Anti-Semitic? Not me, says Roger Waters
Pepe Silvia
Posts: 3,758
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-enter ... 96790.html
Anti-Semitic? Not me, says Roger Waters
Thirty years after being forced to fight off claims he was corrupting children with Pink Floyd's The Wall album, Roger Waters has been driven to defend himself from allegations of anti-Semitism.
The bassist has launched a vigorous defence of his views and music after being accused by an American-Jewish rights agency of using images in his stage show that promoted stereotypes.
During a performance of "Goodbye Blue Sky" at the US leg of The Wall Live tour, which revives Pink Floyd's hit 1979 album, a B52 bomber projected on to a backdrop is shown dropping symbols including the Star of David and a dollar sign, as well as a crucifix and logos for Shell and Mercedes.
Abraham Foxman, the director of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), said using the dollar sign and the Star of David in sequence echoed the stereotype that Jews were avaricious.
Referring to criticism Waters has previously made of Israel for its treatment of the Palestinians, Mr Foxman said the musician should have "chosen some other way to convey his political views without playing into and dredging up the worst age-old anti-Semitic stereotype about Jews and their supposed obsession with making money".
Waters, who was born in Surrey but has lived in the US for 10 years, said the slur was so serious he felt compelled to set the record straight in an open letter to The Independent.
"I watch the workings of politics here and particularly the Republican Party. They work with the axiom that you can tell as many lies as you want – and often the bigger the better – and eventually they will believed," he said.
"If I don't respond people will see the story and will come to believe I'm anti-Semitic, and I'm not. Nothing could be further from the truth. "
The images he chose to project during the show were selected because they are "representative of religious and national and commercial interests, all of which have a malign influence on our lives and prevent us from treating each other decently".
Waters has spoken against Israeli policies and accused the ADL of painting critics as anti-Semitic.
"It's a screen that they hide behind. I don't think they should be taken seriously on that. You can attack Israeli policy without being anti-Jewish," he said.
"It's like saying if you criticise the US policy you are being anti-Christian. I'm critical of the Israeli policy of occupying Palestinian land and their policy of building settlements, which is entirely illegal under international law, and also of ghettoising the people whose land they are building on.
"It's that foreign policy I'm against. It's nothing to do with the religion."
Waters, who will bring his concert tour to Britain next year, said in his letter the symbols projected during the performance of The Wall were intended to show the suffering caused to ordinary people by war.
The bassist pointed out, however, that there are many people in Israel who agree with his position and that he has had received a lot of support from Jews. He said: "There is a large movement inside Israel, young, Jewish Israeli citizens, and old ones too, who are against their government's policy in the same way as in England when Tony Blair took us to war against Iraq on the coat-tails of George Bush.
"I've had an extraordinary response. We've had over 1,000 comments on my Facebook page.
"They are all extremely supportive. A lot of the comments I've had have been from Jews."
His letter to 'The Independent'
Dear Sir
In a recent news item on Foxnews/online, subsequently abridged in The Evening Standard, Abraham Foxman, head of the ADL, (Anti Defamation League) in the USA , accuses my new production of The Wall and by implication me, of anti-Semitism.
A serious charge that demands a response. Had Mr Foxman come to my show before passing judgement and commenting publicly he might, I hope, have held his peace, as there is no anti Semitism in The Wall Show. The song to which he refers, Good Bye Blue Sky, describes how ordinary people, military and civilians alike, suffer trauma in the aftermath of war.
The visuals that accompany the song show waves of B52 bombers dropping various symbols from bomb bays on a war ravaged landscape. The symbols are: in no particular order, a Crucifix, a Hammer and Sickle, a Star of David, A Crescent and Star, a Mercedes sign , a Dollar sign, and a Shell Oil sign.
Mr Foxman's concern was that potentially the juxtoposition of a Star of David and a Dollar sign might incite hatred of Jews. Contrary to Mr Foxman's assertion, there are no hidden meanings in the order or juxtaposition of these symbols.
