any discussions then, President Obama could have made the cuts where he saw fit.

...
I'm going to have to look that one up.
But, the political climate, as it exists today... does anyone see the John Bohner lead House giving any omnipotent powers over budget spending cuts to the President? I heard Bohner doesn't care much for the President.
...
If you have any references, I'd appreciate them... i'm feeling kinda lazy today.

More of an opinion piece on it but spells out some of the offerings

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3913

Cosmo

mikepegg44 wrote:

More of an opinion piece on it but spells out some of the offerings

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3913

...
This is from the actual Congressional Record...
( ref. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z ... 00016:@@@X )
I have highlighted the last action and current status... which is basically, nothing. The Senate is doing what they do best... NOTHING.

S.16
Latest Title: A bill to provide for a sequester replacement.
Sponsor: Sen Inhofe, James M. [OK] (introduced 2/27/2013) Cosponsors (2)
Latest Major Action: 2/28/2013 Senate floor actions.
Status: Motion to proceed to consideration of measure withdrawn in Senate.

---

ALL ACTIONS: 2/27/2013:
Introduced in the Senate. Read twice. Pursuant to the order of 2/14/2013, as modified on 2/26/2013, Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under General Orders. Calendar No. 19.
2/27/2013:
Motion to proceed to consideration of measure made in Senate. (consideration: CR S927)
2/27/2013:
Cloture motion on the motion to proceed to the measure presented in Senate. (consideration: CR S927; text: CR S927)
2/28/2013:
Motion to proceed to measure considered in Senate. (consideration: CR S990-991)
2/28/2013:
Cloture on the motion to proceed to the measure not invoked in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 38 - 62. Record Vote Number: 26. (consideration: CR S991; text: CR S991)
2/28/2013:
Motion to proceed to consideration of measure withdrawn in Senate. (consideration: CR S991)

mikepegg44

Cosmo wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

More of an opinion piece on it but spells out some of the offerings

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3913

...
This is from the actual Congressional Record...
( ref. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z ... 00016:@@@X )
I have highlighted the last action and current status... which is basically, nothing. The Senate is doing what they do best... NOTHING.

S.16
Latest Title: A bill to provide for a sequester replacement.
Sponsor: Sen Inhofe, James M. [OK] (introduced 2/27/2013) Cosponsors (2)
Latest Major Action: 2/28/2013 Senate floor actions.
Status: Motion to proceed to consideration of measure withdrawn in Senate.

---

ALL ACTIONS: 2/27/2013:
Introduced in the Senate. Read twice. Pursuant to the order of 2/14/2013, as modified on 2/26/2013, Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under General Orders. Calendar No. 19.
2/27/2013:
Motion to proceed to consideration of measure made in Senate. (consideration: CR S927)
2/27/2013:
Cloture motion on the motion to proceed to the measure presented in Senate. (consideration: CR S927; text: CR S927)
2/28/2013:
Motion to proceed to measure considered in Senate. (consideration: CR S990-991)
2/28/2013:
Cloture on the motion to proceed to the measure not invoked in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 38 - 62. Record Vote Number: 26. (consideration: CR S991; text: CR S991)
2/28/2013:
Motion to proceed to consideration of measure withdrawn in Senate. (consideration: CR S991)

yeah, the president threatened to veto it if it ever reached his desk

aerial

Having a smaller military could be detrimental for our countries safety. A better idea would be to...

1... cut all foreign aid
2...prosecute ALL government employees milking the system and have them pay restitution by confiscating all property like they do with the drug dealers..
3...Cut all vacations and unnecessary travel paid for by American Tax Money

This could save a few billion.

I don't see why the people that put there life in danger for EVERYONE should be denied education.... especially when special arrangements have been made for illegal Immigrants so that THEY may receive an education....

gimmesometruth27

i don't see why we NEED to spend more than the next 15 countries combined on our military.

all of that money tied up in antiquated weapns systems left over from the cold war is just a waste. all of that money tied up in nuclear weapons that we are never going to use is just a waste. i say we stop being so paranoid that we are going to be attacked and put that money to better use taking care of our people and creating jobs. no foreign country will ever invade us militarily, so thinking it will happen is just paranoia.

