Polite Discussion About Appropriate Post Locked

CantKeepMeHere

I am just not 100% clear on how much of the moderators personal views are reflected in locked post nor about the method used to deem appropriate or inappropriate within the forum.

I guess I view them as the Supreme Court - highly qualified and unbiased - able to look at a given situation and make a decision to "lock" or "not lock", send "warnings" or not based not on their beliefs and values but rather on the merit of the guidelines as they are stated.

My confusion mostly comes from examples such as how the “F” word and other crude language is often used in the subject line of a thread and deemed acceptable, while board members chatting about the wonders of a fictitious Pearl Jam concert party at a members house gets shut down.

Most of all – there is rarely a given explanation for any thread being locked. Yes my high horse has me shouting “free speech (in this case twenty bucks a year) and that under no reasons should any thread ever be locked” but I like everyone else chose to adhere to the set guidelines when my account was deducted the $20.

I am not calling anyone out, fishing or rick-rolling any board members or moderator; however I am just asking if anyone else views a lot of murky gray about this matter within the Pearl Jam Message Board.

There are times where the reason for a locked thread is obvious, but I honestly feel that most times there is not. I also must ask about why the position of the moderators isn’t to just remove the one “bad” post amongst the many others in the same thread and post an explanation about that given situation.

I think that EVERYONE at 10Club does an A+ job and I just want to know more of what my posting parameters are – clearly.

Remember "Congress shall make no law" has never been interpreted by the Court as an absolute prohibition on regulation of speech. The Court has often said that the primary purpose of the First Amendment is to protect speech that promotes a robust public debate and conversation. I believe that this is exactly what we are all here for 100%, as long as well agree that “debate” does not mean arguing and being rude to one another. As always a closed mouth gathers no feet.

Thanks for taking the time to read and giving your feedback.

Lawful Regulation on Speech

Obscenity.
Speech defined as obscenity is outside the boundaries of First Amendment protection. As defined by Miller v. California, obscenity is speech that (1) the average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find, taken as a whole, to appeal to the prurient interest; (2) depicts or describes in a patently offensive manner specifically defined sexual conduct; and (3) lacks as a whole serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. The definition of obscenity, developed in 1973, focuses on a local "community standard," and has proven to be the crux of litigation surrounding internet censorship cases, which by their nature cannot depend upon local community standards. COPA Litigation Page.

Fighting Words.
Speech likely to provoke an average listener to retaliation, and thereby cause a breach of peace, falls outside the protection of the First Amendment because the words have no important role in the marketplace of ideas the freedom of speech is designed to promote. Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire.

Incitement ("clear and present danger").
The government can regulate speech that is intended and likely to incite "imminent lawless action," or where the speech presents a "clear and present danger" to the security of the nation or individuals. Brandenburg v. Ohio.

Thanks again for helping me become a person of greater respect and intelligence through our terrific conversations of the years and the ones yet to be had in the future.

JDK

realmgeorge

fuck this post.

:-D

CJMST3K

PJ concert at CantKeepMeHere's house!

dimitrispearljam

ibtl...!!!Bazinga KAT!!!

CJMST3K

I agree about it being murky though.

youngster

There are certain things you can't say in a post or else it will be locked.

Here's an example:


FREE BOSTON LOU!!!!!!!!!!!


See, this thread will be locked before you know it!

81

this is one of the better forums on the net.

washedinblack91

i don't like it when people put up america's laws and expect everyone to obey it. i know the pearl jam and 10c is based in america and what not but it's still the internet which is a world wide thing.

FenwayFaithful

Did I miss something here?

norm

1st amendment

CantKeepMeHere

washedinblack91 wrote:

i don't like it when people put up america's laws and expect everyone to obey it. i know the pearl jam and 10c is based in america and what not but it's still the internet which is a world wide thing.

Those were posted to show the parallels between the 1st Amendment and the guidelines - I like the guidelines and think they are very well written and cover most of the debate/conversation topics on the forum.
Your comment about the internet being a world wide thing is kinda where I am have trouble understanding where the locked threads are coming from - especially when one line is taken way out of context -
A member was writing once ( I cannot cut and past the OP's words because that is also against the guidelines) about how much he liked the Mike McCready penned songs (Given To Fly - Inside Job) and wondered why he doesn't write more or have a solo album and used the word lazy within his post in a non-negative nor insulting manner to express his feelings and thoughts about such a dynamite song writer not having more songs on an album.
The moderators took that one line so out of context and locked the post.
I took his choice of the word lazy with in his glowing praises of Mike to mean, that with NO OTHER distractions, because he was snowed in when he wrote Faithful and GTF, that Mike puts out such top notch material.

