The Avocado Album: A Discussion

my2hands

dump "Come Back" and "Parachutes" and the Avocado is a fucking classic

Ben2009

IMHO, Avocado is 90% rockin' awesome and 10% not so much. The first 4 songs as a collective are as good as anything the band has done post-Ten. This is particularly true of Severed Hand. Sure, the guitar part is Porch redux, but it kicks as much ass as anything else. I really like Gone. I think Inside Job is a hidden, underrated gem and is one of the few PJ songs that sounds better on the record than it does when they play it live. Comatose and Big Wave are the kind of punk rock I wasn't sure the band had in them anymore. Come Back is brilliant - in some ways I think the band under-uses it. When I first heard Come Back, I thought it was a set-ender, not a mid-set break.

All that said, there are some misses: Marker in the Sand, Unemployable, and Army Reserve I can do without. Marker may suffer a bit from its placement as track 5 after such a great tracks 1-4. Army Reserve is just unimaginative. Unemployable is just "eh."

Also, Avocado has on it the only PJ song I ever skip past when listening to an album: Parachutes. I have never liked it; in fact I have always hated it. I don't know that I feel that way about any other PJ song.

All in all, I agree with whomever grouped Avocado just outside the Big 5 (10, Vs, Vitology, No Code, Yield). It's better front-to-back than Binaural, Riot Act, or Backspacer.

PearlJamPatriot

Ben2009 wrote:

IMHO, Avocado is 90% rockin' awesome and 10% not so much. The first 4 songs as a collective are as good as anything the band has done post-Ten. This is particularly true of Severed Hand. Sure, the guitar part is Porch redux, but it kicks as much ass as anything else. I really like Gone. I think Inside Job is a hidden, underrated gem and is one of the few PJ songs that sounds better on the record than it does when they play it live. Comatose and Big Wave are the kind of punk rock I wasn't sure the band had in them anymore. Come Back is brilliant - in some ways I think the band under-uses it. When I first heard Come Back, I thought it was a set-ender, not a mid-set break.

All that said, there are some misses: Marker in the Sand, Unemployable, and Army Reserve I can do without. Marker may suffer a bit from its placement as track 5 after such a great tracks 1-4. Army Reserve is just unimaginative. Unemployable is just "eh."

Also, Avocado has on it the only PJ song I ever skip past when listening to an album: Parachutes. I have never liked it; in fact I have always hated it. I don't know that I feel that way about any other PJ song.

All in all, I agree with whomever grouped Avocado just outside the Big 5 (10, Vs, Vitology, No Code, Yield). It's better front-to-back than Binaural, Riot Act, or Backspacer.

Interesting. I absolutely LOVE Marker In The Sand. One of my favs off of Avacado. I really dig Army Reserve too. One thing that bothers me, and maybe they have their reasons for it, is when they put pointless tracks in the album. Or maybe its just Ed being Ed, which nobody can explain sometimes, but why leave out other songs to be stuff like Wasted Reprise, Foxy Mop, Red Dot, Aye Davanita, Pry, To, Im Open. Leave that crap for b-sides instead of all the amazing songs they have left off. And I know I dont have to name them.

cyndarious1

PearlJamPatriot wrote:

Ben2009 wrote:

IMHO, Avocado is 90% rockin' awesome and 10% not so much. The first 4 songs as a collective are as good as anything the band has done post-Ten. This is particularly true of Severed Hand. Sure, the guitar part is Porch redux, but it kicks as much ass as anything else. I really like Gone. I think Inside Job is a hidden, underrated gem and is one of the few PJ songs that sounds better on the record than it does when they play it live. Comatose and Big Wave are the kind of punk rock I wasn't sure the band had in them anymore. Come Back is brilliant - in some ways I think the band under-uses it. When I first heard Come Back, I thought it was a set-ender, not a mid-set break.

