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carlin got it right

Pepe SilviaPepe Silvia Posts: 3,758
edited July 2010 in A Moving Train
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Rlqjxst6xU
:lol:
don't compete; coexist

what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?

"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama

when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Carlin got a lot of things right. His social and political commentary was always bang on, and presented in a manner as thought provoking as it was hilarious. That clip was the perfect example...How often is the hypocrisy of US histpry, or the militarized nature of the national psyche spoken about in the mainstream? ...and how many people have viewed that clip over the years, who may not have given a second thought to the version of history they've been taught? He exposed a lot of people who didnt otherwise have much interest in his topics, to a new way of seeing themselves and their country. . I think people underestimate the importance of a guy like Carlin...he is truely missed.
  • youngsteryoungster Boston Posts: 6,576
    Drowned Out wrote:
    Carlin got a lot of things right. His social and political commentary was always bang on, and presented in a manner as thought provoking as it was hilarious. That clip was the perfect example...How often is the hypocrisy of US histpry, or the militarized nature of the national psyche spoken about in the mainstream? ...and how many people have viewed that clip over the years, who may not have given a second thought to the version of history they've been taught? He exposed a lot of people who didnt otherwise have much interest in his topics, to a new way of seeing themselves and their country. . I think people underestimate the importance of a guy like Carlin...he is truely missed.

    This is so true!
    He who forgets will be destined to remember.

    9/29/04 Boston, 6/28/08 Mansfield, 8/23/09 Chicago, 5/15/10 Hartford
    5/17/10 Boston, 10/15/13 Worcester, 10/16/13 Worcester, 10/25/13 Hartford
    8/5/16 Fenway, 8/7/16 Fenway
    EV Solo: 6/16/11 Boston, 6/18/11 Hartford,
  • FiveB247xFiveB247x Posts: 2,330
    Great video. Love carlin.
    CONservative governMENt

    Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,303
    carlin was the man. he predicted the 2nd gulf war before 9/11 even happened in his book brain droppings. he had a bit about dick (cheney) and colin (powell) the architects of the first gulf war going back for seconds. he was an amazing social commentator, entertainer, and comedian....i really miss carlin and lament the state of stand up comedy as social commentary when today the biggest comedy draws are hacks like dane cook and carlos mencia....
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • ed243421ed243421 Posts: 7,672
    he spoke the truth

    wouldn't it be nice to truly celebrate a nation on this day
    that helps the world be a better place for our future generations?

    or are we celebrating a militaristic force that has stolen land, committed genocide, and been at war for most of it's existence

    all for money
    The whole world will be different soon... - EV
    RED ROCKS 6-19-95
    AUGUSTA 9-26-96
    MANSFIELD 9-15-98
    BOSTON 9-29-04
    BOSTON 5-25-06
    MANSFIELD 6-30-08
    EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
    BOSTON 5-17-10
    EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
    PJ20 9-3-11
    PJ20 9-4-11
    WRIGLEY 7-19-13
    WORCESTER 10-15-13
    WORCESTER 10-16-13
    HARTFORD 10-25-13









  • KDH12KDH12 Posts: 2,096
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWiBt-pq ... re=related

    I like this one perfect the 4th
    **CUBS GO ALL THE WAY IN......never **
  • keeponrockinkeeponrockin Posts: 7,446
    He was a fantastic commentator.
    Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
  • chadwickchadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    carlin is genius
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.
  • Pepe SilviaPepe Silvia Posts: 3,758
    Godfather. wrote:
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.


    if you see something wrong with your country there is nothing wrong with saying so. what about civil rights? should they have stopped 'whining and moved forward'? what about viet nam? should no one have protested that war and just moved on?

    however, i think the scam that is the 2 party system has intentionally polarized the majority of our country to hinder any real progress. instead of working together and moving forward we separate into 2 teams and automatically dismiss the other. we won't move forward because we are too busy saying something is so wrong when the other team does it and finding ways to rationalize it when it's their team. they just take turns bitching or defending certain actions depending on if they are the ones doing it.

    what you seem to be wanting is everyone to just go along with whatever the state says and does and just accept it. maybe i just misread your post....