The point I am trying to make in the song is that the bombardment we are all subject to by conflicting religious, political, and economic ideologies only encourages us to turn against one another, and I mourn the concommitant loss of life.
In so far as The Wall has a political message it is to seek to illuminate our condition, and find new ways to encourage peace and understanding, particularly in the Middle East .
Incidentally, being from England, I had never heard of the ADL until today, but I have googled them and I see from their mission statement of 1913 that their brief is not only to defend the Jewish people from defamation, but also, and I quote, " to secure justice and fair treatment to all citizens alike and to put an end forever to unjust and unfair discrimination against and ridicule of any sect or body of citizens".
Perhaps we should all focus on that lofty ideal and stop cowering in our corners throwing stones at one another.
Anti-Semitic? Not me, says Roger Waters
Thirty years after being forced to fight off claims he was corrupting children with Pink Floyd's The Wall album, Roger Waters has been driven to defend himself from allegations of anti-Semitism.
The bassist has launched a vigorous defence of his views and music after being accused by an American-Jewish rights agency of using images in his stage show that promoted stereotypes.
During a performance of "Goodbye Blue Sky" at the US leg of The Wall Live tour, which revives Pink Floyd's hit 1979 album, a B52 bomber projected on to a backdrop is shown dropping symbols including the Star of David and a dollar sign, as well as a crucifix and logos for Shell and Mercedes.
Abraham Foxman, the director of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), said using the dollar sign and the Star of David in sequence echoed the stereotype that Jews were avaricious.
Referring to criticism Waters has previously made of Israel for its treatment of the Palestinians, Mr Foxman said the musician should have "chosen some other way to convey his political views without playing into and dredging up the worst age-old anti-Semitic stereotype about Jews and their supposed obsession with making money".
Waters, who was born in Surrey but has lived in the US for 10 years, said the slur was so serious he felt compelled to set the record straight in an open letter to The Independent.
"I watch the workings of politics here and particularly the Republican Party. They work with the axiom that you can tell as many lies as you want – and often the bigger the better – and eventually they will believed," he said.
"If I don't respond people will see the story and will come to believe I'm anti-Semitic, and I'm not. Nothing could be further from the truth. "
The images he chose to project during the show were selected because they are "representative of religious and national and commercial interests, all of which have a malign influence on our lives and prevent us from treating each other decently".
Waters has spoken against Israeli policies and accused the ADL of painting critics as anti-Semitic.
"It's a screen that they hide behind. I don't think they should be taken seriously on that. You can attack Israeli policy without being anti-Jewish," he said.
"It's like saying if you criticise the US policy you are being anti-Christian. I'm critical of the Israeli policy of occupying Palestinian land and their policy of building settlements, which is entirely illegal under international law, and also of ghettoising the people whose land they are building on.
"It's that foreign policy I'm against. It's nothing to do with the religion."
Waters, who will bring his concert tour to Britain next year, said in his letter the symbols projected during the performance of The Wall were intended to show the suffering caused to ordinary people by war.
The bassist pointed out, however, that there are many people in Israel who agree with his position and that he has had received a lot of support from Jews. He said: "There is a large movement inside Israel, young, Jewish Israeli citizens, and old ones too, who are against their government's policy in the same way as in England when Tony Blair took us to war against Iraq on the coat-tails of George Bush.
"I've had an extraordinary response. We've had over 1,000 comments on my Facebook page.
"They are all extremely supportive. A lot of the comments I've had have been from Jews."
His letter to 'The Independent'
Dear Sir
In a recent news item on Foxnews/online, subsequently abridged in The Evening Standard, Abraham Foxman, head of the ADL, (Anti Defamation League) in the USA , accuses my new production of The Wall and by implication me, of anti-Semitism.
A serious charge that demands a response. Had Mr Foxman come to my show before passing judgement and commenting publicly he might, I hope, have held his peace, as there is no anti Semitism in The Wall Show. The song to which he refers, Good Bye Blue Sky, describes how ordinary people, military and civilians alike, suffer trauma in the aftermath of war.
