Arcade Fire

135

Comments

  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    Tour's off to a great start


  • Hawk123
    Hawk123 Posts: 2,369
    Some people are having fun with the setlists


  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,599
    pjhawks said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    It’s great that dirt balls are getting called out. It’s brutal when it’s a band you love so much. Fuck you Win. 
    I mean cheating on his wife and sleeping with fans is scum behavior but seems they were all consenting adults.  It’s not a great look but I’m not a big fan of gotcha reporting like this either.  I go back and forth on it
    It sounds like he made advances on women and they declined and he moved on.  Maybe some mixed signals in there or he doesn't read the room very well?

    I only read the first 2 stories though so if they got worse after that I'll go back and read.
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    Feist is off the tour. They're doing a US run with Beck in a couple months so interesting to see how that will shake out. 

    https://www.brooklynvegan.com/feist-drops-off-arcade-fire-tour-following-allegations-against-win-butler/
  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Like you said, though, the accusations against Win go beyond merely sleeping with fans.
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,599
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    It looked as if he thought it was wrong because he was still married, he claims anything else was consensual.
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    edited September 2022
    pjl44 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Its depends on the relationship, but I think if you have someone who looks up to you in some capacity, there isn't a balanced playing field. I mean, artists shouldn't really be fucking fans. 

    Or Teachers fucking students, or bosses/subordinates, coaches/players etc...


    Post edited by Tim Simmons on
  • nicknyr15
    nicknyr15 Posts: 9,334
    Tim Simmons said:
    pjl44 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Its depends on the relationship, but I think if you have someone who looks up to you in some capacity, there isn't a balanced playing field. I mean, artists shouldn't really be fucking fans. 

    Or Teachers fucking students, or bosses/subordinates, coaches/players etc...


    Not sure that’s a fair comparison. Teachers have how many students? There’s plenty of options. Basically if you’re famous in any way shape or form you should only be with other celebrities? 
  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    Tim Simmons said:
    pjl44 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Its depends on the relationship, but I think if you have someone who looks up to you in some capacity, there isn't a balanced playing field. I mean, artists shouldn't really be fucking fans. 

    Or Teachers fucking students, or bosses/subordinates, coaches/players etc...


    I don't think artist/fan is at all like any of those other relationships 
  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    edited September 2022
    nicknyr15 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    pjl44 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Its depends on the relationship, but I think if you have someone who looks up to you in some capacity, there isn't a balanced playing field. I mean, artists shouldn't really be fucking fans. 

    Or Teachers fucking students, or bosses/subordinates, coaches/players etc...


    Basically if you’re famous in any way shape or form you should only be with other celebrities? 
    That's it. Once you step foot on a stage when do you have to cease sleeping with anyone who comes to a show?
    Post edited by pjl44 on
  • 1ThoughtKnown
    1ThoughtKnown Posts: 6,155
    nicknyr15 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    pjl44 said:
    Tim Simmons said:
    I don't know. There was a power dynamic discrepancy there. Most of the girls were fans. To take advantage of it is sleezy. Yeah, it was commonplace in rock and roll for some time, but it seems the culture has tired of that and rightfully so.

    There is some grayness to some of the interactions, but he admitted it was top to bottom wrong and thats the line right there. 

    An artist and someone who appreciates their art should be able to have consensual sex without any inherent issue. If that relationship creates an imbalance, where does that begin? Do the same rules apply to Bono and someone who plays a local club? Is it once you go out on your first national headline tour that you officially have some additional responsibility?

    Its depends on the relationship, but I think if you have someone who looks up to you in some capacity, there isn't a balanced playing field. I mean, artists shouldn't really be fucking fans. 

    Or Teachers fucking students, or bosses/subordinates, coaches/players etc...


    Not sure that’s a fair comparison. Teachers have how many students? There’s plenty of options. Basically if you’re famous in any way shape or form you should only be with other celebrities? 

