3 solutions for Palestine

Thoughts_Arrive

Palestine for Palestinians!

MotoDC

TriumphantAngel wrote:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/02/AR2010090204665.html

Israel and Palestine: A true one-state solution
By George Bisharat
Friday, September 3, 2010

<snip>
The main obstacle to a single-state solution is the belief that Israel must be a Jewish state. Jim Crow laws and South African apartheid were similarly entrenched virtually until the eves of their demise. History suggests that no version of ethnic privilege can ultimately persist in a multiethnic society.
<snip>

I'm sorry, help me out here. I always imagined the zionist movement to be a push for a jewish religious state, not a jewish racial/ethnic state. I realize the line between "jewish" as an ethnicty and "jewish" as a religion is often indistinct....but which is it?

yosi

It is the later, though the description is crude at best. Israel is (and hopefully will remain) a state where the majority population is Jewish, and which therefore has a state culture that is Jewish in the very broadest sense. It is also a democracy that grants equal rights and protections to minority groups within the population. This system is imperfect, but one should not make the ridiculous mistake of thinking of Israel as being analogous in principle to apartheid South Africa or Nazi Germany.

catefrances

yosi wrote:

It is the later, though the description is crude at best. Israel is (and hopefully will remain) a state where the majority population is Jewish, and which therefore has a state culture that is Jewish in the very broadest sense. It is also a democracy that grants equal rights and protections to minority groups within the population. This system is imperfect, but one should not make the ridiculous mistake of thinking of Israel as being analogous in principle to apartheid South Africa or Nazi Germany.

whos talking about principle? im talking about practise. i see gaza and the walling of the west bank as highly analogous of bantustans. sth africa divided by race. israel divided by religion with exceptions. the restrictions on travel. on where the oppressed can live. the palestinians treated basically like aliens in their own country. there is no way white sth african could ever be considered the majority but still managed to oppress the blacks despite that fact. the israeli govt continues to oppress palestinians in hopes of keeping their own majority because in some weird warped mindset they quite possibly think a palestinian majority is a threat to their existence. neither the black sth africans nor the palestinians were/are treated as equals by the respective oppressors.
is it more important to the israeli govt to maintain this 'state culture' at the expense of their peoples security. and why do they not think it can be maintained in a free and equal society that is inclusive of all the people who live there? and i agree yosi, the system is imperfect, as any system of separate development is... grossly imperfect and highy oppressive.

Byrnzie

yosi wrote:

one should not make the ridiculous mistake of thinking of Israel as being analogous in principle to apartheid South Africa or Nazi Germany.

The only sense in which the comparison is ridiculous is that the situation in the occupied territories is far worse than anything that occured in Apartheid South Africa.

gimmesometruth27

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were show the error of there ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of there ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of their ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of their ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were show the error of there ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of their ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

Thoughts_Arrive

catefrances wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

and last i heard those in south africa were not going on about a "white state", or a "christian state", or any other exclusionary state based on ethnicity or religion or race alone...

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of their ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.

but at one point they did. fortunately they were shown the error of their ways and sanity and justice prevailed. perhaps some time, maybe even in the near future, we can say the same about israel.