Iran Sanctions Causing Food Insecurity & Mass Suffering

Drowned Out

It amazes me how easily led to the same trough so many people are....the EXACT same lies that took the US to Iraq and being swallowed whole once again.
But, you know...Israel, that great beacon of hope and light, has been saving us from Iran for over 20 years now....it's about time we help them deal with this threat, you know...before those pesky muslims get smrt enough to build a nuke. Because we all know that they're too stupid to have built a nuke in 20 years of trying, right?


http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Middle-E ... No.-1-1992
1992: Israeli parliamentarian Benjamin Netanyahu tells his colleagues that Iran is 3 to 5 years from being able to produce a nuclear weapon – and that the threat had to be "uprooted by an international front headed by the US."

1992: Israeli Foreign Minister Shimon Peres tells French TV that Iran was set to have nuclear warheads by 1999. "Iran is the greatest threat and greatest problem in the Middle East," Peres warned, "because it seeks the nuclear option while holding a highly dangerous stance of extreme religious militanCY."

1992: Joseph Alpher, a former official of Israel's Mossad spy agency, says "Iran has to be identified as Enemy No. 1." Iran's nascent nuclear program, he told The New York Times, "really gives Israel the jitters."

what a joke.

Byrnzie

Jason P wrote:

The sanctions are against them their nuclear program because the majority of the world does not trust them enough to believe they will not build a nuclear weapons program.

'The World'? You mean American politico's, their lacky's in the Mainstream media, and the Israeli leadership?

And do you really think the word of these people should be trusted? Have we learned nothing from Iraq?

Byrnzie

Drowned Out wrote:

It amazes me how easily led to the same trough so many people are....the EXACT same lies that took the US to Iraq and being swallowed whole once again.
But, you know...Israel, that great beacon of hope and light, has been saving us from Iran for over 20 years now....it's about time we help them deal with this threat, you know...before those pesky muslims get smrt enough to build a nuke. Because we all know that they're too stupid to have built a nuke in 20 years of trying, right?


http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Middle-E ... No.-1-1992
1992: Israeli parliamentarian Benjamin Netanyahu tells his colleagues that Iran is 3 to 5 years from being able to produce a nuclear weapon – and that the threat had to be "uprooted by an international front headed by the US."

1992: Israeli Foreign Minister Shimon Peres tells French TV that Iran was set to have nuclear warheads by 1999. "Iran is the greatest threat and greatest problem in the Middle East," Peres warned, "because it seeks the nuclear option while holding a highly dangerous stance of extreme religious militanCY."

1992: Joseph Alpher, a former official of Israel's Mossad spy agency, says "Iran has to be identified as Enemy No. 1." Iran's nascent nuclear program, he told The New York Times, "really gives Israel the jitters."

what a joke.

Looks like you beat me to it.

Great post by the way. Those quotes are priceless.

Jason P

Byrnzie wrote:

Jason P wrote:

The sanctions are against them their nuclear program because the majority of the world does not trust them enough to believe they will not build a nuclear weapons program.

'The World'? You mean American politico's, their lacky's in the Mainstream media, and the Israeli leadership?

And do you really think the word of these people should be trusted? Have we learned nothing from Iraq?

Regardless of the fear-monger's agenda, adding a potential source that can be developed into nuclear weapons in the Middle East is bad news. Having another country with the ability to make nuclear weapons is bad news.

If they wanted it just for energy, why turn down offers to have the uranium supplied by outside countries?

It would be nice if rational discussion could take place between our countries. I recall Obama extending his hand out to Iran when he assumed presidency.

grooveme

I think that the actions of the leaders in Iran is what is causing mass suffering. If they choose to ignore it, their bad, not ours.

Byrnzie

grooveme wrote:

I think that the actions of the leaders in Iran is what is causing mass suffering. If they choose to ignore it, their bad, not ours.

No, the sanctions imposed by the U.S are what's causing mass suffering among the civilian population in Iran, just as the sanctions imposed on Iraq in the 1990's caused 500,000 Iraqi children to die.

pandora

I'm not sure why their own government is not to blame...
protect their people, compromise, comply.
Is it because the power in place could care less about it's own people?
They are disposable to them?

Drowned Out

Jason P wrote:

Regardless of the fear-monger's agenda, adding a potential source that can be developed into nuclear weapons in the Middle East is bad news. Having another country with the ability to make nuclear weapons is bad news.

If they wanted it just for energy, why turn down offers to have the uranium supplied by outside countries?