All that said, there are some misses: Marker in the Sand, Unemployable, and Army Reserve I can do without. Marker may suffer a bit from its placement as track 5 after such a great tracks 1-4. Army Reserve is just unimaginative. Unemployable is just "eh."

Also, Avocado has on it the only PJ song I ever skip past when listening to an album: Parachutes. I have never liked it; in fact I have always hated it. I don't know that I feel that way about any other PJ song.

All in all, I agree with whomever grouped Avocado just outside the Big 5 (10, Vs, Vitology, No Code, Yield). It's better front-to-back than Binaural, Riot Act, or Backspacer.

Interesting. I absolutely LOVE Marker In The Sand. One of my favs off of Avacado. I really dig Army Reserve too. One thing that bothers me, and maybe they have their reasons for it, is when they put pointless tracks in the album. Or maybe its just Ed being Ed, which nobody can explain sometimes, but why leave out other songs to be stuff like Wasted Reprise, Foxy Mop, Red Dot, Aye Davanita, Pry, To, Im Open. Leave that crap for b-sides instead of all the amazing songs they have left off. And I know I dont have to name them.

I don't think that way. I guess those weird little songs give something to the albums, they give them personality. An album isn't just about a bunch of songs, it's about feelings and a certain mood that makes you make it your own when you listen to it, as well. I love wasted reprise, but I always skip Foxy Mop, I'm Open, Red Dot and the others, but if it wasn't for them, Vitalogy, No Code, and Yield wouldn't be what they are: great albums.

tremors

I loved Avocado for its energy, and the return to the 'in yer face' and energetic stuff after Riot Act (which is btw amongst my favourite Pearl Jam records). For me though, Avocado hasn't had the longevity of other Pearl Jam albums, and I found myself not enjoying it that much after a number of months, which was a disappointment considering the number of years I have been enjoying all the 90s albums, and Riot Act.

The reason for me that the sheen wore off Avocado so quickly, lies I think in the quality of the songwriting, particularly the lyrics. What I love most about Pearl Jam is how so many songs are from the heart - and often from a very personal place - revealing something about the inner demons of the songwriter, and helping the listener (me!) to rise above difficulties themselves. Avocado has never cut it for me at anything approaching this level of intensity that I'm used to with Pearl Jam songwriting. Many of the songs are more social and political in focus than introspective, and although the themes are worthy - they often feel too far removed from genuine passion - so, on the record - Army Reserve, as just one example - leaves me pretty cold. Unlike many who have said something here, I have actually grown to enjoy the Avocado songs quite a lot more in the live setting - they seem to be delivered with more sincerity as time has passed, to me. Army Reserve affects me a lot more in the most recent bootlegs, and Come Back reaches more emotional heights in recent performances - reaching a peak at Berlin last year.

So, in my case Avocado is my least favourite Pearl Jam record, and I found my interest in the band waning until Backspacer came out - where I welcomed the combination of the new found energy, with what I feel are more personal and direct songs!

i shit and i stink

iamica wrote:

For me, Avocado was the album that reawakened my obsession with Pearl Jam. I had still listened to them, loved Binaural/Riot Act and still do, but this album was just an explosion. The first 5 songs are just so powerful. I think the only song I kind of feel weird about on the album is Come Back, but only because it's never really sounded like a PJ song to me. But I love the album.
By the way...I've noticed that here on the message board, there seems to be a cycle where the album that came out before the most recent one gets a lot of hate...it happened with Binaural, it happened with Riot Act, and it's happening now...guess Backspacer will start getting hated on when the new one comes out.

To be fair, if you read some old threads, Backspacer got seriously hated on by come people as soon as it hit the stores. I didn't understand that. Backspacer was something new for the band and I love it when any artist does something new. Why keep ploughing the same old furrow?

As for avocado, a couple of weak songs but I love it. Inside Job is my favourite but I was also blown away by Come Back in Berlin on the anniversary of Roskilde. Everyone was expecting Love Boat Captain but Come Back was really appropriate and very moving.

i shit and i stink

tremors wrote:

I found my interest in the band waning until Backspacer came out - where I welcomed the combination of the new found energy, with what I feel are more personal and direct songs!