    It’s not a fair comparison. It makes zero sense. 
    A rock star or sports star can only date someone who has no idea who they are? Ridiculous. 
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    Fine. But threading that needle is incredibly tough. I'm sure its possible though. But if someone looks up to you, theres a power imbalance. Their feelings toward you are influenced. Its incredibly difficult to tell if they are into you or just the idea of you. And in this particular case, the starts of these relationships that Win had, that came into play.
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,599
    Tim Simmons said:
    Fine. But threading that needle is incredibly tough. I'm sure its possible though. But if someone looks up to you, theres a power imbalance. Their feelings toward you are influenced. Its incredibly difficult to tell if they are into you or just the idea of you. And in this particular case, the starts of these relationships that Win had, that came into play.
    Every person w money that dates someone below them then?  Same thing?
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    edited September 2022
    Im sure it happens there at times. Sure. But people usually don’t go around advertising what their worth is. 
    Post edited by Tim Simmons on
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    edited September 2022
    Also, to be clear, there is more to this than power dynamic 
    Post edited by Tim Simmons on
  • 1ThoughtKnown
    1ThoughtKnown Posts: 6,155
    edited September 2022
    Tim Simmons said:
    Fine. But threading that needle is incredibly tough. I'm sure its possible though. But if someone looks up to you, theres a power imbalance. Their feelings toward you are influenced. Its incredibly difficult to tell if they are into you or just the idea of you. And in this particular case, the starts of these relationships that Win had, that came into play.
    Wait a minute, this is flawed logic. There is no power imbalance here. What is he going to do? They’ll them “Get naked or” what? You can’t attend my shows? Can’t buy my next record? Can’t listen to AF on the radio? 
    What can Win Butler possibly do to this person if they tell him to fack off when he takes a shot? 

    When you are a boss, teacher or coach for example, the harassment is generally accompanied by some veiled threats. This is where the power imbalance is obvious.  I just don’t see that here. 
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 9,939
    you’re being purposely obtuse with your hypotheticals. The power imbalance comes by him taking advantage of the stars in their eyes type adoration they have for him. He knows that they are into him, even if it isn’t attraction or sexual, and using that adoration to get him gratification in some way. 

    But to answer your first question, “what is he going to do”? Well, like what actually happened, Win can keep texting you, texting dick pics, show up to your house, continue to make sexual advances despite a protest. That’s sexually aggressive behavior, but for most of those girls, it started with the power imbalance. 
  • 1ThoughtKnown
    1ThoughtKnown Posts: 6,155
    Tim Simmons said:
    you’re being purposely obtuse with your hypotheticals. The power imbalance comes by him taking advantage of the stars in their eyes type adoration they have for him. He knows that they are into him, even if it isn’t attraction or sexual, and using that adoration to get him gratification in some way. 

    But to answer your first question, “what is he going to do”? Well, like what actually happened, Win can keep texting you, texting dick pics, show up to your house, continue to make sexual advances despite a protest. That’s sexually aggressive behavior, but for most of those girls, it started with the power imbalance. 
    I’ll admit I haven’t paid a lick of attention to any of the accusations here, only because I have grown tired of the cancel culture and the way society (Twatter) now decides everyone is guilty when the pillar of a free society is that you are presumed innocent until proven guilty. 

    As a person who has been wrongly accused of something in the past it is a touchy subject for me. I apologize for coming across aggressively. 

    I still don’t get this though. If a woman is fond of you for what you do professionally, it is “unethical” to pursue relations due to a power imbalance? Sounds like he had a real thing for a few fans and his better judgement disappeared when all the blood went you know where.

    Not defending his behaviour, it’s pretty juvenile and despicable if true. However, the pendulum in this power imbalance thing has swung a little too far in my opinion. Luckily playing on the pendulum throws farther out to the one side swinging has to sweep back the other way. 
  • pjl44
    pjl44 Posts: 10,581
    Tim Simmons said:
    Im sure it happens there at times. Sure. But people usually don’t go around advertising what their worth is. 
    Their clothes, their job, their car. "At times?" You wanna talk about being purposely obtuse.

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