Obama violating rights...STRUCK DOWN!

usamamasan1

It's a good step back to the right direction, peolpes rights.

ATLANTA (AP) — A federal appeals court has struck down the requirement in President Barack Obama's health care overhaul package that virtually all Americans must carry health insurance or face penalties.

A divided three-judge panel of the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals on Friday struck down the so-called individual mandate, siding with 26 states that had sued to block the law.

But the decision didn't go as far as a lower court that had invalidated the entire overhaul as unconstitutional.

The states and other critics say the law violates people's rights. The Justice Department counters that the legislative branch was exercising a "quintessential" power.

An appeals court and three federal judges have upheld the law, and two have invalidated it. Experts say the debate ultimately will be decided by the U.S. Supreme Court.

gimmesometruth27

pass UNIVERSAL SINGLE PAYER and be done with it...

EdsonNascimento

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

pass UNIVERSAL SINGLE PAYER and be done with it...

Yeah, so this way we can wait on line for necessary care and rich bastards can get premium service anyway!

gimmesometruth27

EdsonNascimento wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

pass UNIVERSAL SINGLE PAYER and be done with it...

Yeah, so this way we can wait on line for necessary care and rich bastards can get premium service anyway!

yeah because obama is going to be able to pass anything at all the next 2 years...

the system as it is is fucked. medicare for all is the way to go.

EdsonNascimento

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

medicare for all is the way to go.

No it is not.

gimmesometruth27

EdsonNascimento wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

medicare for all is the way to go.

No it is not.

it is better than what we have now.

for profit insurance companies do not care about you, or your mommy, or your little kids. they care about your money. they care about profits over patients. they care about getting your premiums, and if you don't pay your premiums, you get dropped.

doctors have to charge more to make a profit because they have to hire additional staff just to fight with the insurance companies who do not want to pay for anything.

do you know how much we charge for a cortisone injecion?
$300 bucks.

do you know how much of that is actually paid to us by united health care or blue cross?
$80

do you know how much time our entire billing department, that we have had to hire the last 3 years, spends on the phone trying to get that claim paid? on average 19 minutes per call per patient. most times they fail to get any more money from the insurance company, so that gets passed on to the patient, and alot of times they don't pay us. so we have to write it off, and we have to see more people, which creates the "long lines" you spoke about...

do you know how much an active ankle ankle brace costs to be billed through your insurance company?
$98

you can buy the thing yourself at a store for $45, and if it goes through your insurance you still have a 10% to 20% co-pay, plus deductable charges which often times comes out to be a little more expensive than if you buy it at the store...the insurance company HAS to make it's money above all else...

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

a universal system would cut all of these additional costs and red tape....

EdsonNascimento

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

it is better than what we have now.

for profit insurance companies do not care about you, or your mommy, or your little kids. they care about your money. they care about profits over patients. they care about getting your premiums, and if you don't pay your premiums, you get dropped.

doctors have to charge more to make a profit because they have to hire additional staff just to fight with the insurance companies who do not want to pay for anything.

do you know how much we charge for a cortisone injecion?
$300 bucks.

do you know how much of that is actually paid to us by united health care or blue cross?
$80

do you know how much time our entire billing department, that we have had to hire the last 3 years, spends on the phone trying to get that claim paid? on average 19 minutes per call per patient. most times they fail to get any more money from the insurance company, so that gets passed on to the patient, and alot of times they don't pay us. so we have to write it off, and we have to see more people, which creates the "long lines" you spoke about...

do you know how much an active ankle ankle brace costs to be billed through your insurance company?
$98

you can buy the thing yourself at a store for $45, and if it goes through your insurance you still have a 10% to 20% co-pay, plus deductable charges which often times comes out to be a little more expensive than if you buy it at the store...the insurance company HAS to make it's money above all else...

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

a universal system would cut all of these additional costs and red tape....

Your beginning premise is wrong. It's a nice sound bite. But, in fact - wrong.

