PJ's "curfew" at Madison Square Garden

shemp1178

Can anyone explain to me how that works?? I was at MSG Tuesday night for the second of two tour-ending shows by Neil Young (f-ing unbelievable show!!), and both nights ended well after 12:30am, without any apparent mention of a curfew.

This got me thinking about Eddie mentioning getting the curfew pushed back both nights earlier this summer (and breaking it back in 2003) - was he bullshitting us or what?? (if I recall correctly shows were ending a little after 11:00pm, no?)

Now, I'm a tried and true PJ fan, going back to Lolla '92, so it really doesn't matter either way, but I was just curious if this "curfew" actually does exist at MSG.

Any thoughts, comments??

HermanBloom

Interesting?

nuzzer1

thought the same damn thing. maybe ed himself has a curfew? ha

goodroc

when you charge $250 for a ticket i guess you can pay to break curfew--

Dreams Are Trash

Yeah, I believe Ed has started to use the whole curfew thing as a prop to get the crowd psyched. Every show now... "No curfew tonight", "We're just getting started", "We're not going anywhere", etc. but they're all the same, 2 hours and 20 minutes. Which I think is plenty long, actually.

jamminpearls

curfew or not they kick ass every show

CJMST3K

shemp1178 wrote:

Can anyone explain to me how that works?? I was at MSG Tuesday night for the second of two tour-ending shows by Neil Young (f-ing unbelievable show!!), and both nights ended well after 12:30am, without any apparent mention of a curfew.

This got me thinking about Eddie mentioning getting the curfew pushed back both nights earlier this summer (and breaking it back in 2003) - was he bullshitting us or what?? (if I recall correctly shows were ending a little after 11:00pm, no?)

Now, I'm a tried and true PJ fan, going back to Lolla '92, so it really doesn't matter either way, but I was just curious if this "curfew" actually does exist at MSG.

Any thoughts, comments??

Coincidentally, I used to work in the production department, as well as for promoters at.... wait for it... Madison Sq. Garden!

Anyway, the curfew is very real, and very expensive. I remember when Neil played Jones Beach in... 97 I think, I was in the office backstage and the production manager called me on the radio a few times to give him the time. Neil was jamming, and was about the break curfew there. I think Young's manager gave him a look from the side of the stage, rubbing his five fingers together in the "expensive" gesture, and the jam ended moments later.

At MSG - pretty much EVERYONE from the Loaders (teamsters) to the stagehands (IATSE local 1) to the electricians (ibew) to the security and ushers (i think them too) are union. This means that when you go past 11pm, you are paying them ALL more. In NYC, the union is the strictest of anywhere I've been to on the east coast. Curfew is a strict 11pm in most concert venues in the NY area.

Here's the rule of thumb. If you're a band playing at MSG, and it's 10:59pm... the unions typically give a grace that if you you're finishing up a song, and you're done by 11:02pm, then you're ok. But lets say it's 10:59pm and you START another song... pretty much, you just bought another hour for everyone in every union in the building, even if you end at 11:05pm.

The thing I never understood is that, for those bands which break curfew, and it's now 11:10pm, fucking play the rest of the hour... you bought it! May as well get your money's worth.

Now, I'm assuming that the curfew has not changed over the last few years since I worked there, and I don't think that it has. I think that now with ticket prices going higher and higher that bands that are likely to break curfew probably now build that into the price of their tickets. What's another $1.50 on a $65 ticket? No one would ever know and that gives you $25k to pay the overtime. I think that there probably are some negotiations with the unions in advance of the performance, if they know they're gonna play later than curfew.

Hope that helps ya!

(ps: the view of the soundcheck from behind the band at MSG with Ed coaching the gospel singers in the songs was priceless)

NYbenben

There ususally IS a curfew at MSG... it is 11pm before the union overtime kicks in... I guess Uncle Neil took care of that issue ($$$) before the show stared.

nuzzer1

CJMST3K wrote:

shemp1178 wrote:

Can anyone explain to me how that works?? I was at MSG Tuesday night for the second of two tour-ending shows by Neil Young (f-ing unbelievable show!!), and both nights ended well after 12:30am, without any apparent mention of a curfew.

This got me thinking about Eddie mentioning getting the curfew pushed back both nights earlier this summer (and breaking it back in 2003) - was he bullshitting us or what?? (if I recall correctly shows were ending a little after 11:00pm, no?)

Now, I'm a tried and true PJ fan, going back to Lolla '92, so it really doesn't matter either way, but I was just curious if this "curfew" actually does exist at MSG.

Any thoughts, comments??

great info! thanks so much!

Coincidentally, I used to work in the production department, as well as for promoters at.... wait for it... Madison Sq. Garden!

Anyway, the curfew is very real, and very expensive. I remember when Neil played Jones Beach in... 97 I think, I was in the office backstage and the production manager called me on the radio a few times to give him the time. Neil was jamming, and was about the break curfew there. I think Young's manager gave him a look from the side of the stage, rubbing his five fingers together in the "expensive" gesture, and the jam ended moments later.

At MSG - pretty much EVERYONE from the Loaders (teamsters) to the stagehands (IATSE local 1) to the electricians (ibew) to the security and ushers (i think them too) are union. This means that when you go past 11pm, you are paying them ALL more. In NYC, the union is the strictest of anywhere I've been to on the east coast. Curfew is a strict 11pm in most concert venues in the NY area.

Here's the rule of thumb. If you're a band playing at MSG, and it's 10:59pm... the unions typically give a grace that if you you're finishing up a song, and you're done by 11:02pm, then you're ok. But lets say it's 10:59pm and you START another song... pretty much, you just bought another hour for everyone in every union in the building, even if you end at 11:05pm.

The thing I never understood is that, for those bands which break curfew, and it's now 11:10pm, fucking play the rest of the hour... you bought it! May as well get your money's worth.

Now, I'm assuming that the curfew has not changed over the last few years since I worked there, and I don't think that it has. I think that now with ticket prices going higher and higher that bands that are likely to break curfew probably now build that into the price of their tickets. What's another $1.50 on a $65 ticket? No one would ever know and that gives you $25k to pay the overtime. I think that there probably are some negotiations with the unions in advance of the performance, if they know they're gonna play later than curfew.

Hope that helps ya!

(ps: the view of the soundcheck from behind the band at MSG with Ed coaching the gospel singers in the songs was priceless)

butterfly1

Interesting...any thoughts on what the actual dollar amounts for an hour of overtime at MSG might run to? 10K...20K something like that?

CJMST3K

butterfly1 wrote:

Interesting...any thoughts on what the actual dollar amounts for an hour of overtime at MSG might run to? 10K...20K something like that?

Frankly I could probably send and email and see what PJ was charged in '03 and '08, but for obvious reasons I won't... But I'd say it's fair to say in that general range, or more. I'm not as up on the financial side of things. I've handled tons of "settlements" (the spreadsheet of expenses) from shows in arenas, but I never spent much time looking at the numbers.

At the end of the night the band's accountants and promoter's accountants get together all the bills and review everything. The promoter might say "well catering was included in the contract, but you guys ordered 8 bottles of cristal so you need to cover the difference", and whatnot. So overtime I'm sure gets paid for by the band, unless otherwise negotiated with the promoter.

SOLAT319

CJMST3K wrote:

I think that now with ticket prices going higher and higher that bands that are likely to break curfew probably now build that into the price of their tickets. What's another $1.50 on a $65 ticket? No one would ever know and that gives you $25k to pay the overtime.

Well, see, that makes sense. How come they didn't do that at the very last show of the tour last Summer? We all held up our "fuck the curfew" signs....