All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
If you have a toothache in Cuba they just pull the teeth no filling it ...
"...Dimitri...He talks to me...'.."The Ghost of Greece..".
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Yeah, I know, but I have a bunch of friends (here in the U.S.) who have gone (most of them legally, even).
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
A work colleague has been there three times and I might go with him next April.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
I have a friend who is half Cuban and has relatives there so she's been able to go a number of times. She tells me some really sad stories about health care and conditions in general there. Oh man, we don't know how good we've got it here in the states.
At this point in my life I wouldn't trade places but I can't help but wonder: which way of life is more sustainable? I think that's a question worth asking.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I have a friend who is half Cuban and has relatives there so she's been able to go a number of times. She tells me some really sad stories about health care and conditions in general there. Oh man, we don't know how good we've got it here in the states.
At this point in my life I wouldn't trade places but I can't help but wonder: which way of life is more sustainable? I think that's a question worth asking.
Interesting. Everyone I know who has gone has great things to say about their healthcare system. Our medical school & community health organizations have even formed a group that goes there to study their system to figure out ways to implement a similar system to improve the health of our communities.
But the difficult task will be to figure out how to recreate their overall model while leaving out some of the totalitarian details. I.e., their system seems to work so well (they often have better health outcomes than we do) because of the great community cooperation. So the big question here is, How do we create that sense of community / social responsibility without it being forced? Anyone ave any good ideas?
But the difficult task will be to figure out how to recreate their overall model while leaving out some of the totalitarian details. I.e., their system seems to work so well (they often have better health outcomes than we do) because of the great community cooperation. So the big question here is, How do we create that sense of community / social responsibility without it being forced? Anyone ave any good ideas?
you are essentially asking the US to turn into a socialist state ... i don't see it happening ...
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
I have a friend who is half Cuban and has relatives there so she's been able to go a number of times. She tells me some really sad stories about health care and conditions in general there. Oh man, we don't know how good we've got it here in the states.
At this point in my life I wouldn't trade places but I can't help but wonder: which way of life is more sustainable? I think that's a question worth asking.
Interesting. Everyone I know who has gone has great things to say about their healthcare system. Our medical school & community health organizations have even formed a group that goes there to study their system to figure out ways to implement a similar system to improve the health of our communities.
But the difficult task will be to figure out how to recreate their overall model while leaving out some of the totalitarian details. I.e., their system seems to work so well (they often have better health outcomes than we do) because of the great community cooperation. So the big question here is, How do we create that sense of community / social responsibility without it being forced? Anyone ave any good ideas?
We should keep in mind that what I said about Cuban health care is second hand information and the opinion of a few people. If you asked a few people in, say, a U.S. state with the same population as Cuba what they thought the health care system in that state you'd probably get a wide range of answers.
And, yes, as Polaris_x stated, socialism is not likely to happen here (despite our having a Kenyan Maxrist Socialist president... sorry, couldn't resist. ).
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
But the difficult task will be to figure out how to recreate their overall model while leaving out some of the totalitarian details. I.e., their system seems to work so well (they often have better health outcomes than we do) because of the great community cooperation. So the big question here is, How do we create that sense of community / social responsibility without it being forced? Anyone ave any good ideas?
you are essentially asking the US to turn into a socialist state ... i don't see it happening ...
What about on a smaller scale? Plus, we're just talking about healthcare here, not every single aspect of the public welfare. Also, then maybe the question is, How do we create a healthcare system that's as good as Cuba's without "asking the US to turn into a socialist state"? I guess what I'm thinking more about is the sense of community & social responsibility that makes people feel like it's their civic duty to protect the health of themselves and their fellow Cubans. Can we not create such a sense of community without creating a socialist state?
i would say it's possible in a small state like maybe vermont ... i fully believe in the concept of socialized medicine but like everything else - it cannot operate in isolation ... there are many complexities that have to be addressed ... you would have to bring the administration of health care in house, doctors would need to accept a pay scale, taxes would have to go up, all the middle-men that makes health care expensive in the states expensive would need to be cut out ...
conceptually, it makes sense but there are a lot of various interest groups and they all aren't interested in the same goal ...
i would say it's possible in a small state like maybe vermont ... i fully believe in the concept of socialized medicine but like everything else - it cannot operate in isolation ... there are many complexities that have to be addressed ... you would have to bring the administration of health care in house, doctors would need to accept a pay scale, taxes would have to go up, all the middle-men that makes health care expensive in the states expensive would need to be cut out ...
conceptually, it makes sense but there are a lot of various interest groups and they all aren't interested in the same goal ...