I agree completely. Backspacer injected a lot of new enthusiasm for the band in me. Avocado is also full of energy but it sounds like energy from frustration and anger a lot of the time. Backspacer was just full of positive energy but managed, in my opinion, to be optimistic without straying into sounding too trite or corny.

brianlux

Though probably not new to many of you, I recently found the live "Marker in the Sand" on YouTube and it knocked me right out! And here's another cool thing- when Googling the title, the first reference includes this (with a minor variation in punctuation):

McCready 4:23

Yeah, I thought- this song is right out of the Gosple of McCready, featuring Eddie pouring it out to the gods, Mike, Stone, Jeff and Matt right on it and Boom finishing it off sweet with soul filled church music. Even on my crappy lap top speaker this is a thing of heaven!

Ben2009

cyndarious1 wrote:

PearlJamPatriot wrote:

Ben2009 wrote:

IMHO, Avocado is 90% rockin' awesome and 10% not so much. The first 4 songs as a collective are as good as anything the band has done post-Ten. This is particularly true of Severed Hand. Sure, the guitar part is Porch redux, but it kicks as much ass as anything else. I really like Gone. I think Inside Job is a hidden, underrated gem and is one of the few PJ songs that sounds better on the record than it does when they play it live. Comatose and Big Wave are the kind of punk rock I wasn't sure the band had in them anymore. Come Back is brilliant - in some ways I think the band under-uses it. When I first heard Come Back, I thought it was a set-ender, not a mid-set break.

All that said, there are some misses: Marker in the Sand, Unemployable, and Army Reserve I can do without. Marker may suffer a bit from its placement as track 5 after such a great tracks 1-4. Army Reserve is just unimaginative. Unemployable is just "eh."

Also, Avocado has on it the only PJ song I ever skip past when listening to an album: Parachutes. I have never liked it; in fact I have always hated it. I don't know that I feel that way about any other PJ song.

All in all, I agree with whomever grouped Avocado just outside the Big 5 (10, Vs, Vitology, No Code, Yield). It's better front-to-back than Binaural, Riot Act, or Backspacer.

Interesting. I absolutely LOVE Marker In The Sand. One of my favs off of Avacado. I really dig Army Reserve too. One thing that bothers me, and maybe they have their reasons for it, is when they put pointless tracks in the album. Or maybe its just Ed being Ed, which nobody can explain sometimes, but why leave out other songs to be stuff like Wasted Reprise, Foxy Mop, Red Dot, Aye Davanita, Pry, To, Im Open. Leave that crap for b-sides instead of all the amazing songs they have left off. And I know I dont have to name them.

I don't think that way. I guess those weird little songs give something to the albums, they give them personality. An album isn't just about a bunch of songs, it's about feelings and a certain mood that makes you make it your own when you listen to it, as well. I love wasted reprise, but I always skip Foxy Mop, I'm Open, Red Dot and the others, but if it wasn't for them, Vitalogy, No Code, and Yield wouldn't be what they are: great albums.

Those weird little tracks tie records together. I don't skip any of them, except maybe Stupid Mop. I even sing along to Red Dot.

igotid88

Severed Hand

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDMihWzxYKA

primussucks

I love the album however there are 3 things I don't like about it:
1. Big Wave-just not a very good song, at least by PJ standards
2. Army Reserve-seems out of place on this record
3. Comeback-seems like a cheesy power ballad that should have been done by Poison or Bon Jovi
take these 3 out and put in a 7 or 8 minute long Of The Earth and you have one hell of a record!!!

inMytree_19

I really love this album -- as it is with any album, there are always a few songs that the listener doesn't "connect" with, yet the next person may love it. For me, the lyrics throughout Avocado bear deep meaning re. life and the world we live in. There have been some harsh critics of this album, however, I get a personal feeling from EV's lyrics on this album. Love it

inMytree_19

some people don't understand the connection so many of us have to PJ. For me, aside from the amazing musical talents they poses, it is the personl side that I really connect with, and the humility and gracefullness that the band seems to carry themselves with -- and you don't see this too often with "celebrities" today.