It would be nice if rational discussion could take place between our countries. I recall Obama extending his hand out to Iran when he assumed presidency.

Iran has no reason to trust a hand extended by American leadership. Look at the history between the two countries. Besides - the 'rational discussion' you speak of has no compromise....they either get nuclear energy, or they don't. They have complied to international law to date, so why should they compromise with anyone? Especially when the countries demanding the compromise do NOT comply with those same international laws and treaties themselves?? :fp:
My understanding is that Iran wants nuclear energy because their internal consumption of their oil and gas is increasing quickly...it's their main export and they rely on that income. If their goal is to maintain energy independence, outsourcing enriched uranium for nuclear plants defeats the purpose.
Now....why do you clarify 'in the middle east'? I assume, since you dropped the 'angry muslim' angle in this post, your answer is 'because of the tensions over there'....do you not think there is more tension caused by unipolar power and dominance? Israel possessing overwhelming military (and nuclear) power is what allows them to do what they do in the region, and THAT is the root cause of the tension!

But the real question is.....what's it to you? Why do so many Americans give lip service to quitting the role of world police....but still feel the need to stand behind their 'leaders' when they attempt to impose their will on other countries?

Drowned Out

grooveme wrote:

I think that the actions of the leaders in Iran is what is causing mass suffering. If they choose to ignore it, their bad, not ours.

Which actions do you speak of?

Jason P

Drowned Out wrote:

Iran has no reason to trust a hand extended by American leadership. Look at the history between the two countries. Besides - the 'rational discussion' you speak of has no compromise....they either get nuclear energy, or they don't. They have complied to international law to date, so why should they compromise with anyone? Especially when the countries demanding the compromise do NOT comply with those same international laws and treaties themselves?? :fp:
My understanding is that Iran wants nuclear energy because their internal consumption of their oil and gas is increasing quickly...it's their main export and they rely on that income. If their goal is to maintain energy independence, outsourcing enriched uranium for nuclear plants defeats the purpose.
Now....why do you clarify 'in the middle east'? I assume, since you dropped the 'angry muslim' angle in this post, your answer is 'because of the tensions over there'....do you not think there is more tension caused by unipolar power and dominance? Israel possessing overwhelming military (and nuclear) power is what allows them to do what they do in the region, and THAT is the root cause of the tension!

But the real question is.....what's it to you? Why do so many Americans give lip service to quitting the role of world police....but still feel the need to stand behind their 'leaders' when they attempt to impose their will on other countries?

Solar energy and wind power are the options of the future. They usually do not put the world on the edge of war as well. What's a more reliable source of energy then the giant burning orb in the sky?

The Middle East has been in a state of conflict for the last 2500 years, give or take a few hundred years.

Drowned Out

Jason P wrote:

Solar energy and wind power are the options of the future. They usually do not put the world on the edge of war as well. What's a more reliable source of energy then the giant burning orb in the sky?

The Middle East has been in a state of conflict for the last 2500 years, give or take a few hundred years.

Says the country who possesses nukes, uses nuclear energy, and has killed countless people in the pursuit of fossil fuels and resources....you don't see the hypocrisy in that statement?
You dodged all of my questions...

Drowned Out

Someone tell me this:
If the Ayatollah, and Ahmadinejad are so evil, and such an immediate threat...why not just take them out? Surely that's justified if we're in danger of a nuclear war, right? And if the Iranian people are so oppressed, and suffering so horribly under this brutal regime, they'd thank the US/Israel for toppling them, right?
They have drones all over the eastern hemisphere, taking out terrorists in secret hiding places...but they can't take out two highly visible, highly track-able targets?
Why not do that instead of making the people, who according to the West don't even want their leaders in power, to suffer in order to force them to rebel?

peacefrompaul

Drowned Out wrote:

Someone tell me this:
If the Ayatollah, and Ahmadinejad are so evil, and such an immediate threat...why not just take them out? Surely that's justified if we're in danger of a nuclear war, right? And if the Iranian people are so oppressed, and suffering so horribly under this brutal regime, they'd thank the US/Israel for toppling them, right?
They have drones all over the eastern hemisphere, taking out terrorists in secret hiding places...but they can't take out two highly visible, highly track-able targets?
Why not do that instead of making the people, who according to the West don't even want their leaders in power, to suffer in order to force them to rebel?