Sorry, I edited my post.
What about doing it at even just a neighborhood scale? Do you have any ideas about how to address those issues?
What about doing it at even just a neighborhood scale? Do you have any ideas about how to address those issues?
ok ... i will qualify this with the fact i am not in healthcare and the opinions expressed previously and henceforth are strictly my own ... with no funding from anarchist hippie groups ...
at a community scale - it is definitely possible and is happening in a lot of places in america ... there are many communities that look out for each other ... neighbours driving other neighbours to medical appointments ... making sure people who are sick have food or walking each others pets ... that to me is part of the holistic approach to health care ... it isn't just doctors and medicine ... it's about living healthy lifestyles, support for people who are primary caregivers, etc ...
obviously, the larger issue is when someone requires more aggressive health care (cancer, fractures, etc) ... how do you overcome the current model of insurance and for profit clinics who 9 times out of 10 will prescribe treatment that makes the most money!? ...
there are many communities that look out for each other ... neighbours driving other neighbours to medical appointments ... making sure people who are sick have food or walking each others pets ...
You do just realize you just described the majority of rural conservative Midwest towns, right? :geek:
What about doing it at even just a neighborhood scale? Do you have any ideas about how to address those issues?
ok ... i will qualify this with the fact i am not in healthcare and the opinions expressed previously and henceforth are strictly my own ... with no funding from anarchist hippie groups ...
at a community scale - it is definitely possible and is happening in a lot of places in america ... there are many communities that look out for each other ... neighbours driving other neighbours to medical appointments ... making sure people who are sick have food or walking each others pets ... that to me is part of the holistic approach to health care ... it isn't just doctors and medicine ... it's about living healthy lifestyles, support for people who are primary caregivers, etc ...
obviously, the larger issue is when someone requires more aggressive health care (cancer, fractures, etc) ... how do you overcome the current model of insurance and for profit clinics who 9 times out of 10 will prescribe treatment that makes the most money!? ...
So then the question becomes, How do we make this part of the system and something that can by relied upon?
I still think a single-payer healthcare system is the way to address the insurance problem - and that wouldn't be socialized medicine.
On a side note, I need to start using the phrase "previously and henceforth" more often! :P
for what it's worth, i have been to beautiful Cuba, MO....
:fp:
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
when i was runnin around with a canadian gal, her family would go to cuba for the christmas and new year's holiday event. they invited me to come along. i was told i would not make for a good canadian as i lack the proper sound a canadian has when speaking. i was also told to be silent and they'd never know i was an american.
for what it's worth, i have been to beautiful Cuba, MO....
:fp:
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
Rats...
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
for what it's worth, i have been to beautiful Cuba, MO....
:fp:
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
I've been there. It's like the moon. To get there from (I think it was Pueblo Pintado we drove from) you drive for hours believing you're the only one left on earth. It's like The Outer Limits!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
for what it's worth, i have been to beautiful Cuba, MO....
:fp:
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
I've been there. It's like the moon. To get there from (I think it was Pueblo Pintado we drove from) you drive for hours believing you're the only one left on earth. It's like The Outer Limits!
for what it's worth, i have been to beautiful Cuba, MO....
:fp:
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
I've been there. It's like the moon. To get there from (I think it was Pueblo Pintado we drove from) you drive for hours believing you're the only one left on earth. It's like The Outer Limits!
You have a good memory for places! What were you doing in that area? Going to Chaco Canyon, I hope!