:P

dimitrispearljam

norm wrote:

1st amendment

CantKeepMeHere

dimitrispearljam wrote:

ibtl...!!!Bazinga KAT!!!

Even veteran members know that anything can be closed down on a whim

CantKeepMeHere

FenwayFaithful wrote:

Did I miss something here?

Other than a left sock?

JOEJOEJOE

This is a private message board, so the constitution isn't the controlling factor.

I believe in free speech, but since these boards are "governed" by PJ's organization, I can see that there is a need to censor certain topics. If there were threads that were pro-racsim or pro-child porn, not censoring them could cause people to think that PJ supports such issues.

Not sure why they would shut-down a thread re: PJ playing at someones house, but perhaps they do this to prevent rumors from spreading. Some of the people on these boards take rumors, no matter how unlikely, as the truth, and when they are proven as false, the boards get filled with negative vibes.

CantKeepMeHere

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

This is a private message board, so the constitution isn't the controlling factor.

I believe in free speech, but since these boards are "governed" by PJ's organization, I can see that there is a need to censor certain topics. If there were threads that were pro-racsim or pro-child porn, not censoring them could cause people to think that PJ supports such issues.

Not sure why they would shut-down a thread re: PJ playing at someones house, but perhaps they do this to prevent rumors from spreading. Some of the people on these boards take rumors, no matter how unlikely, as the truth, and when they are proven as false, the boards get filled with negative vibes.

Isn't that exactly why there is a report this post button? So we can self govern?
I hear what you are saying about rumors but really isn't that a vast majority of the post here anyway - even discussing the meaning of lyrics are rumors because there is no way to confirm them.

washedinblack91

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

This is a private message board, so the constitution isn't the controlling factor.

I believe in free speech, but since these boards are "governed" by PJ's organization, I can see that there is a need to censor certain topics. If there were threads that were pro-racsim or pro-child porn, not censoring them could cause people to think that PJ supports such issues.

Not sure why they would shut-down a thread re: PJ playing at someones house, but perhaps they do this to prevent rumors from spreading. Some of the people on these boards take rumors, no matter how unlikely, as the truth, and when they are proven as false, the boards get filled with negative vibes.

Isn't that exactly why there is a report this post button? So we can self govern?
I hear what you are saying about rumors but really isn't that a vast majority of the post here anyway - even discussing the meaning of lyrics are rumors because there is no way to confirm them.

we can try and self govern for gross misconduct but there are some grey areas. like, some people may see dead baby jokes as atrocious and utterly unforgivable while others may see it as hilarious dark humor. point is that the 10c has rules and people should try to abide by them because this is a private message board. now, i do believe that there are times when the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does, but i think for the most part the 10c does fine.

CantKeepMeHere

washedinblack91 wrote:

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

Isn't that exactly why there is a report this post button? So we can self govern?
I hear what you are saying about rumors but really isn't that a vast majority of the post here anyway - even discussing the meaning of lyrics are rumors because there is no way to confirm them.

we can try and self govern for gross misconduct but there are some grey areas. like, some people may see dead baby jokes as atrocious and utterly unforgivable while others may see it as hilarious dark humor. point is that the 10c has rules and people should try to abide by them because this is a private message board. now, i do believe that there are times when the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does, but i think for the most part the 10c does fine.

I am still agreeing with you - and when you say "the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does" - there is no avenue for it - I have been locked a few times and it feels like a one way street when I plead my case - Given clear defined reasons as the last post on a locked post from the moderators would have me lose no more sleep over this topic -
I have read and re-read the guidelines and within them they read to have clear defined areas of "non-post-able" topics and many of the locked threads do fall within those categories, in my humble opinion.

However, thus far it seems as if I am kinda in the minority about all the above stated and as more folks post here I am a big enough person to either let it go or perhaps have some means of a group communication stating that we the paying parties and supports of the band and this site would like to include within the posting guidelines as such...

CantKeepMeHere

washedinblack91 wrote:

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

This is a private message board, so the constitution isn't the controlling factor.

I believe in free speech, but since these boards are "governed" by PJ's organization, I can see that there is a need to censor certain topics. If there were threads that were pro-racsim or pro-child porn, not censoring them could cause people to think that PJ supports such issues.

Not sure why they would shut-down a thread re: PJ playing at someones house, but perhaps they do this to prevent rumors from spreading. Some of the people on these boards take rumors, no matter how unlikely, as the truth, and when they are proven as false, the boards get filled with negative vibes.