    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority" - Benjamin Franklin

    “Dissent is the highest form of patriotism." - Thomas Jefferson

    it looks like the founding fathers disagree with you
    don't compete; coexist

    what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?

    "I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama

    when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
    i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Pepe Silvia wrote:
    what you seem to be wanting is everyone to just go along with whatever the state says and does and just accept it. maybe i just misread your post....
    Right....godfather, you've managed to combine two very dangerous attitudes in one post: wishing everyone would stop complaing about their country, under the guise of 'patriotism', and telling people to ignore history....yikes.
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    no not really, I'm just fed up with so many people complaining or taking jabs at our country and it's history
    sometime we don't know how good we have it here in America,in a short few hundred years this country has made great progress and maybe more than countries that have been around for thousands of years...ya think maybe ?
    I also think people lose their focus, they use small parts of history to belittle this country or to use it falsely or only half knowingly to back a statement when history is a little more detailed and even more to it than they know.
    We should all be proud of our country and the advancements we as a people have made here and learn from the mistakes and the good things the people before us went through and achieved.
    as long as we have the freedom to speak our own minds there will always be something to make better with each of our own ideas, just remember why we have that freedom and how we achieved it it wasn't just given to us ..this country and it's thinkers and the men and women that fought for it earned it for us.

    Godfather.
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    Drowned Out wrote:
    Pepe Silvia wrote:
    what you seem to be wanting is everyone to just go along with whatever the state says and does and just accept it. maybe i just misread your post....
    Right....godfather, you've managed to combine two very dangerous attitudes in one post: wishing everyone would stop complaing about their country, under the guise of 'patriotism', and telling people to ignore history....yikes.

    I have never said ignore history...but if people are going to use it to make a statement I think they should know the whole truth of that history before they use bits and pieces of it.

    Godfather.
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    Pepe Silvia wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.


    if you see something wrong with your country there is nothing wrong with saying so. what about civil rights? should they have stopped 'whining and moved forward'? what about viet nam? should no one have protested that war and just moved on?

    however, i think the scam that is the 2 party system has intentionally polarized the majority of our country to hinder any real progress. instead of working together and moving forward we separate into 2 teams and automatically dismiss the other. we won't move forward because we are too busy saying something is so wrong when the other team does it and finding ways to rationalize it when it's their team. they just take turns bitching or defending certain actions depending on if they are the ones doing it.

    what you seem to be wanting is everyone to just go along with whatever the state says and does and just accept it. maybe i just misread your post....

    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority" - Benjamin Franklin

    “Dissent is the highest form of patriotism." - Thomas Jefferson

    it looks like the founding fathers disagree with you

    kinda odd coming from you...the founding fathers thing.

    Godfather.
  • markin ballmarkin ball Posts: 1,075
    Godfather. wrote:
    no not really, I'm just fed up with so many people complaining or taking jabs at our country and it's history
    sometime we don't know how good we have it here in America,in a short few hundred years this country has made great progress and maybe more than countries that have been around for thousands of years...ya think maybe ?
    I also think people lose their focus, they use small parts of history to belittle this country or to use it falsely or only half knowingly to back a statement when history is a little more detailed and even more to it than they know.
    We should all be proud of our country and the advancements we as a people have made here and learn from the mistakes and the good things the people before us went through and achieved.
    as long as we have the freedom to speak our own minds there will always be something to make better with each of our own ideas, just remember why we have that freedom and how we achieved it it wasn't just given to us ..this country and it's thinkers and the men and women that fought for it earned it for us.

    Godfather.

    Let's play a game. I will name five awesome things to be proud of the the good ole U.S.A. but first you have to name and comment on one bad thing done by the U.S. government or its agents.
    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win ."

