So Colorado and Washington....

Jeanwah

mikepegg44 wrote:

Jeanwah wrote:

I don't think it will go very far. The Feds will be all over these two states because preemption authorizes that fed law overcedes state law. So if I were in CO or WA, I'd proceed very cautiously.

Actually I think this pushes it to the supreme court. It is now not simply a legal challenge from some stoners...it is states and their attorneys office that will be trying the cases against the us attorneys. I am so glad this fight is going down...I think eventually the feds just give up.

It is local cops that will be making the stops where pot is found, not the feds. DEA agents won't be out trying to find a group of college kids growing a plant or two.

I believe that CA tried this and the Feds found their way to be involved in the state's business and being a local authority when it came to pot. Feds won't give up, they have preemption on their side. But I did see video this morning saying that these two states are not Amsterdam (which now are re-allowing tourists to engage in their leisure activities again!), and that they can have an ounce on them personally, but flaunting it is just the wrong idea...

Zoso

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Good deal. It is absolutely crazy to me that Gay Marriage and Pot were the 2 big topics nationally. Really? Anyone check the economy lately?

Economy
Education
Debt
Housing
30,000 or so homeless in New York and Jersey

And what are people celebrating?
Gay Marriage and Dope smoking.

Its a wonderful world we live in....

gay marriage isn't important to me personally or you.. but I'm sure it's important to people who are gay and would like to marry just like we can and have...

mikepegg44

Jeanwah wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

Jeanwah wrote:

I don't think it will go very far. The Feds will be all over these two states because preemption authorizes that fed law overcedes state law. So if I were in CO or WA, I'd proceed very cautiously.

Actually I think this pushes it to the supreme court. It is now not simply a legal challenge from some stoners...it is states and their attorneys office that will be trying the cases against the us attorneys. I am so glad this fight is going down...I think eventually the feds just give up.

It is local cops that will be making the stops where pot is found, not the feds. DEA agents won't be out trying to find a group of college kids growing a plant or two.

I believe that CA tried this and the Feds found their way to be involved in the state's business and being a local authority when it came to pot. Feds won't give up, they have preemption on their side. But I did see video this morning saying that these two states are not Amsterdam (which now are re-allowing tourists to engage in their leisure activities again!), and that they can have an ounce on them personally, but flaunting it is just the wrong idea...

states should never give up trying to claim state's rights on issues that have no business being federal.

Jeanwah

mikepegg44 wrote:

Jeanwah wrote:

mikepegg44 wrote:

Actually I think this pushes it to the supreme court. It is now not simply a legal challenge from some stoners...it is states and their attorneys office that will be trying the cases against the us attorneys. I am so glad this fight is going down...I think eventually the feds just give up.

It is local cops that will be making the stops where pot is found, not the feds. DEA agents won't be out trying to find a group of college kids growing a plant or two.

I believe that CA tried this and the Feds found their way to be involved in the state's business and being a local authority when it came to pot. Feds won't give up, they have preemption on their side. But I did see video this morning saying that these two states are not Amsterdam (which now are re-allowing tourists to engage in their leisure activities again!), and that they can have an ounce on them personally, but flaunting it is just the wrong idea...

states should never give up trying to claim state's rights on issues that have no business being federal.

Hey, I'm not in support of preemption, but that's the way they wrote the laws.

Gary Carter

Zoso wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Good deal. It is absolutely crazy to me that Gay Marriage and Pot were the 2 big topics nationally. Really? Anyone check the economy lately?

Economy
Education
Debt
Housing
30,000 or so homeless in New York and Jersey

And what are people celebrating?
Gay Marriage and Dope smoking.

Its a wonderful world we live in....

gay marriage isn't important to me personally or you.. but I'm sure it's important to people who are gay and would like to marry just like we can and have...

apparently some people care what others do in their own bed. they think it's fearful to marriage while it's ok for the average hetrosexual marriage to last no more than 2 years :roll: :roll:.

speedy, how dare you lump the homeless into your attacks on Obama. least Obama actually visited the areas that were hit the hardest unlike bush who just did a fly over New Orleans. hell Obama even wanted to spend a 2nd day visiting NY. those homeless people actually waited on long lines to vote or voted by texting or fax while most other americans dont give a shit bout voting. they voted knowing full well a another storm is bout to fuck them up again. some even voted just by writing their name down. if gas wasn't so scarce i'd be out there helping people inneed and no the gas lines aren't getting better, the media just wan'ts you to believe that.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

Gary Carter wrote:

apparently some people care what others do in their own bed. they think it's fearful to marriage while it's ok for hetrosexual marriages to last no more than 2 years :roll: :roll:.

speedy, how dare you lump the homeless into your attacks on Obama. least Obama actually visited the areas that were hit the hardest unlike bush who just did a fly over New Orleans. hell Obama even wanted to spend a 2nd day visiting NY. those homeless people actually waited on long lines to vote or voted by texting or fax while most other americans dont give a shit bout voting. they voted knowing full well a another storm is bout to fuck them up again. some even voted just by writing their name down. if gas wasn't so scarce i'd be out there helping people inneed and no the gas lines aren't getting better, the media just wan'ts you to believe that.