Isn't that exactly why there is a report this post button? So we can self govern?
I hear what you are saying about rumors but really isn't that a vast majority of the post here anyway - even discussing the meaning of lyrics are rumors because there is no way to confirm them.

we can try and self govern for gross misconduct but there are some grey areas. like, some people may see dead baby jokes as atrocious and utterly unforgivable while others may see it as hilarious dark humor. point is that the 10c has rules and people should try to abide by them because this is a private message board. now, i do believe that there are times when the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does, but i think for the most part the 10c does fine.

I really like how you think and the way in which you communicate

washedinblack91

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

washedinblack91 wrote:

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

Isn't that exactly why there is a report this post button? So we can self govern?
I hear what you are saying about rumors but really isn't that a vast majority of the post here anyway - even discussing the meaning of lyrics are rumors because there is no way to confirm them.

we can try and self govern for gross misconduct but there are some grey areas. like, some people may see dead baby jokes as atrocious and utterly unforgivable while others may see it as hilarious dark humor. point is that the 10c has rules and people should try to abide by them because this is a private message board. now, i do believe that there are times when the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does, but i think for the most part the 10c does fine.

I am still agreeing with you - and when you say "the 10c probably have locked threads when they shouldn't have (i don't come here often enough but i'm sure it's happened) and i do believe someone should say something when it does" - there is no avenue for it - I have been locked a few times and it feels like a one way street when I plead my case - Given clear defined reasons as the last post on a locked post from the moderators would have me lose no more sleep over this topic -
I have read and re-read the guidelines and within them they read to have clear defined areas of "non-post-able" topics and many of the locked threads do fall within those categories, in my humble opinion.

However, thus far it seems as if I am kinda in the minority about all the above stated and as more folks post here I am a big enough person to either let it go or perhaps have some means of a group communication stating that we the paying parties and supports of the band and this site would like to include within the posting guidelines as such...

wow. an adult on the porch? this is new, usually there's just a bunch of 12 year olds running their mouths off constantly you bring up valid points and Kat does on occasion respond to people who have asked politely why a thread has been locked. there's a good chance she'll respond if this thread doesn't get out of hand

JOEJOEJOE

.

Gern Blansten

probably the stupidest thread I've ever seen....congrats

CantKeepMeHere

Gern Blansten wrote:

probably the stupidest thread I've ever seen....congrats

I thought someone who wrote

"I think it'd be pretty silly to use this as an example of government infringing on rights. This is the government giving you rights back. When the salt is already added to your food, you have no choice. We should definitely cut back to more moderate levels and let people shake salt over their own food ..."

would tend to agree with me

U R A Crazy Breed

this wonderful place in which we inhabit abides to no laws but it's own and those may vary on any given day...i have come to learn this over the years....i have had my shit locked & deleted....i have been put in time out by Kat and i have had warnings about shit too.....sometimes i deserve it sometimes i don't ....sometimes there are misunderstandings, such as certain words i have used that were taken wrong...but the mods have always been fair for the most part....plus they have to wade through a lot of bullshit every day and put up with all us wacko's & nut jobs

so....nobody is perfect...we all have our days....that includes the mods...they are only human too...not that they haven't pissed me off before but i know they can say the same about me....see how that works?

and the 1st amendment has been shit on by Washington for a long time now and is no where near what the forefathers had intended....you never put limits on free speech because then it's not free...you have to be willing to die to protect the speech of even the people who you disagree with or hate!! that is what it means to be an American...or at least that's what it used to mean!!

but anyway...nice rant..i feel what you are saying...and i fuck'n agree with most of it.

so....what show's ya doing?

dimitrispearljam

U R A Crazy Breed wrote:

this wonderful place in which we inhabit abides to no laws but it's own and those may vary on any given day...i have come to learn this over the years....i have had my shit locked & deleted....i have been put in time out by Kat and i have had warnings about shit too.....sometimes i deserve it sometimes i don't ....sometimes there are misunderstandings, such as certain words i have used that were taken wrong...but the mods have always been fair for the most part....plus they have to wade through a lot of bullshit every day and put up with all us wacko's & nut jobs

so....nobody is perfect...we all have our days....that includes the mods...they are only human too...not that they haven't pissed me off before but i know they can say the same about me....see how that works?

and the 1st amendment has been shit on by Washington for a long time now and is no where near what the forefathers had intended....you never put limits on free speech because then it's not free...you have to be willing to die to protect the speech of even the people who you disagree with or hate!! that is what it means to be an American...or at least that's what it used to mean!!

but anyway...nice rant..i feel what you are saying...and i fuck'n agree with most of it.

so....what show's ya doing?

im sure u are too good with blah blah to women....i can be your wing man..

