'job creators' aka rich folk

RFTC

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

BinauralJam

A Black President, wait Nope, a Women President, wait Nope Socialism, wait Nope Communism, wait nope a Dicator, Wait Nope, Etc, rinse and repeat... We are not that bright after all.

RFTC

BinauralJam wrote:

A Black President, wait Nope, a Women President, wait Nope Socialism, wait Nope Communism, wait nope a Dicator, Wait Nope, Etc, rinse and repeat... We are not that bright after all.

is this sorta way of saying, 'meet the new boss, same as the old boss"?

Prince Of Dorkness

Not to be any more of a stuck up douchebag than I already am... but Tax cuts or no... I have as many employees as I need. I don't spend all my money, I spend as much as I need to and I put the rest in my bank and let it sit there.

It's the poor people and the middle class who create jobs. They spend money. They spend most and sometimes all of their money. They don't have the option to put it in the bank and let it fester.

Many people in what I hesitate to call "my tax bracket" have spent a lot of money to convince people with less money that if they shell out all their money and let us keep ours, those of us with more money will be more likely to give ours to them.

Because they're gullible.

And as soon as they start to pay attention, a politician is caught cheating on his wife or gay marriage somehow passes by a Republican house somewhere and people get distracted.

CH156378

don't you have to create jobs to be called "job creators". maybe we should call them "job shippers"

RFTC

CH156378 wrote:

don't you have to create jobs to be called "job creators". maybe we should call them "job shippers"

bingo-that's the missing point/effect of corp tax breaks and lowering personal tax brackets, the $ is not being reinvested in US jobs.

i love our country and feel very fortunate to be here but the gullibility (as another poster said) and our blinding aspiration to be millionaires has caused us to become deaf and blind to how we treat the 1%'rs & the fortune 500.

we need someone to step up on a public platform to educate what the financial realities of our policy makers. who is out there? Taibi, Krugman (not charasmatic enough), ???, get the feeling Zinn would have been all over this, i miss him more than ever.

Electric_Delta

Damn capitalists. Long live the proletariat!

polaris_x

the problem is in the model ... if the economic model was designed to provide jobs for people - it would ... but the current model is about exploiting policy, tax loopholes and a weak democracy to maximize profits for the wealthy ...

people believe what they want to believe despite the evidence in front of their very eyes ... are you surprised that a country that is based on amassing as much wealth is possible is actually succeeding? ...

Parachute

OP is a marching member of The Confused.

If liberal radio hadn't failed, you would be a rock star.

moving on...

inmytree

RFTC wrote:

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

Prince Of Dorkness

Electric_Delta wrote:

Damn capitalists. Long live the proletariat!

OK, all you want....

Where do you think my income comes from?

You think I just wave my wand and it appears? (OK, I guess in a very warped way, you could say that, but I digress..)

No... it comes from customers buying what I'm producing. And unless a company is making nothing but private jets and 75-foot yachts... who do you think those customers are?.

So let's lower the burden on my customers and maybe they can buy even more and make more sales for me.

We'll call it "Trickle Up Economics" since Ronald Reagan, long may be burn in Hell where he belongs, was OBVIOUSLY wrong about that "Trickle Down" bullshit. Since "shit" is the only thing that trickled down to the "proletariat" as you so obnoxiously call the 99% of Americans who make America work.

Prince Of Dorkness

inmytree wrote:

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

You notice how they're all just making jokes about the OP and pretending they didn't see what I'm saying? :roll:

inmytree

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

inmytree wrote:

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

You notice how they're all just making jokes about the OP and pretending they didn't see what I'm saying? :roll:

yup, I noticed....

polaris_x

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

inmytree wrote:

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

You notice how they're all just making jokes about the OP and pretending they didn't see what I'm saying? :roll:

there isn't a lot of critical thinking ... just regurgitated talking points they heard on fox or wherever ...

Parachute

inmytree wrote:

RFTC wrote:

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

Funny that all you ever do is agree.

inmytree

Parachute wrote:

inmytree wrote:

RFTC wrote:

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

Funny that all you ever do is agree.

I disagree...

Prince Of Dorkness

polaris_x wrote:

there isn't a lot of critical thinking ... just regurgitated talking points they heard on fox or wherever ...