Cosmo

aerial wrote:

Having a smaller military could be detrimental for our countries safety. A better idea would be to...
1... cut all foreign aid
2...prosecute ALL government employees milking the system and have them pay restitution by confiscating all property like they do with the drug dealers..
3...Cut all vacations and unnecessary travel paid for by American Tax Money
This could save a few billion.
I don't see why the people that put there life in danger for EVERYONE should be denied education.... especially when special arrangements have been made for illegal Immigrants so that THEY may receive an education....

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Top Pentagon officials on Tuesday underscored their support for the Lockheed Martin Corp F-35 fighter, saying they would try to protect funding for the most expensive U.S. weapons program despite continued U.S. budget uncertainty and cost over-runs.

The $396 billion program is already seven years behind schedule and 70 percent over initial cost estimates.
"We'll try to protect F-35," Frank Kendall, the Pentagon's top arms buyer, told a defense conference. "There's no question about its priority. Despite sequestration, we'll still have a budget that's adequate to support F-35."

Kendall and other U.S. military officials spoke out in support of the program as it faces potentially damaging budget cuts that could lead to further delays and cost increases.

Kendall said the F-35 program still required much hard work on technical issues, noting that testing of the new radar-evading fighter was only about one-third complete. But he said the U.S. military needed the new fighter jet's next-generation capabilities.

"It is a transforming aircraft. It will give us dominance in the air, probably our most single important conventional warfighting capability for the foreseeable decades," he told a conference hosted by Credit Suisse and consultant Jim McAleese.

A congressional watchdog agency said on Monday that the Pentagon needs to budget $12.6 billion each year through 2037 to finish developing and paying for all the fighters it plans to buy. The Government Accountability Office report put the program's total cost at $400 billion"

ref. http://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-vows-pro ... nance.html

Cosmo

People need to see this.
THIS... is the Big Picture:

...
This is how the 'Everything Else' piece of the pie is distributed:
...
So... WHERE do you think we shoud cut?

g under p

Cosmo wrote:

People need to see this.
THIS... is the Big Picture:

...
This is how the 'Everything Else' piece of the pie is distributed:
...
So... WHERE do you think we shoud cut?

If I blindly through a dart at that pie chart I'd probably hit that orange red section, I'd make a cut there. The USA will be very safe if those cuts are made in the military. My question is why are we so scared of cutting the military budget it's not that this country will become a RED DAWN.....?

WOLVERINE!

Peace

Jeanwah

Cosmo wrote:

People need to see this.
THIS... is the Big Picture:

...
This is how the 'Everything Else' piece of the pie is distributed:
...
So... WHERE do you think we shoud cut?

Wouldn't military be a part of defense spending? Therefore it shouldn't even be in "everything else"...

Cosmo

Jeanwah wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

People need to see this.
THIS... is the Big Picture:

...
This is how the 'Everything Else' piece of the pie is distributed:
...
So... WHERE do you think we shoud cut?

Wouldn't military be a part of defense spending? Therefore it shouldn't even be in "everything else"...

...
The 'Everything Else' part is Descretionary Spending of the entire budget. The Big Green slice (20% of the overall budget) goes for military Mandatory Spending. That is the part that we have to pay for... most of it being to fund the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and paying for all of the hardware that we are obligated to pay for.
Think of it as you household budget... you HAVE to pay the mortgage/rent, insurance, utilities, etc... That is mandatory spending. The rest is at your descretion... food, clothing, concert tickets, etc...
The military part of the budget is the bulk of our descretionary spending... think of the big green slice of pie as the amount you need to pay for that fleet of Ferarris in your driveway. And the Military spending part is what you plan to spend this year on those Ferrarris... new rims and tires every year, those slick leather Recaro Seats you want, diamond encrusted radio knobs and 900 dollar silk floor mats that need to be replaced every 2 weeks.
So... you can either cut the amount of food you give to your entitled lazy children... or quit buying silk floor mats... your descretion.

Jeanwah

Cosmo wrote:

Jeanwah wrote:

Wouldn't military be a part of defense spending? Therefore it shouldn't even be in "everything else"...

...
The 'Everything Else' part is Descretionary Spending of the entire budget. The Big Green slice (20% of the overall budget) goes for military Mandatory Spending. That is the part that we have to pay for... most of it being to fund the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and paying for all of the hardware that we are obligated to pay for.
Think of it as you household budget... you HAVE to pay the mortgage/rent, insurance, utilities, etc... That is mandatory spending. The rest is at your descretion... food, clothing, concert tickets, etc...
The military part of the budget is the bulk of our descretionary spending... think of the big green slice of pie as the amount you need to pay for that fleet of Ferarris in your driveway. And the Military spending part is what you plan to spend this year on those Ferrarris... new rims and tires every year, those slick leather Recaro Seats you want, diamond encrusted radio knobs and 900 dollar silk floor mats that need to be replaced every 2 weeks.
So... you can either cut the amount of food you give to your entitled lazy children... or quit buying silk floor mats... your descretion.