EdsonNascimento

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

fife

EdsonNascimento wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

it is better than what we have now.

for profit insurance companies do not care about you, or your mommy, or your little kids. they care about your money. they care about profits over patients. they care about getting your premiums, and if you don't pay your premiums, you get dropped.

doctors have to charge more to make a profit because they have to hire additional staff just to fight with the insurance companies who do not want to pay for anything.

do you know how much we charge for a cortisone injecion?
$300 bucks.

do you know how much of that is actually paid to us by united health care or blue cross?
$80

do you know how much time our entire billing department, that we have had to hire the last 3 years, spends on the phone trying to get that claim paid? on average 19 minutes per call per patient. most times they fail to get any more money from the insurance company, so that gets passed on to the patient, and alot of times they don't pay us. so we have to write it off, and we have to see more people, which creates the "long lines" you spoke about...

do you know how much an active ankle ankle brace costs to be billed through your insurance company?
$98

you can buy the thing yourself at a store for $45, and if it goes through your insurance you still have a 10% to 20% co-pay, plus deductable charges which often times comes out to be a little more expensive than if you buy it at the store...the insurance company HAS to make it's money above all else...

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

a universal system would cut all of these additional costs and red tape....

Your beginning premise is wrong. It's a nice sound bite. But, in fact - wrong.

so you believe that the insurance company does care about you?

EdsonNascimento

fife wrote:

so you believe that the insurance company does care about you?

I don't think. I know. But, even if you don't and you think all they are after is profit - well, for a FACT the easiest way for a insurance company/health plan to make money is for you to be healthy. If you don't have any medical expenses, health insurance is quite a profitable business to be in. So, ergo - they want you to be healthy, they care about you. A better question is - does your doctor care about you?

So, think of it from that stand point rather than what the media and a few bitter providers would lead you to believe.

Go Beavers

EdsonNascimento wrote:

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

My personal experience in mental health has been that billing my work through Medicaid has way less red tape, fewer people in the middle, and less ethical concerns/issues about payer dictating treatment when compared to private insurance.

EdsonNascimento

Go Beavers wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

My personal experience in mental health has been that billing my work through Medicaid has way less red tape, fewer people in the middle, and less ethical concerns/issues about payer dictating treatment when compared to private insurance.

Ah! So you don't like second opinions! You just like the tax payers to pick up the cost of unnecessary treatment. Providers make money by providing services - Not PROPER services in government run health care - but simply services.

So, again I ask - does your doctor care about you?

81

EdsonNascimento wrote:

does your doctor care about you?

like a lot of things in life, it depends on the doctor.

some are good and do care, some just want to line their pockets.

fife

EdsonNascimento wrote:

fife wrote:

so you believe that the insurance company does care about you?

I don't think. I know. But, even if you don't and you think all they are after is profit - well, for a FACT the easiest way for a insurance company/health plan to make money is for you to be healthy. If you don't have any medical expenses, health insurance is quite a profitable business to be in. So, ergo - they want you to be healthy, they care about you. A better question is - does your doctor care about you?

So, think of it from that stand point rather than what the media and a few bitter providers would lead you to believe.

I can see your point however i don't agree. the 2 ways that health insurance can make money which we agree is the point is a) make sure your always healthy and maybe you will find a insurance company that will call you to make sure your living a healthy life or b take your money and when you really need them they say sorry. you know that this happens.

EdsonNascimento

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

do you know how much an active ankle ankle brace costs to be billed through your insurance company?
$98

you can buy the thing yourself at a store for $45, and if it goes through your insurance you still have a 10% to 20% co-pay, plus deductable charges which often times comes out to be a little more expensive than if you buy it at the store...the insurance company HAS to make it's money above all else...

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

So, when you tell your patient to get an ankle brace, do you tell them this?

Hey, your deductible is more than the thing will cost you in the store. Why don't you go get it there rather than getting it from me?

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

gimmesometruth27

EdsonNascimento wrote:

fife wrote:

so you believe that the insurance company does care about you?

I don't think. I know. But, even if you don't and you think all they are after is profit - well, for a FACT the easiest way for a insurance company/health plan to make money is for you to be healthy. If you don't have any medical expenses, health insurance is quite a profitable business to be in. So, ergo - they want you to be healthy, they care about you. A better question is - does your doctor care about you?