Unsung does the same in any "Libertarian" thread. One can write a very detailed, point-by-point take-down of his posts. He'll ignore you entirely and then wait for you to reply to someone else and respond with "source?" or "Does that include [insert something totally unrelated meant to derail the argument he's losing]" or "I think you better exit from this thread before you say anything else."

They can barf up sound bytes fed to them by Ayn Rand fans but once you actually want to talk.. no, they stick their fingers in their ears and scream "LALALLALALLALA"

Parachute

touche!

Parachute

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

there isn't a lot of critical thinking ... just regurgitated talking points they heard on fox or wherever ...

Unsung does the same in any "Libertarian" thread. One can write a very detailed, point-by-point take-down of his posts. He'll ignore you entirely and then wait for you to reply to someone else and respond with "source?" or "Does that include [insert something totally unrelated meant to derail the argument he's losing]" or "I think you better exit from this thread before you say anything else."

They can barf up sound bytes fed to them by Ayn Rand fans but once you actually want to talk.. no, they stick their fingers in their ears and scream "LALALLALALLALA"

Whats wrong w/ Ayn Rand?

Prince Of Dorkness

Parachute wrote:

Whats wrong w/ Ayn Rand?

In what Respect, Charlie?

pandora

I get sick of all the fighting...

the greed, the selfish, the narrow minded, the me me me.

The stubborn to the point of allowing our country to fall apart because
there can be no compromise.

What good does this accomplish... absolutely none
bickering gets nothing done or maybe this is the 'sham plan'.

When this happens in a marriage those, once in love, they divorce.

When this happens between friends, soon they are enemies.

When this happens in a country it is stagnant and sinks
while it's people drown....
well except those with yachts.

I guess when we are drowning we might come together and really fight,
not bicker,
we will fight for our lives and the right to a decent honest country that belongs to us.

Parachute

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

Parachute wrote:

Whats wrong w/ Ayn Rand?

In what Respect, Charlie?

That's what I'm asking? You said "barfing up facts fed to them by Ayn Rand fans".

And if that was a Top Gun reference, color me impressed.

RFTC

Parachute wrote:

OP is a marching member of The Confused.

If liberal radio hadn't failed, you would be a rock star.

moving on...

sorry that you cannot face the facts mister,

effective tax rates have been slashed over the last 10 years, % of revenues versus GDP has shrunk from 18% to 14%, yes spending has increased from 18-23% and i acknowledge that needs to be dealt with as well.

stop listening to the sound bytes and review the math.

Sludge Factory

RFTC wrote:

Parachute wrote:

OP is a marching member of The Confused.

If liberal radio hadn't failed, you would be a rock star.

moving on...

sorry that you cannot face the facts mister,

effective tax rates have been slashed over the last 10 years, % of revenues versus GDP has shrunk from 18% to 14%, yes spending has increased from 18-23% and i acknowledge that needs to be dealt with as well.

stop listening to the sound bytes and review the math.

I think revenues have decreased to 14% not because we need to raise taxes, but because we are in a recession. Less people spending money/being employed = less revenues collected. Just raising the taxes on an economy that is already in a depression won't yield the increase in revenues that so many people believe it will.

Electric_Delta

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

Electric_Delta wrote:

Damn capitalists. Long live the proletariat!

OK, all you want....

Where do you think my income comes from?

You think I just wave my wand and it appears? (OK, I guess in a very warped way, you could say that, but I digress..)

No... it comes from customers buying what I'm producing. And unless a company is making nothing but private jets and 75-foot yachts... who do you think those customers are?.

So let's lower the burden on my customers and maybe they can buy even more and make more sales for me.

We'll call it "Trickle Up Economics" since Ronald Reagan, long may be burn in Hell where he belongs, was OBVIOUSLY wrong about that "Trickle Down" bullshit. Since "shit" is the only thing that trickled down to the "proletariat" as you so obnoxiously call the 99% of Americans who make America work.

99%? Wrong. Half don't pay income taxes.

RFTC

Sludge Factory wrote:

RFTC wrote:

Parachute wrote:

OP is a marching member of The Confused.

If liberal radio hadn't failed, you would be a rock star.

moving on...

sorry that you cannot face the facts mister,

effective tax rates have been slashed over the last 10 years, % of revenues versus GDP has shrunk from 18% to 14%, yes spending has increased from 18-23% and i acknowledge that needs to be dealt with as well.

stop listening to the sound bytes and review the math.