    "With our thoughts we make the world"
  • SmellymanSmellyman Asia Posts: 4,524
    Godfather. wrote:
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.

    Yeah!!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbyFeFhUTmI&playnext_from=TL&videos=2LdeYShXfHI
  • FiveB247xFiveB247x Posts: 2,330
    "Whining and complaining" as you call is done to observe and improve the society and world around us. That is all Carlin ever did. Complaining about, as you put it, complainers, is pretty silly. It's all about recognition, observation and understanding to grow from experience. And if you don't appreciate what some legitimate gripes, complaints and observations are, perhaps you're just protecting the status quo or like many in our nation, wave the flag as their form of being a good citizen a patriot - which is blind, dumb and the opposite of what is good for our nation. We have far too much comfort, with far too little attention and involvement, so excuse me if I chuckle at your comments about people.
    Godfather. wrote:
    no not really, I'm just fed up with so many people complaining or taking jabs at our country and it's history
    sometime we don't know how good we have it here in America,in a short few hundred years this country has made great progress and maybe more than countries that have been around for thousands of years...ya think maybe ?
    I also think people lose their focus, they use small parts of history to belittle this country or to use it falsely or only half knowingly to back a statement when history is a little more detailed and even more to it than they know.
    We should all be proud of our country and the advancements we as a people have made here and learn from the mistakes and the good things the people before us went through and achieved.
    as long as we have the freedom to speak our own minds there will always be something to make better with each of our own ideas, just remember why we have that freedom and how we achieved it it wasn't just given to us ..this country and it's thinkers and the men and women that fought for it earned it for us.

    Godfather.
    CONservative governMENt

    Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
  • chadwickchadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    Smellyman wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.

    Yeah!!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbyFeFhUTmI&playnext_from=TL&videos=2LdeYShXfHI
    very nice
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    markin ball wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    no not really, I'm just fed up with so many people complaining or taking jabs at our country and it's history
    sometime we don't know how good we have it here in America,in a short few hundred years this country has made great progress and maybe more than countries that have been around for thousands of years...ya think maybe ?
    I also think people lose their focus, they use small parts of history to belittle this country or to use it falsely or only half knowingly to back a statement when history is a little more detailed and even more to it than they know.
    We should all be proud of our country and the advancements we as a people have made here and learn from the mistakes and the good things the people before us went through and achieved.
    as long as we have the freedom to speak our own minds there will always be something to make better with each of our own ideas, just remember why we have that freedom and how we achieved it it wasn't just given to us ..this country and it's thinkers and the men and women that fought for it earned it for us.

    Godfather.



    Let's play a game. I will name five awesome things to be proud of the the good ole U.S.A. but first you have to name and comment on one bad thing done by the U.S. government or its agents.

    why ?

    Godfather.
  • Pepe SilviaPepe Silvia Posts: 3,758
    Godfather. wrote:
    Pepe Silvia wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    freedom is not free and who was carlin to complain,seems he did pretty well for himself in this country.
    I grew up listening to carlin off and on cause my family liked him so much and so did I, I'm just getting a little tired of a bunch of whinners complaining about our country and saying how bad our founding fathers were and this or that is so bad,while I agree good change is always needed thats how we/our country continues to improve
    for our American citizens but really lets stop the whinning about the past and move forward.

    Godfather.


    if you see something wrong with your country there is nothing wrong with saying so. what about civil rights? should they have stopped 'whining and moved forward'? what about viet nam? should no one have protested that war and just moved on?

    however, i think the scam that is the 2 party system has intentionally polarized the majority of our country to hinder any real progress. instead of working together and moving forward we separate into 2 teams and automatically dismiss the other. we won't move forward because we are too busy saying something is so wrong when the other team does it and finding ways to rationalize it when it's their team. they just take turns bitching or defending certain actions depending on if they are the ones doing it.

    what you seem to be wanting is everyone to just go along with whatever the state says and does and just accept it. maybe i just misread your post....