Come Back live in Berlin on 10 year anniversary of Roskilde. Beautiful

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2QPX_DB8Vk

LikeAnOcean

I think its a great album, but I'm not a fan of it's production. Nothing against Kasper, Into the Wild was great, but I wish they let Brendan do it.

DriftingByTheStorm

i think 8 \ Avocado is their strongest work since Yield, personally.

true story.

DriftingByTheStorm

primussucks wrote:

I love the album however there are 3 things I don't like about it:
1. Big Wave-just not a very good song, at least by PJ standards
2. Army Reserve-seems out of place on this record
3. Comeback-seems like a cheesy power ballad that should have been done by Poison or Bon Jovi
take these 3 out and put in a 7 or 8 minute long Of The Earth and you have one hell of a record!!!

Funny thing is those are my 3 favorite songs on the album.

lol.

rickles3

What's never made sense to me was the idea that Avocado was some kind of "return to form". I've always felt that the band showed a natural progression from Vitalogy-Avocado. The first two albums stand separate to me. For my taste, PJ caught their footing on Vitalogy and never looked back. Avocado's been out 5 years now, and I've probably played it more than any other album in that time. I love the aggression of the opening 5 tracks, and the album just flows from there to Inside Job. I saw them in '06 two weeks after the albums release, and everything they played from Avocado fit seamlessly in with the rest of the set.

cyndarious1

rickles3 wrote:

What's never made sense to me was the idea that Avocado was some kind of "return to form". I've always felt that the band showed a natural progression from Vitalogy-Avocado. The first two albums stand separate to me. For my taste, PJ caught their footing on Vitalogy and never looked back. Avocado's been out 5 years now, and I've probably played it more than any other album in that time. I love the aggression of the opening 5 tracks, and the album just flows from there to Inside Job. I saw them in '06 two weeks after the albums release, and everything they played from Avocado fit seamlessly in with the rest of the set.

I agree with you. From Vitalogy on PJ is a different band. What I think they meant with the "return to form" was probably the aggression you mention. We agree that the musically Ten and Avocado are miles away, but just look at the lyrics, or the guys' attitude when they play Severed Hand or Comatose. Doesn't it remind you of the old days?

rickles3

cyndarious1 wrote:

rickles3 wrote:

What's never made sense to me was the idea that Avocado was some kind of "return to form". I've always felt that the band showed a natural progression from Vitalogy-Avocado. The first two albums stand separate to me. For my taste, PJ caught their footing on Vitalogy and never looked back. Avocado's been out 5 years now, and I've probably played it more than any other album in that time. I love the aggression of the opening 5 tracks, and the album just flows from there to Inside Job. I saw them in '06 two weeks after the albums release, and everything they played from Avocado fit seamlessly in with the rest of the set.

I agree with you. From Vitalogy on PJ is a different band. What I think they meant with the "return to form" was probably the aggression you mention. We agree that the musically Ten and Avocado are miles away, but just look at the lyrics, or the guys' attitude when they play Severed Hand or Comatose. Doesn't it remind you of the old days?

Yeah, I definitely see (and agree with) your point. I guess to me, Vitalogy is where they started mixing in the arty/adventurous stuff with the more rocking stuff, and all of the following albums going forward are a blend of those sounds. Obviously some are weighted more heavily one way or the other, but to me they all have a consistent "feel" to them.

So yes, the aggression of the first 5 Avocado tracks does echo the opening tracks of Ten, but once you get beyond those first 5 there's no question that you're listening to the more mature post-Vitalogy PJ.

Gibson

This album is a masterpiece. I said it before i went to Europe 06 and saw the Torino show. I firmly believe that if anyone gets to see this record played front to back, they would say the same thing.