The visuals that accompany the song show waves of B52 bombers dropping various symbols from bomb bays on a war ravaged landscape. The symbols are: in no particular order, a Crucifix, a Hammer and Sickle, a Star of David, A Crescent and Star, a Mercedes sign , a Dollar sign, and a Shell Oil sign.
Mr Foxman's concern was that potentially the juxtoposition of a Star of David and a Dollar sign might incite hatred of Jews. Contrary to Mr Foxman's assertion, there are no hidden meanings in the order or juxtaposition of these symbols.
The point I am trying to make in the song is that the bombardment we are all subject to by conflicting religious, political, and economic ideologies only encourages us to turn against one another, and I mourn the concommitant loss of life.
In so far as The Wall has a political message it is to seek to illuminate our condition, and find new ways to encourage peace and understanding, particularly in the Middle East .
Incidentally, being from England, I had never heard of the ADL until today, but I have googled them and I see from their mission statement of 1913 that their brief is not only to defend the Jewish people from defamation, but also, and I quote, " to secure justice and fair treatment to all citizens alike and to put an end forever to unjust and unfair discrimination against and ridicule of any sect or body of citizens".
Perhaps we should all focus on that lofty ideal and stop cowering in our corners throwing stones at one another.
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
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Comments
Now you're just playing into that age-old Anti-Defamation League stereotype about Anti-Defamationists and their supposed terrible sense of humour.
I didn't even have to see the video to know the context in which the symbols were used. Funny there were no mentions of the crescent and star (prominent symbols on a few muslim-nation flags)in the articles that pumped the ADL's stance. A joke indeed.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
How so?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Who let all of this riff-raff into the room?
cause some just dont get the floyd at all. Havnt taken enough good drugs LOL
the reason they usually scream anti-semetic' is they know the criticism is warranted and it's true. they can't defend that.
that's why.
He's famous for being one of the most difficult artists in the history of rock music to work with. Over the years, I've read several articles with David Gilmour which have me convinced.
i didn't see any other thread about this, in fact, when i searched for roger waters the thread before this that i found was
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=137085&p=3099063&hilit=roger+waters#p3099063
my b
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
i've read a few books on (the) pink floyd (sound) and yeah, he did develop quite an ego. gilmour refused to talk or have any direct contact with him for like two decades! even when they released that live version of the wall he refused to communicate directly with him. it's a shame, they went from being a collaborative band to waters pretty much treating them like sessions players, after animals he showed up with demos for most of the wall and what became 'the pros and cons of hitchhiking' and at least let them pick which one they'd do. it's funny the only song he wrote all by himself on the wall is a song he left off his solo album and ended up being one of floyd's most famous songs. he had said in an interview had his solo album taken off he wouldn't have gone back to pink floyd.
waters can be a controlling prick, like suing pink floyd over using the inflatable pig, which is why gilmour put balls on it to differentiate them, but he has done more for people than probably everyone of us here combined. when pink floyd got big he did things like buy rows of houses and give them to homeless and low income charities. and a decade or so ago gilmour sold his 2nd home and gave all the money to charity. they may have their character flaws but they also do a lot to help humanity and they do it because they feel it's right, not for publicity and image.
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
interesting stuff Pepe, which books can you suggest? I tried reading Saucerful (title?) and it was a little dull I thought.. couldnt really get through it. I've been curious about finding another good one on Pink Floyd though.
It's a shame the whole thing fell apart the way it did. I always thought Pink Floyd was an incredible band, and The Wall is one of my all-time favorite albums. Sad that egos had to ruin some truly awesome music.
I think Roger defended himself against the charges well.
I saw the concert in Los Angeles 1980...I think
just a good rock n roll show one of the best that I have seen to date, some people have thin skin or just need something to bitch about...did these jokers file a law suit..that would just be the frosting on the cake.
Godfather.