I think revenues have decreased to 14% not because we need to raise taxes, but because we are in a recession. Less people spending money/being employed = less revenues collected. Just raising the taxes on an economy that is already in a depression won't yield the increase in revenues that so many people believe it will.

good points, i never wrote nor advocate just raising taxes. hell, i hate them and look for every legal deduction possible. i do feel that asking select classes of our population to bear majority of pain is a problem. i do take issue w/ANY discussion of limiting tax loopholes for the wealthiest class being offlimits or a 'dealbreaker' in dealing w/this mess.

Prince Of Dorkness

Electric_Delta wrote:

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

So let's lower the burden on my customers and maybe they can buy even more and make more sales for me.

We'll call it "Trickle Up Economics" since Ronald Reagan, long may be burn in Hell where he belongs, was OBVIOUSLY wrong about that "Trickle Down" bullshit. Since "shit" is the only thing that trickled down to the "proletariat" as you so obnoxiously call the 99% of Americans who make America work.

99%? Wrong. Half don't pay income taxes.

But they DO pay for rent, gas, food, clothes, entertainment, cars, houses, ballet lessons, internet porn, cable TV, TVs, iPods, books, magazines, shampoo, makeup, sex toys and dog food, right?

They're the ones who actually keep the economy going.

You think it's all just the top 2% who keep Walmart in business? When's the last time YOU saw Paris Hilton at the local Home Depot?

You ever run into the Koch brothers at Target?

No... this country is kept (barely) going because of the people who spend their money. NOT the ones who stockpile it.

Electric_Delta

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

But they DO pay for rent, gas, food, clothes, entertainment, cars, houses, ballet lessons, internet porn, cable TV, TVs, iPods, books, magazines, shampoo, makeup, sex toys and dog food, right?

They're the ones who actually keep the economy going.

You think it's all just the top 2% who keep Walmart in business? When's the last time YOU saw Paris Hilton at the local Home Depot?

You ever run into the Koch brothers at Target?

No... this country is kept (barely) going because of the people who spend their money. NOT the ones who stockpile it.

Who owns the companies that produce those consumer goods? Those diabolical "rich people."

Prince Of Dorkness

Electric_Delta wrote:

[

Who owns the companies that produce those consumer goods? Those diabolical "rich people."

Well actually... no. Most of those huge companies are owned by stock holders, many of whom aren't "rich."

And it's not the rich people who are keeping those companies in business. Or are you unable to understand that it's not the super-rich 1% who are BUYING all those consumer goods? A business won't STAY in business if there is no business to be done.

AND if the poor and middle class aren't able to buy things... they're not going to spend money. And those companies will go under.

Are you incapable of understanding such a simple concept?

JOEJOEJOE

inmytree wrote:

RFTC wrote:

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

If my Ferrari I'm a-waxin', don't come a-taxin'!

inmytree

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

inmytree wrote:

RFTC wrote:

the debt limit negotiations and corresponding parade of idealogical stances are really starting to paint our 'leaders' into a corner. i for 1 love that fact that boehner and fellow gop are putting all their chips behind the 'job creators', who the fk are these people? take a look at any hiring graph (microbusiness, to SMB) over the last 8 years and the bush tax cuts HAVE NOT produced jobs.

take another look at exec pay over the last 10 years and it becomes even more apparent. tax breaks and corresponding tax loop holes are not reinvested back into economy (aka trickle down) economic theories.

want to curb excess exec pay really quick? tax the fk out of multi-millionaires, board members (who approve these packages) will loathe their income being taxed by uncle sam, guess what happens next? an easing of exec pay standards to hopefully back to some logical ratio to the middle manager/salaried employee.

i am grating against BOTH parties as our defense budget is once again immune to these deficit reduction negotiations. both parties are beholden to defense contractors. meanwhile our children, young adults, lower & middle class, and elderly will get rat fkd.

when will the middle class in america stand up, austerity measures in europe have united people, what will it take for this to happen in america?

great post....

too bad those who disagree will only offer bumper sticker phrases and nothing else...

If my Ferrari I'm a-waxin', don't come a-taxin'!