So, think of it from that stand point rather than what the media and a few bitter providers would lead you to believe.

if your insurance cares about you so much, why are "well visits" such as annual physical exams rarely covered?

do you know what an annual preparticipation physical costs? $168. and 95% of the time it is not covered by any insurance. not one. they have to have a certain rider in their policy to have well visits covered, and that rider costs more per policy. the vast majority of policies do not contain coverage for well visits.

if your insurance comapany wanted you to he healthy, wouldn't you want them to not only encourage, but actually PAY FOR these physical exams?

i work in the industry, i witness this bullshit happen every single day...

the only things that are guaranteed to pay, albeit at a discounted rate, is medicare and medicaid. those are the only ones that we know will pay us for sure. and they are the only ones that will pay $100% of the time, aside from tricare, which is coincidently enough, government funded insurance...

Parachute

EdsonNascimento wrote:

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

TRUTH: keep speaking it.

fife

EdsonNascimento wrote:

Go Beavers wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

My personal experience in mental health has been that billing my work through Medicaid has way less red tape, fewer people in the middle, and less ethical concerns/issues about payer dictating treatment when compared to private insurance.

Ah! So you don't like second opinions! You just like the tax payers to pick up the cost of unnecessary treatment. Providers make money by providing services - Not PROPER services in government run health care - but simply services.

So, again I ask - does your doctor care about you?

no where did he say he didn't want a second opinion. one of the major issues i have read here about uhc is that people don't want the government to tell them what they can do with their bodies but have no problem in insurance companies saying sorry we will not fund this procedure as we don't believe that it is necessary.

gimmesometruth27

EdsonNascimento wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

do you know how much an active ankle ankle brace costs to be billed through your insurance company?
$98

you can buy the thing yourself at a store for $45, and if it goes through your insurance you still have a 10% to 20% co-pay, plus deductable charges which often times comes out to be a little more expensive than if you buy it at the store...the insurance company HAS to make it's money above all else...

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

So, when you tell your patient to get an ankle brace, do you tell them this?

Hey, your deductible is more than the thing will cost you in the store. Why don't you go get it there rather than getting it from me?

and people wonder why health care is so expensive...

actually yes i do. i tell them to go get it elsewhere.

we do not bill for the braces, the manufacurer bills the insurance companies. some doctors buy product and bill the patient for it so they make a profit. we don't. we have an arrangement with the manufacturer that if someone can use a brace we give it to them and the manufacturer bills the insurance and is reimbursed. we lose out on a lot of money doing it this way instead of the buy and bill way, but we avoid the headaches and red tape of trying to get paid by insurance companies. let them work for that money themselves.

i am a patient advocate, so if i can save them money out of pocket by sending them elsewhere that is what i do.

fife

Parachute wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

As is your ending premise - the thought that federal gov't cuts any expense and red tape is laughable.

TRUTH: keep speaking it.

as a person from a country in which the government does in fact pay the bills for health coverage i can say i nor my doctor has every had an issue.

EdsonNascimento

81 wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

does your doctor care about you?

like a lot of things in life, it depends on the doctor.

some are good and do care, some just want to line their pockets.

100%. And I believe there are more good than bad (at least in intentions). Unfortunately, the bad run up such unnecessary (and some times dangerous) costs that everyone gets affected.

Did you know that if you have a doctors visit within 7 days of discharge from hospital your chances of being readmitted go down 60%? And that includes elderly, sick patients. And did you know that most doctors, knowing this, still don't follow up with their patients within 7 days of discharge from the hospital?

So, sometimes it takes more than just good intentions. And, that's what good managed care companies do. Make sure these visits occur. And you know what? They happily pay the "extra" expense of the "extra" visit to the doctor to keep you healthy and out of the worst place to be whether you healthy or sick - the hospital (for lengths of stay greater than 3 days, you're more likely to catch a hospital bourn illness than see any great improvement in condition). Would a government run, single payer system do this?

And, yes, the managed care company makes a profit off this.