What the fuck are you talking about Metsy? My attacks on Obama?

I am only pointing out that there are more important issues, at least in my mind, than gay marriage and dope smoking. With cleaning up New York on the top of that list.
Come on Metsy, You are better than that.

And Good Morning.

Jeanwah

Speedy, would you rather that we just talk about economy, economy, economy and get nothing done? Because no one's going to "fix" the economy magically. What you're proposing is that we focus on spinning our wheels while solving absolutely nothing else in the meantime.

Zoso

Jeanwah wrote:

Speedy, would you rather that we just talk about economy, economy, economy and get nothing done? Because no one's going to "fix" the economy magically. What you're proposing is that we focus on spinning our wheels while solving absolutely nothing else in the meantime.

oh god I love the AMT today oh and I agree.

mikepegg44

Jeanwah wrote:

Hey, I'm not in support of preemption, but that's the way they wrote the laws.

agree, but that is why we have the states right amendment. Pre-emption would only apply to a constitutional law. This will be an interesting challenge. I think the law is unjust to begin with...I am not naive enough to think it will stand up to the challenge, just interested in how far the states are willing to take the argument, and more than that, what kind of argument they make.

With prohibition of Alcohol, the people and the states gave up the rights by ratifying an amendment to the constitution. No such amendment exists for drugs. Just the CSA.

This will have to go to the supreme court now that states are in the fight, and not just the people. In order to strike down those laws, the SC will have to say that the federal gov't has the right to regulate individual citizens lives through IMPLIED powers rather than those that were actually enumerated in the constitution, which by my, maybe overly optimistic, calculation is a violation of the 9th and 10th.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

Jeanwah wrote:

Speedy, would you rather that we just talk about economy, economy, economy and get nothing done? Because no one's going to "fix" the economy magically. What you're proposing is that we focus on spinning our wheels while solving absolutely nothing else in the meantime.

Jeanwah...
Its been months since we talked...
Lets see if we can go a full year this time around...

Sound Good?

Gary Carter

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

Gary Carter wrote:

apparently some people care what others do in their own bed. they think it's fearful to marriage while it's ok for hetrosexual marriages to last no more than 2 years :roll: :roll:.

speedy, how dare you lump the homeless into your attacks on Obama. least Obama actually visited the areas that were hit the hardest unlike bush who just did a fly over New Orleans. hell Obama even wanted to spend a 2nd day visiting NY. those homeless people actually waited on long lines to vote or voted by texting or fax while most other americans dont give a shit bout voting. they voted knowing full well a another storm is bout to fuck them up again. some even voted just by writing their name down. if gas wasn't so scarce i'd be out there helping people inneed and no the gas lines aren't getting better, the media just wan'ts you to believe that.

What the fuck are you talking about Metsy? My attacks on Obama?

I am only pointing out that there are more important issues, at least in my mind, than gay marriage and dope smoking. With cleaning up New York on the top of that list.
Come on Metsy, You are better than that.

And Good Morning.

sorry just a bit uppity this morning. speedy those issues maybe more important to you but for gays those issues aren't important to them. don't you wanna see people be able to get married and be happy and not suffer just because of some laws that were founded cause of the bible? I won't even get into the pot thing cause i think it's just a flat out a fucking joke.

Go Beavers

cincybearcat wrote:

Zoso wrote:

I think this proves that the social issues were underestimated in this election. they were more important than first thought. Very pleased with those gay marriage and pot results BTW. Who would have thought there 'liberal' issues would have got up.

Didn't Oregon voted down gay Marriage? Unless the results changed from what I saw previously, they did. I thought that strange.

Why do you think Pot was on the ballot in Colorado? Undecided state...get all the stoners there to vote for Obama. Well run campaign.

In the 90's (in Oregon) there was a measure that was framed up in the negative and worded more anti-gay marriage and that didn't pass. 8 years ago the measure passed that defined marriage between a man and a woman (embarrassing). There was almost a measure this time to put gay marriage on the ballot, but they thought it was too close to go to the expense and effort, so it will be on in 2 or 4 years from now. It shouldn't be a problem passing then.