Ok, gotcha.

Cosmo

Let's do some math.
Total Budget for FY 2012 is 3.6 Trillion dollars (Mandatory and Descretionary)
Of the 3.6 Trillions dollars, 720 Billion dollars goes to Mandatory Military spending (20% of 3.6 Trillion).
17% of 3.6 Trillion is 612 Billion dollars for all Descretionary Spending.
Of the 612 Billion dollars of Descretionary Spending, 58% (355 Billion Dollars) is for Military projects (not including Veterans Affairs which is a seperate budget item)
...
So... of the entire Federal Budget of 3.6 Trillion dollars, 720 Billion (Mandatory) + 355 Billion (Descretionary) = 1.075 Trillion dollars is spent on the Military.
...
Someone please explain to me... WHY Defense spending (30% of the entire budget) should not be cut?

aerial

I agree we need cuts in the military but not education. What part of the budget does sending money to other countries fall in?

Cosmo

aerial wrote:

I agree we need cuts in the military but not education. What part of the budget does sending money to other countries fall in?

...
International Affairs... which includes security details at our Embassies and Consulates, like the one in Benghazi is 4% of 612 Billion dollars or 24.5 Billion Dollars. Cut all of that and you can quit complaining about not having enough security over there because there won't be any security over there. People die over there, it's on you because you cut all of their funding.
24.5 Billion down... 60.5 Billion to go... where else?

Cosmo

The point is... even if we cut out ALL 612 Billion dollars in Descretionary Spending... we STILL need to pay out 2.98 Trillion Dollars.
This means no funding for our troops still stationed in the Middle East War Zones... no one checking to see if meat companies are putting shit in our hamburgers and taco meat... no air traffic controllers... no airport security... no postal deliveries... all of the National Parks would be closed.
The thing is... Americans WANT shit... we don't want to PAY for anything, but we still want everything.

aerial

This is a interesting report that shows ways to save money in the Military Budget. It does include the cut in Education.

http://www.coburn.senate.gov/public//index.cfm?a=Files.Serve&File_id=00783b5a-f0fe-4f80-90d6-019695e52d2d



The threat of our national debt can be defeated by reviewing every department, every
program, and expenditure within the federal budget, including at the Department of Defense
(DOD). We must eliminate waste and duplication to refocus the Pentagon to its true mission:
fighting and winning the nation’s wars.
This report examines five areas of the Pentagon budget that have little to do with
national security where taxpayer dollars could be saved and deficits reduced without impacting
our national security.

The recommendations outlined in Department of Everything could save as much as
$67.9 billion or more over ten years without cutting any Army brigade combat teams, Navy
combat ships, or Air Force fighter squadrons.

Research and Development .......................................................................................................................... 11
Duplication and Lack of Coordination Means Taxpayers Can Pay Twice or Three Times for
the Exact Same Research ............................................................................................................................. 13
Bomb Detector Developed by the Family Business of the Agency Director Less Effective than
“a Coin Flip” in Spotting Homemade Explosives .................................................................................. 15
To Boldly Go Where No Man Has Gone Before… ................................................................................. 16
‘Koo’ Use of Slang in Twitter Messages Reveals ‘Suttin’ ..................................................................... 19
Is It Time for a Coffee Break? There’s an App for That! ..................................................................... 20
Pentagon Researchers Study Fish to Determine if Ignorance Can Save Democracy .................... 21
Pentagon Raids Weapons Program to Develop Beef Jerky Roll-ups ............................................... 22
Perception of Size Matters: Guys with Guns Appear Bigger, Stronger and More Masculine . 25
Close Encounters and Space Weather .................................................................................................... 26
DOD Hunts Ten Red Balloons .................................................................................................................. 30
Robots as Childrens’ Playmates ................................................................................................................. 31
First Bird Likely Had Black Feathers, Air Force Research Concludes ........................................... 34
The Science of Storytelling .........................................................................................................................

stuckinline

aerial wrote:

I agree we need cuts in the military but not education.