    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority" - Benjamin Franklin

    “Dissent is the highest form of patriotism." - Thomas Jefferson

    it looks like the founding fathers disagree with you

    kinda odd coming from you...the founding fathers thing.

    Godfather.


    how so?
    don't compete; coexist

    what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?

    "I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama

    when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
    i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
  • pjfan021pjfan021 Posts: 684
    carlin was anything but a complainer. he seemed like a normal guy who was seeing his country turn into mini malls, religious hipocrasy, and faulty and moronic govt. practices and his stand up was nothing close to "whining or complaining." He did do pretty well for himself, made good money and a great career, but just because he was well off doesn't mean he can't have an opinion (and one that seems to resonate well with a lot of people.) First and foremost, he was a comedian and never proclaimed to be the answer to the worlds problems. If he made you laugh then you shouldn't have any qualms about him.
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Godfather. wrote:
    no not really, I'm just fed up with so many people complaining or taking jabs at our country and it's history
    sometime we don't know how good we have it here in America,in a short few hundred years this country has made great progress and maybe more than countries that have been around for thousands of years...ya think maybe ?
    I also think people lose their focus, they use small parts of history to belittle this country or to use it falsely or only half knowingly to back a statement when history is a little more detailed and even more to it than they know.
    We should all be proud of our country and the advancements we as a people have made here and learn from the mistakes and the good things the people before us went through and achieved.
    as long as we have the freedom to speak our own minds there will always be something to make better with each of our own ideas, just remember why we have that freedom and how we achieved it it wasn't just given to us ..this country and it's thinkers and the men and women that fought for it earned it for us.

    Godfather.
    I don't want to go on an anti-american rant here (at least it's not still July 4, ugh), but I have to reply to this...
    America advanced much faster than most nations by stealing land and resources, and slaughtering the millions of indigenous people who opposed....then, in the name of the progress you laud, kidnapped and enslaved millions more. Or are those just "small parts of history"? Almost always, wealth is built on the backs of the poor. Nothing builds an empire like slavery, theft, and superior firepower.
    How, pray tell, do YOU think your country managed to surpass other nations to become a superpower so quickly? Superior intellect of the euro founders? Your great constitution? Let me guess....the founders just needed to escape the tyranny back home, live under a capitalist system, and the rest is simply manifest destiny?
  • Godfather.Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    I rest my case. ;)

    Godfather.
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    Godfather. wrote:
    I rest my case. ;)

    Godfather.
    Sorry, you actually answered my question in your first post. Thinkers, and brave men and women who fought for and EARNED a country are what facilitated your meteoric rise to power...sure. Whatever you say. You say fought/earned, I say murdered/stole...same dif. I also apologize for 'losing focus' on what is right and good in the world - america.
  • he still standshe still stands Posts: 2,835
    Drowned Out wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    I rest my case. ;)

    Godfather.
    Sorry, you actually answered my question in your first post. Thinkers, and brave men and women who fought for and EARNED a country are what facilitated your meteoric rise to power...sure. Whatever you say. You say fought/earned, I say murdered/stole...same dif. I also apologize for 'losing focus' on what is right and good in the world - america.

    I usually find myself in the dissenter's camp and I agree that plenty of atrocities forged this nation, but I don't think one can say that it was founded completed on murder and pillaging - similarly it wasn't created totally by honest hard-working men with righteous ideals. There was plenty of genocide (beginning at the earliest possible moment when Columbus killed native americans and took back slaves to Spain when he couldn't find gold in the Bahamas), slavery, theft of land and other possessions, and other horrible events - but there were also moments in the country's history that are marked by bravery and good will. To say it was all one or the other, like all generalizations, is not true in some sense.

