Grunge - The Deadliest Genre?

catefrances

this article popped up in my inbox as well.... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


i listen to a shitload of grunge.. i think i might die soon.

Byrnzie

Godfather. wrote:

the no long term side effects of X....I'll call bullshit on that.

Will you really? O.k.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/ ... -new-study


Ecstasy does not wreck the mind, study claims

Previous research was flawed, say experts, but findings will shock those who campaign against the drug's use

Robin McKie
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 19 February 2011



There is no evidence that ecstasy causes brain damage, according to one of the largest studies into the effects of the drug. Too many previous studies made over-arching conclusions from insufficient data, say the scientists responsible for the research, and the drug's dangers have been greatly exaggerated.

The finding will shock campaigners who have claimed ecstasy poses a real risk of triggering brain damage. They have argued that it can induce memory loss, decrease cognitive performance and has long-lasting effects on behaviour.

But experts who have argued that the drug is relatively safe welcomed the new paper. "I always assumed that, when properly designed studies were carried out, we would find ecstasy does not cause brain damage," said Professor David Nutt, who was fired as chair of the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs by Alan Johnson, then home secretary, for publicly stating alcohol and tobacco were more harmful than ecstasy.

The study was carried out by a team led by Professor John Halpern of Harvard Medical School and published in the journal Addiction last week. Funded by a $1.8m grant from the US National Institute on Drug Abuse, it was launched specifically to avoid methodological drawbacks that have bedevilled previous attempts to pinpoint whether or not ecstasy users suffer brain damage.

Ecstasy – or 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine, or MDMA – came into widespread use in the 1980s when taking it was linked to raves and the playing of dance music. Its symptoms include euphoria, a sense of intimacy with others and diminished anxiety and depression. In the US alone, more than 12 million have taken it.

But the taking of ecstasy has also been linked to damage to the central nervous system and research in recent years has suggested that long-term changes to emotional states and behaviour have been triggered by consumption of the drug. Possession of it has been made an offence in most western nations.

However, Halpern was sharply critical of the quality of the research that had linked ecstasy to brain damage. "Too many studies have been carried out on small populations, while overarching conclusions have been drawn from them," he said. For a start, some previous research has studied users who were taken from a culture dominated by all-night dancing, which thus exposed these individuals to sleep and fluid deprivation – factors that are themselves known to produce long-lasting cognitive effects. Non-users were not selected from those from a similar background, which therefore skewed results. In addition, past studies have not taken sufficient account of the fact that ecstasy users take other drugs or alcohol that could affect cognition or that they may have suffered intellectual impairment before they started taking ecstasy. In Halpern's study only ecstasy users who took no other drugs and who had suffered no previous impairment were selected.

The resulting experiment whittled down 1,500 potential participants to 52 selected users, whose cognitive abilities matched those of a group of 59 non-users. "We even took hair samples of participants to test whether they were telling the truth about their drug and alcohol habits," said Halpern. "Essentially we compared one group of people who danced and raved and took ecstasy with a similar group of individuals who danced and raved but who did not take ecstasy. When we did that, we found that there was no difference in their cognitive abilities." In other words, previous studies highlighted problems triggered by other factors, such as use of other drugs or drink, or sleep deprivation.

But the drug still posed risks, he said. "Ecstasy consumption is dangerous because illegally made pills often contain contaminants that can have harmful side-effects."

Byrnzie

ed243421 wrote:

BinauralJam wrote:

i like drugs, but you got to know if your doing heroin, it will kill you at some point.

tell that to keith richards

And Iggy.

And Nick Cave.

BinauralJam

Byrnzie wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

BinauralJam wrote:

i like drugs, but you got to know if your doing heroin, it will kill you at some point.

tell that to keith richards

And Iggy.

And Nick Cave.

i thought Iggy was straight edge/clean?

Byrnzie

BinauralJam wrote:

i thought Iggy was straight edge/clean?

He is now.

Though he didn't used to be. You should read the book 'Wonderland Avenue' by Danny Sugerman if you have any doubts about that.



Great book by the way. The first half covers his time with Jim Morrisson, the second half with the Igster.

BinauralJam

Byrnzie wrote:

BinauralJam wrote:

i thought Iggy was straight edge/clean?

He is now.

Though he didn't used to be. You should read the book 'Wonderland Avenue' by Danny Sugerman if you have any doubts about that.



Great book by the way. The first half covers his time with Jim Morrisson, the second half with the Igster.