I'm kind of surprised the marijuana thing didn't pass. Medical pot has been legal for quite a while, and around 12 years ago pot use was lowered down to a violation where if you have less than 50 grams (or around that), it was basically a $100 fine and it's really only enforced as an add-on offense if you're doing other shenanigans.

brianlux

I think the marijuana issue is very important to anyone affected by it but if we were to step outside the 10 Club door for a minute and peek in on some others we'd probably see much less focus on it. On the bigger scale, on a national scale, I don't imagine there's that much focus on this one. But then I'm from California where it's not such a big deal. It used to be. Back in 1970 a couple of people in the dorm I lived were busted for having a few pot seeds. They went to jail for that. THAT was a big issue then. Today it's not such a big deal. Deal. Got pot? Yeah, sure-- so?

Drowned Out

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Good deal. It is absolutely crazy to me that Gay Marriage and Pot were the 2 big topics nationally. Really? Anyone check the economy lately?

Economy
Education
Debt
Housing
30,000 or so homeless in New York and Jersey

And what are people celebrating?
Gay Marriage and Dope smoking.

Its a wonderful world we live in....

What would you guys have liked a side ballot to look like?
Should we has big govmint? yes or no
Should we has better skoolz? yes or no
Should we help people in NY and NJ? yes or no
Not sure how you would resolve those issues with a vote, but hey...I guess if you have a big enough hard on for potheads and gays that, in the midst of all the problems in your country, THIS is the one you choose to come to the PJ message board to bitch about.....then you would be too biased to see how these initiatives help the first item on your list (economy), which should in turn....(wait for it) trickle down some new and saved tax dollars to your other causes.
I know you'll just say youre not against either initiative, that you just don't give a shit about either issue....but then why are you calling people out for celebrating something they see as a positive? Is it better to be bitching about something you don't care about? (or maybe despise but don't want to say so publicly?)

cincybearcat

Drowned Out wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Good deal. It is absolutely crazy to me that Gay Marriage and Pot were the 2 big topics nationally. Really? Anyone check the economy lately?

Economy
Education
Debt
Housing
30,000 or so homeless in New York and Jersey

And what are people celebrating?
Gay Marriage and Dope smoking.

Its a wonderful world we live in....

What would you guys have liked a side ballot to look like?
Should we has big govmint? yes or no
Should we has better skoolz? yes or no
Should we help people in NY and NJ? yes or no
Not sure how you would resolve those issues with a vote, but hey...I guess if you have a big enough hard on for potheads and gays that, in the midst of all the problems in your country, THIS is the one you choose to come to the PJ message board to bitch about.....then you would be too biased to see how these initiatives help the first item on your list (economy), which should in turn....(wait for it) trickle down some new and saved tax dollars to your other causes.
I know you'll just say youre not against either initiative, that you just don't give a shit about either issue....but then why are you calling people out for celebrating something they see as a positive? Is it better to be bitching about something you don't care about? (or maybe despise but don't want to say so publicly?)

I'm for Gay Marriage and think it's ridiculous that it be put up to vote.

As for Pot, I really don't care. But it does show the ridiculousness of what people care about. Plenty of other state issues I'm sure...water resources, state budgets, etc, etc etc. I guess one could argue that making Pot legal was a reduction in the cost of law enforcement or jail space...so I guess it has that going for it.

I can;t wait till 2016 when we get to vote state by state on prostitution!!!

RKCNDY

Jason P wrote:

I heard that a lot of the medical distributors were not happy with the proposition because in will ignite the Fed's attention to the state.

distributors and growers will have to submit their fingerprints to the FBI, and be licensed by the liquor control board.

brianlux

Imagine the shit storm of controversy if states were voting on legalization of alcohol and several of the states banned it. I'm not sure which emoticon to use here.

BinauralJam

Horos

Go Beavers wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

Zoso wrote:

I think this proves that the social issues were underestimated in this election. they were more important than first thought. Very pleased with those gay marriage and pot results BTW. Who would have thought there 'liberal' issues would have got up.

Didn't Oregon voted down gay Marriage? Unless the results changed from what I saw previously, they did. I thought that strange.

Why do you think Pot was on the ballot in Colorado? Undecided state...get all the stoners there to vote for Obama. Well run campaign.

In the 90's (in Oregon) there was a measure that was framed up in the negative and worded more anti-gay marriage and that didn't pass. 8 years ago the measure passed that defined marriage between a man and a woman (embarrassing). There was almost a measure this time to put gay marriage on the ballot, but they thought it was too close to go to the expense and effort, so it will be on in 2 or 4 years from now. It shouldn't be a problem passing then.

I'm kind of surprised the marijuana thing didn't pass. Medical pot has been legal for quite a while, and around 12 years ago pot use was lowered down to a violation where if you have less than 50 grams (or around that), it was basically a $100 fine and it's really only enforced as an add-on offense if you're doing other shenanigans.

I think the 'medical' pot growers were against it because they are profiting from thier crops.

whygohome

Jason P wrote:

I'm surprised that Oregon didn't legalize it. I think their State bird is a hacky sack ...