We are probably unsure who exactly it would piss off

Drowned Out

peacefrompaul wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

Someone tell me this:
If the Ayatollah, and Ahmadinejad are so evil, and such an immediate threat...why not just take them out? Surely that's justified if we're in danger of a nuclear war, right? And if the Iranian people are so oppressed, and suffering so horribly under this brutal regime, they'd thank the US/Israel for toppling them, right?
They have drones all over the eastern hemisphere, taking out terrorists in secret hiding places...but they can't take out two highly visible, highly track-able targets?
Why not do that instead of making the people, who according to the West don't even want their leaders in power, to suffer in order to force them to rebel?

We are probably unsure who exactly it would piss off

All the same people you're already pissing off! ....
But does it matter who you piss off if a nuclear threat is imminent? That's a pretty big deal, no?

peacefrompaul

Drowned Out wrote:

All the same people you're already pissing off! ....
But does it matter who you piss off if a nuclear threat is imminent? That's a pretty big deal, no?

I'm not sure... I'm not partuicularly scared of Iran, I don't personally feel threatened by them, and I would like for us to just leave them alone. Let Israel dig its own grave... I'm ready for our boys to all come back home.

Jason P

Drowned Out wrote:

Jason P wrote:

Solar energy and wind power are the options of the future. They usually do not put the world on the edge of war as well. What's a more reliable source of energy then the giant burning orb in the sky?

The Middle East has been in a state of conflict for the last 2500 years, give or take a few hundred years.

Says the country who possesses nukes, uses nuclear energy, and has killed countless people in the pursuit of fossil fuels and resources....you don't see the hypocrisy in that statement?
You dodged all of my questions...

Why should Iran trust us? Why should we trust them? Dialog solves that.

As far as we know, they have complied with international law ...

I answered how they can maintain energy independence.

As far as we know, Israel does not have any nuclear weapons (just like Iran abides international law )

I don't want Israel or any heavily influenced religious state to have nuclear weapons. Pandora's box has already let eight flying monkeys out. Let's keep that number set in place.

What is it to me??? If a shit storm is set off because of this, then the burden affects us all. Friend and family in the service are pulled into another war. Energy prices will spiral out of control causing suffering throughout the world. Lots of people die.

The UN and the EU hold the cards. Fairness is a moot point.

Build some solar panels. Start some dialog.

pandora

peacefrompaul wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

All the same people you're already pissing off! ....
But does it matter who you piss off if a nuclear threat is imminent? That's a pretty big deal, no?

I'm not sure... I'm not partuicularly scared of Iran, I don't personally feel threatened by them, and I would like for us to just leave them alone. Let Israel dig its own grave... I'm ready for our boys to all come back home.

That would be great then we can put them to work doing something here...
hmmm... I wonder what?

breathe in breathe out ...
the machine
got a machine head better than the rest

peacefrompaul

pandora wrote:

peacefrompaul wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

All the same people you're already pissing off! ....
But does it matter who you piss off if a nuclear threat is imminent? That's a pretty big deal, no?

I'm not sure... I'm not partuicularly scared of Iran, I don't personally feel threatened by them, and I would like for us to just leave them alone. Let Israel dig its own grave... I'm ready for our boys to all come back home.

That would be great then we can put them to work doing something here...
hmmm... I wonder what?

breathe in breathe out ...
the machine
got a machine head better than the rest

Beats having them out there dying for absolutely nothing.

pandora

peacefrompaul wrote:

pandora wrote:

peacefrompaul wrote:

I'm not sure... I'm not partuicularly scared of Iran, I don't personally feel threatened by them, and I would like for us to just leave them alone. Let Israel dig its own grave... I'm ready for our boys to all come back home.

That would be great then we can put them to work doing something here...
hmmm... I wonder what?

breathe in breathe out ...
the machine
got a machine head better than the rest

Beats having them out there dying for absolutely nothing.

like our homeless and hungry?

What will you have them do here at home?

riotgrl

pandora wrote:

peacefrompaul wrote:

pandora wrote:

That would be great then we can put them to work doing something here...
hmmm... I wonder what?

breathe in breathe out ...
the machine
got a machine head better than the rest

Beats having them out there dying for absolutely nothing.

like our homeless and hungry?

What will you have them do here at home?

I would think the training they received in the military would give them a better opportunity to get a job once they got home. We have jobs that are available, however, many employers are finding it difficult to fill those jobs because many propsective employees do not have the proper training and skills that are needed. Perhaps we need to funnel some of the defense budget into job skill training for the military and others if we want to reduce the unemployment rate.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444840104577549131609451256.html