I'll take your word for it. Sounds like an intresting book, but it might get me curious, i don't need any temptation.

Godfather.

Byrnzie wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

the no long term side effects of X....I'll call bullshit on that.

Will you really? O.k.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/ ... -new-study


Ecstasy does not wreck the mind, study claims

Previous research was flawed, say experts, but findings will shock those who campaign against the drug's use

Robin McKie
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 19 February 2011



There is no evidence that ecstasy causes brain damage, according to one of the largest studies into the effects of the drug. Too many previous studies made over-arching conclusions from insufficient data, say the scientists responsible for the research, and the drug's dangers have been greatly exaggerated.

The finding will shock campaigners who have claimed ecstasy poses a real risk of triggering brain damage. They have argued that it can induce memory loss, decrease cognitive performance and has long-lasting effects on behaviour.

But experts who have argued that the drug is relatively safe welcomed the new paper. "I always assumed that, when properly designed studies were carried out, we would find ecstasy does not cause brain damage," said Professor David Nutt, who was fired as chair of the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs by Alan Johnson, then home secretary, for publicly stating alcohol and tobacco were more harmful than ecstasy.

The study was carried out by a team led by Professor John Halpern of Harvard Medical School and published in the journal Addiction last week. Funded by a $1.8m grant from the US National Institute on Drug Abuse, it was launched specifically to avoid methodological drawbacks that have bedevilled previous attempts to pinpoint whether or not ecstasy users suffer brain damage.

Ecstasy – or 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine, or MDMA – came into widespread use in the 1980s when taking it was linked to raves and the playing of dance music. Its symptoms include euphoria, a sense of intimacy with others and diminished anxiety and depression. In the US alone, more than 12 million have taken it.

But the taking of ecstasy has also been linked to damage to the central nervous system and research in recent years has suggested that long-term changes to emotional states and behaviour have been triggered by consumption of the drug. Possession of it has been made an offence in most western nations.

However, Halpern was sharply critical of the quality of the research that had linked ecstasy to brain damage. "Too many studies have been carried out on small populations, while overarching conclusions have been drawn from them," he said. For a start, some previous research has studied users who were taken from a culture dominated by all-night dancing, which thus exposed these individuals to sleep and fluid deprivation – factors that are themselves known to produce long-lasting cognitive effects. Non-users were not selected from those from a similar background, which therefore skewed results. In addition, past studies have not taken sufficient account of the fact that ecstasy users take other drugs or alcohol that could affect cognition or that they may have suffered intellectual impairment before they started taking ecstasy. In Halpern's study only ecstasy users who took no other drugs and who had suffered no previous impairment were selected.

The resulting experiment whittled down 1,500 potential participants to 52 selected users, whose cognitive abilities matched those of a group of 59 non-users. "We even took hair samples of participants to test whether they were telling the truth about their drug and alcohol habits," said Halpern. "Essentially we compared one group of people who danced and raved and took ecstasy with a similar group of individuals who danced and raved but who did not take ecstasy. When we did that, we found that there was no difference in their cognitive abilities." In other words, previous studies highlighted problems triggered by other factors, such as use of other drugs or drink, or sleep deprivation.

But the drug still posed risks, he said. "Ecstasy consumption is dangerous because illegally made pills often contain contaminants that can have harmful side-effects."

sorry man...just cause someone in the guardian posted this story don't mean a lot to me, the effects of foreign chemicals put into the body may not be known yet or these guys are just looking for any reason to get high and feel good about them selfs.

Godfather.

Byrnzie

Godfather. wrote:

sorry man...just cause someone in the guardian posted this story don't mean a lot to me, the effects of foreign chemicals put into the body may not be known yet or these guys are just looking for any reason to get high and feel good about them selfs.

Godfather.

It has nothing to do with anyone writing about it in the Guardian. If you have an issue with it then take it up with the Harvard Medical School who carried out the research.

keeponrockin

MrAbraham wrote:

keeponrockin wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

the article sucked,life is full of choices no matter what you do for a living and money will bring the good and the bad so musicians actors etc. have to make choices just like the rest of us.
read like one of those pissed off critics that blame heavy metal for youth suicides.....CHOICES !

Godfather.

Exactly. One needs to separate those who over use drugs to those who smoke a bowl like they would drink a glass of wine!

Both go well with food...

Overall smoking a bowl is more negative regarding the damages it does to a persons body than not smoking a bowl. Smoking weed has many benefits, but smoking it still dangerous. This is science.