I've been to Cuba and it's a beautiful place. I have no personal experience with the health care, but a friend of mine did have to get her foot stitched up after stepping on glass. I'm told the hospital looked unclean and she had to get the stitched redone upon return to Canada.
Here's a pic I snapped of an Ambulance station during my last visit to the island:
I've been to Cuba and it's a beautiful place. I have no personal experience with the health care, but a friend of mine did have to get her foot stitched up after stepping on glass. I'm told the hospital looked unclean and she had to get the stitched redone upon return to Canada.
Here's a pic I snapped of an Ambulance station during my last visit to the island:
Interesting - thanks!
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
You have a good memory for places! What were you doing in that area? Going to Chaco Canyon, I hope!
I did go to Chaco Canyon then but the trip was mainly about visiting friends who were living and teaching at a small school on a reservation. They acknowledged the irony of them being white folks from rural New York teaching Indians on a southwest reservation, but it was a much needed job and these people were very cool about trying to understand the Indians and learn about their indigenous culture. They had strong words of criticism for the way Mormons in the area would come in and talk the Indians into giving them their money by convincing them they knew what was best for them but of course it was all about proselytizing and trying to convert them. While we were there my friends took me to an Indian site much smaller than Chaco that was slated to be bulldozed by oil companies that wanted to put in oil wells because it was "insignificant". This was around 1979 or so and it was an amazing site and the idea that oil might take precedence over an historic First Nations site was sickening. My friends were trying to help preserve the site but I honestly don't know how things turned out. They only stayed a few years and moved on. It was a long time ago.
Oh, and the drive to Cuba was for food. The reservation had no amenities. I was with my first wife who was blonde and the kids on the rez were totally fascinated by her hair color!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
You have a good memory for places! What were you doing in that area? Going to Chaco Canyon, I hope!
I did go to Chaco Canyon then but the trip was mainly about visiting friends who were living and teaching at a small school on a reservation. They acknowledged the irony of them being white folks from rural New York teaching Indians on a southwest reservation, but it was a much needed job and these people were very cool about trying to understand the Indians and learn about their indigenous culture. They had strong words of criticism for the way Mormons in the area would come in and talk the Indians into giving them their money by convincing them they knew what was best for them but of course it was all about proselytizing and trying to convert them. While we were there my friends took me to an Indian site much smaller than Chaco that was slated to be bulldozed by oil companies that wanted to put in oil wells because it was "insignificant". This was around 1979 or so and it was an amazing site and the idea that oil might take precedence over an historic First Nations site was sickening. My friends were trying to help preserve the site but I honestly don't know how things turned out. They only stayed a few years and moved on. It was a long time ago.
Oh, and the drive to Cuba was for food. The reservation had no amenities. I was with my first wife who was blonde and the kids on the rez were totally fascinated by her hair color!
Cool! Well I'm glad you got to see Chaco & the other place before they likely tore it down. That's so sad, but not surprising. I wonder what reservation you were visiting. Navajo, I imagine, since Cuba was the closest town. That's the Rez I lived on in high school, but in a different part.
_
Posts: 6,651
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I've been to Miami. Does that count?
woot.
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Yeah, I know, but I have a bunch of friends (here in the U.S.) who have gone (most of them legally, even).
At this point in my life I wouldn't trade places but I can't help but wonder: which way of life is more sustainable? I think that's a question worth asking.
Interesting. Everyone I know who has gone has great things to say about their healthcare system. Our medical school & community health organizations have even formed a group that goes there to study their system to figure out ways to implement a similar system to improve the health of our communities.
But the difficult task will be to figure out how to recreate their overall model while leaving out some of the totalitarian details. I.e., their system seems to work so well (they often have better health outcomes than we do) because of the great community cooperation. So the big question here is, How do we create that sense of community / social responsibility without it being forced? Anyone ave any good ideas?
you are essentially asking the US to turn into a socialist state ... i don't see it happening ...
We should keep in mind that what I said about Cuban health care is second hand information and the opinion of a few people. If you asked a few people in, say, a U.S. state with the same population as Cuba what they thought the health care system in that state you'd probably get a wide range of answers.