    But I always go back to the dissenter's camp and think that since the "founding fathers" held slaves (and ironically fought for "freedom") that everything they had to say can be ignored. Its kind of like the Unabomber, he had some pretty good points but we don't listen to him because he killed people. Maybe that's how we should view the founding fathers and all others who held slaves, killed indigenous people, and stole land. I think the people who did the things the "right way" didn't make the history books because they led simple lives away from the evils of the growing tendency of men to desire ruling other men.
    Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
  • haffajappahaffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    Its so true about the national anthem!
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    he still stands wrote:
    Drowned Out wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    I rest my case. ;)

    Godfather.
    Sorry, you actually answered my question in your first post. Thinkers, and brave men and women who fought for and EARNED a country are what facilitated your meteoric rise to power...sure. Whatever you say. You say fought/earned, I say murdered/stole...same dif. I also apologize for 'losing focus' on what is right and good in the world - america.

    I usually find myself in the dissenter's camp and I agree that plenty of atrocities forged this nation, but I don't think one can say that it was founded completed on murder and pillaging - similarly it wasn't created totally by honest hard-working men with righteous ideals. There was plenty of genocide (beginning at the earliest possible moment when Columbus killed native americans and took back slaves to Spain when he couldn't find gold in the Bahamas), slavery, theft of land and other possessions, and other horrible events - but there were also moments in the country's history that are marked by bravery and good will. To say it was all one or the other, like all generalizations, is not true in some sense.

    But I always go back to the dissenter's camp and think that since the "founding fathers" held slaves (and ironically fought for "freedom") that everything they had to say can be ignored. Its kind of like the Unabomber, he had some pretty good points but we don't listen to him because he killed people. Maybe that's how we should view the founding fathers and all others who held slaves, killed indigenous people, and stole land. I think the people who did the things the "right way" didn't make the history books because they led simple lives away from the evils of the growing tendency of men to desire ruling other men.

    Technically, you CAN say that the US is founded on pillaging and murder, because the rightful owners of the land were slaughtered to the point that they had little say in the formation of the nation. Yes, I'm sure there were good people amongst the settlers, and a LOT of goodwill (tho often tragically misguided), but that doesn't change the fact that the land was not theirs to build a nation on. But that's semantics, I know what you're saying about generalizations, good intentions, and what was deemed worthy of historical record.

    The inference that the US's great 'progress' is/was due to great thinkers and people who fought for and earned the country, with only "small parts" as blots on it's history, combined with the 'stop complaining', with-us-or-against-us attitude, is what triggered my rant(s)...millions of lives are not small parts, nor is a century of free labour, nor a continent worth of natural resources, nor are any of the other atrocities carried out in the name of the american version of progress. He thinks people talk (whine) too much about the dark parts of US history, I think the exact opposite. Those parts are usually ignored, or told only from the state perspective.
  • ed243421ed243421 Posts: 7,672
    well said
    drowned out
    The whole world will be different soon... - EV
    RED ROCKS 6-19-95
    AUGUSTA 9-26-96
    MANSFIELD 9-15-98
    BOSTON 9-29-04
    BOSTON 5-25-06
    MANSFIELD 6-30-08
    EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
    BOSTON 5-17-10
    EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
    PJ20 9-3-11
    PJ20 9-4-11
    WRIGLEY 7-19-13
    WORCESTER 10-15-13
    WORCESTER 10-16-13
    HARTFORD 10-25-13









  • he still standshe still stands Posts: 2,835
    All I'm saying is that the country was founded exlusively by murdering and pillaging. I don't think that is even controversial; to say that not ALL people were murderers and pillagers. :?
    Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
  • Drowned OutDrowned Out Posts: 6,056
    he still stands wrote:
    All I'm saying is that the country was founded exlusively by murdering and pillaging. I don't think that is even controversial; to say that not ALL people were murderers and pillagers. :?
    Of course not, I agreed with that and said so in my last post (tried to anyway :D). The first paragraph was adding that regardless of the intentions or bravado of the founders, the nation itself was founded on stolen land.
    The second justifyied and further explained how godfather's post provoked me to post so negatively about US history. I don't really take exception to anything in your post and didn't mean to infer that i did.
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