I absolutely agree. There is so much waste, surely there must be other things to cut instead of military tuition assistance.
So, what will happen to the military men and women in their second, third or fourth year of college....thank you for your service but oops sorry no more assistance for you.

Cosmo

stuckinline wrote:

aerial wrote:

I agree we need cuts in the military but not education.

I absolutely agree. There is so much waste, surely there must be other things to cut instead of military tuition assistance.
So, what will happen to the military men and women in their second, third or fourth year of college....thank you for your service but oops sorry no more assistance for you.

...
The reason why LawMakers can cut education assistance to Veterans is because Veteran's Services (Veteran's Affairs) are a different budget line item. It is not included in the Military slice of the Descretionary Spending. That's what is so confusing to me about our Republican Representatives... they say the Military Spending is 'off the table' and should not be cuat at all... but Veteran's Services, a seperate budget item, can be slashed.
i think it comes from the mindset that our active service troops are number one priorities and cannot be touched, but once you are out of uniform, a payment to you is the same as a payment to wellfare or food stamps. The, 'Fuck you, what good are you to me, now?', menatality towards our veterans needs to be changed.

Cosmo

aerial wrote:

This is a interesting report that shows ways to save money in the Military Budget. It does include the cut in Education.

http://www.coburn.senate.gov/public//index.cfm?a=Files.Serve&File_id=00783b5a-f0fe-4f80-90d6-019695e52d2d

...
Did you read this part?
"This report examines five areas of the Pentagon budget that have little to do with national security where taxpayer dollars could be saved and deficits reduced without impacting our national security.

 Non-Military Research and Development: Research projects that have little or nothing to do with national defense or medical needs related to military service ($6 billion).

 Education: The Defense Domestic Dependent Elementary and Secondary Schools (DDESS)
that educates children of military families here in the United States and the Science,
Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics (STEM) programs that duplicate the work of
the Department of Education and local school districts ($10.7 billion). The Department of
Defense Tuition Assistance Program which provides college funding for military members on
active duty and duplicates the Department of Veterans Affairs ($4.5 billion)."
...
That is the spending cut... the funding of Veteran's Education Assistance in the 58% of the Military Spending.
Rep. Coburn want the Veteran's Affairs to cover those costs... which would mean a reduction in other Veteran's benefits, such as health services and job trainning/placement.

So, what you are seeing today in the reduction or elimination of Education Assistance (tuition) for Veterans is what is outlined in the document you presented.

mickeyrat

Active duty military can take collede classes at no cost to them specifically unless the credit excedes a set dollar amount.

Where was the uproar a year and a half ago?

http://militaryadvantage.military.com/2 ... -face-cut/

Military Tuition Assistance Cuts Looming
June 06, 2011 | Terry Howell

Tweet 214


Earlier this year I wrote that there were some rumblings about the DoD budget cuts possible affect on military tuition assistance. At that time it appeared that the service branches may be preparing to restrict access or reduce the $4,500 annual tuition assistance cap.

At the time I reported that the Chief of Continuing Education Programs, Carolyn Baker, had told the attendees at the Council of College and Military Educators annual conference that the DoD spent $542 million on tuition assistance in 2010 – $24 million more than 2009. Baker pointed out that increased demand and the growing cost of college tuition are putting a financial strain on the DoD budget. “The current program growth is unsustainable,” said Baker.

It appears Congress has taken this into their own hands by adding an amendment to the Defense Authorization Act of 2012 (HR 1540) that would direct the DoD to report on the effects of reducing the current 100% tuition and fees rate by 25%.




Currently servicemembers can get up to 100% of the tuition and fees covered as long as the per semester credit limit of $250 is not exceeded. Anything tuition costs which exceed the per credit hour cap must be paid through secondary sources like their GI Bill benefit, scholarships, grants or out-of-pocket.

If passed by Congress all servicemembers, no matter which branch, may soon have to rely on secondary funding sources to help cover their tuition and fees.

The language of the amendment, offered by Rep. Mike Coffman (R-CO), does not direct DoD to immediately cut the rates, however, it does call for the Defense Secretary to examine the possible effects of a cut. In addition, the amendment directs DoD to look for inefficiencies and duplications of benefits - i.e. servicemember’s ability to use the GI Bill while on active duty.

Let Congress know how you feel about this issue.

Full Story | Comments (251)


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