And, yes, as Polaris_x stated, socialism is not likely to happen here (despite our having a Kenyan Maxrist Socialist president... sorry, couldn't resist.
What about on a smaller scale? Plus, we're just talking about healthcare here, not every single aspect of the public welfare. Also, then maybe the question is, How do we create a healthcare system that's as good as Cuba's without "asking the US to turn into a socialist state"? I guess what I'm thinking more about is the sense of community & social responsibility that makes people feel like it's their civic duty to protect the health of themselves and their fellow Cubans. Can we not create such a sense of community without creating a socialist state?
i would say it's possible in a small state like maybe vermont ... i fully believe in the concept of socialized medicine but like everything else - it cannot operate in isolation ... there are many complexities that have to be addressed ... you would have to bring the administration of health care in house, doctors would need to accept a pay scale, taxes would have to go up, all the middle-men that makes health care expensive in the states expensive would need to be cut out ...
conceptually, it makes sense but there are a lot of various interest groups and they all aren't interested in the same goal ...
Sorry, I edited my post.
What about doing it at even just a neighborhood scale? Do you have any ideas about how to address those issues?
ok ... i will qualify this with the fact i am not in healthcare and the opinions expressed previously and henceforth are strictly my own ... with no funding from anarchist hippie groups ...
at a community scale - it is definitely possible and is happening in a lot of places in america ... there are many communities that look out for each other ... neighbours driving other neighbours to medical appointments ... making sure people who are sick have food or walking each others pets ... that to me is part of the holistic approach to health care ... it isn't just doctors and medicine ... it's about living healthy lifestyles, support for people who are primary caregivers, etc ...
obviously, the larger issue is when someone requires more aggressive health care (cancer, fractures, etc) ... how do you overcome the current model of insurance and for profit clinics who 9 times out of 10 will prescribe treatment that makes the most money!? ...
So then the question becomes, How do we make this part of the system and something that can by relied upon?
I still think a single-payer healthcare system is the way to address the insurance problem - and that wouldn't be socialized medicine.
On a side note, I need to start using the phrase "previously and henceforth" more often! :P
:fp:
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
When I was being hired for my current job, they told me I would periodically get to go to Cuba. I was SO excited - until I found out they meant Cuba, NM. :fp:
that's all i got for ya on visiting cuba...
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Rats...
I've been there. It's like the moon. To get there from (I think it was Pueblo Pintado we drove from) you drive for hours believing you're the only one left on earth. It's like The Outer Limits!
Trippy, man...
You have a good memory for places! What were you doing in that area? Going to Chaco Canyon, I hope!
Here's a pic I snapped of an Ambulance station during my last visit to the island:
Interesting - thanks!
I did go to Chaco Canyon then but the trip was mainly about visiting friends who were living and teaching at a small school on a reservation. They acknowledged the irony of them being white folks from rural New York teaching Indians on a southwest reservation, but it was a much needed job and these people were very cool about trying to understand the Indians and learn about their indigenous culture. They had strong words of criticism for the way Mormons in the area would come in and talk the Indians into giving them their money by convincing them they knew what was best for them but of course it was all about proselytizing and trying to convert them. While we were there my friends took me to an Indian site much smaller than Chaco that was slated to be bulldozed by oil companies that wanted to put in oil wells because it was "insignificant". This was around 1979 or so and it was an amazing site and the idea that oil might take precedence over an historic First Nations site was sickening. My friends were trying to help preserve the site but I honestly don't know how things turned out. They only stayed a few years and moved on. It was a long time ago.
Oh, and the drive to Cuba was for food. The reservation had no amenities. I was with my first wife who was blonde and the kids on the rez were totally fascinated by her hair color!
Cool! Well I'm glad you got to see Chaco & the other place before they likely tore it down. That's so sad, but not surprising. I wonder what reservation you were visiting. Navajo, I imagine, since Cuba was the closest town. That's the Rez I lived on in high school, but in a different part.