Vaporizing however, that is all types of goodness, extract the best of what's in the herb, without the dangers of smoke. Not only that, but it extracts more of the THC than smoking. Anyone try it? I bought a Volcano a couple years ago. Solid purchase

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBNvlf17TEw

Believe me, when I have the money, I will.

Godfather.

Byrnzie wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

sorry man...just cause someone in the guardian posted this story don't mean a lot to me, the effects of foreign chemicals put into the body may not be known yet or these guys are just looking for any reason to get high and feel good about them selfs.

Godfather.

It has nothing to do with anyone writing about it in the Guardian. If you have an issue with it then take it up with the Harvard Medical School who carried out the research.

still can't buy it.

Godfather.

cincybearcat

Byrnzie wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

sorry man...just cause someone in the guardian posted this story don't mean a lot to me, the effects of foreign chemicals put into the body may not be known yet or these guys are just looking for any reason to get high and feel good about them selfs.

Godfather.

It has nothing to do with anyone writing about it in the Guardian. If you have an issue with it then take it up with the Harvard Medical School who carried out the research.

I'm sure like anything else, even water, there is still a level that is too much, did they determine what levels were safe for daily intake or what?

Also, how long was the study? regarding the potential impact of long term use and chronic effects?

I mean, even to take Aspirin everyday you should consult your dr first.

Byrnzie

Godfather. wrote:

still can't buy it.

Godfather, despite the largest study thus far carried out into the effects of the drug which proves ecstacy has no detrimental effects, you still can't buy it? Why would you prefer to take tabloid sensationalism and fear-mongering over hard facts and science?



Edit: By the way, have you never taken ecstacy before? It's my favourite drug of choice. You should give it a go sometime.

Prince Of Dorkness

If you take out the people murdered for hire by Courtney Love, it's probably safer than air travel.

Attaway77

Life is the deadliest genre, we kill each other while killing our ownselves...

RW81233

Byrnzie wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

still can't buy it.

Godfather, despite the largest study thus far carried out into the effects of the drug which proves ecstacy has no detrimental effects, you still can't buy it? Why would you prefer to take tabloid sensationalism and fear-mongering over hard facts and science?



Edit: By the way, have you never taken ecstacy before? It's my favourite drug of choice. You should give it a go sometime.

Byrnzie...do you have a link to the actual study? At the risk of agreeing with Godfather over you (which in the course of human history has never happened) I'd like to see what it really says. I'm not saying either way what I believe in terms of X, but I can say that I started doing obesity research about a year ago and found out most of the studies on it are a bunch of bullshit. Many are funded by pharmaceutical companies that benefit when people are afraid to be fat, or others find what they want to find because that's how you get tenure in the "hard" sciences. Another instance where this is the case is the cell phone studies on how more people are driving distracted because of them. My sister was doing one as an undergrad/pre-master's student with her professor and literally couldn't finish it because of all the bullshit that came before her study that they were basing their work on. As Michael Gard (author of the The End of the Obesity Epidemic) might say, the situation is often more complex than a simple causal answer (ie. X is bad for you/X is not bad for you). Maybe some people's brains can handle it, and others can't, but it's a blend of genetics, the type of X you get, and so on. As a champion of qualitative research I have a difficult time with "hard" science and "proven" answers - but I could just not be getting it.

Godfather.

Byrnzie wrote:

Godfather. wrote:

still can't buy it.

Godfather, despite the largest study thus far carried out into the effects of the drug which proves ecstacy has no detrimental effects, you still can't buy it? Why would you prefer to take tabloid sensationalism and fear-mongering over hard facts and science?



Edit: By the way, have you never taken ecstacy before? It's my favourite drug of choice. You should give it a go sometime.

sorry bro it has nothing to do with tabloid sensationalism or fear-mongering, I was partying in the 70's and "THEY" said the same thing about LSD and "THEY" were wrong come to find out.
I just can't believe that something ingested or administered that is totally foreign to your body will eventually have no ill side effects not to mention what can happen while a person is high and not able to make rational
discussions or judgment calls (driving,overdosing etc,)

Godfather.

catefrances

Attaway77 wrote:

Life is the deadliest genre, we kill each other while killing our ownselves...

whoa... dude.

catefrances

Byrnzie wrote:

ed243421 wrote:

BinauralJam wrote:

i like drugs, but you got to know if your doing heroin, it will kill you at some point.

tell that to keith richards

And Iggy.

And Nick Cave.

they just stopped before it killed them.