U R A Crazy Breed

dimitrispearljam wrote:

U R A Crazy Breed wrote:

this wonderful place in which we inhabit abides to no laws but it's own and those may vary on any given day...i have come to learn this over the years....i have had my shit locked & deleted....i have been put in time out by Kat and i have had warnings about shit too.....sometimes i deserve it sometimes i don't ....sometimes there are misunderstandings, such as certain words i have used that were taken wrong...but the mods have always been fair for the most part....plus they have to wade through a lot of bullshit every day and put up with all us wacko's & nut jobs

so....nobody is perfect...we all have our days....that includes the mods...they are only human too...not that they haven't pissed me off before but i know they can say the same about me....see how that works?

and the 1st amendment has been shit on by Washington for a long time now and is no where near what the forefathers had intended....you never put limits on free speech because then it's not free...you have to be willing to die to protect the speech of even the people who you disagree with or hate!! that is what it means to be an American...or at least that's what it used to mean!!

but anyway...nice rant..i feel what you are saying...and i fuck'n agree with most of it.

so....what show's ya doing?

im sure u are too good with blah blah to women....i can be your wing man..

we'd make quite the pair up in the club D!

CantKeepMeHere

U R A Crazy Breed wrote:

this wonderful place in which we inhabit abides to no laws but it's own and those may vary on any given day...i have come to learn this over the years....i have had my shit locked & deleted....i have been put in time out by Kat and i have had warnings about shit too.....sometimes i deserve it sometimes i don't ....sometimes there are misunderstandings, such as certain words i have used that were taken wrong...but the mods have always been fair for the most part....plus they have to wade through a lot of bullshit every day and put up with all us wacko's & nut jobs

so....nobody is perfect...we all have our days....that includes the mods...they are only human too...not that they haven't pissed me off before but i know they can say the same about me....see how that works?

and the 1st amendment has been shit on by Washington for a long time now and is no where near what the forefathers had intended....you never put limits on free speech because then it's not free...you have to be willing to die to protect the speech of even the people who you disagree with or hate!! that is what it means to be an American...or at least that's what it used to mean!!

but anyway...nice rant..i feel what you are saying...and i fuck'n agree with most of it.

so....what show's ya doing?

MSG I and MSG II


Next weekend is Cinco de Mayo and that is my wife's Bday so we always have a Cinco de Mayo Party (usually around 10pm or so I make it a Pearl Jam Party_ - then the next weekend my main pal turns 30 (more beer) - then Pearl Jam MSG - then my other main bud graduates from College so yes more beer - Beer Beer Beer

Gary Carter

Gern Blansten wrote:

probably the stupidest thread I've ever seen....congrats

+1

The pics where ed looks hot in white pants take the cake on stupidest thread

Op instead of making threads like thi just pm kat instead if you have a personal problem with the way things are run. She's always responded to everyone one my pm's or emails I've ever sent to her.

CantKeepMeHere

metsfan wrote:

Gern Blansten wrote:

probably the stupidest thread I've ever seen....congrats

+1

The pics where ed looks hot in white pants take the cake on stupidest thread

Op instead of making threads like thi just pm kat instead if you have a personal problem with the way things are run. She's always responded to everyone one my pm's or emails I've ever sent to her.

I just wanted get the pulse of everyone and make sure I'm not just an asshole

U R A Crazy Breed

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

MSG I and MSG II


Next weekend is Cinco de Mayo and that is my wife's Bday so we always have a Cinco de Mayo Party (usually around 10pm or so I make it a Pearl Jam Party_ - then the next weekend my main pal turns 30 (more beer) - then Pearl Jam MSG - then my other main bud graduates from College so yes more beer - Beer Beer Beer

dude! sounds like you have a shit load of awesomeness on the horizon! tell the wife i said happy b-day and i hope y'all have a blast @ MSG, NY is pretty cool...well...Manhattan is anyway. ( man...i hope Eli doesn't see this! )

CHEERS!!!

CantKeepMeHere

U R A Crazy Breed wrote:

CantKeepMeHere wrote:

MSG I and MSG II


Next weekend is Cinco de Mayo and that is my wife's Bday so we always have a Cinco de Mayo Party (usually around 10pm or so I make it a Pearl Jam Party_ - then the next weekend my main pal turns 30 (more beer) - then Pearl Jam MSG - then my other main bud graduates from College so yes more beer - Beer Beer Beer

dude! sounds like you have a shit load of awesomeness on the horizon! tell the wife i said happy b-day and i hope y'all have a blast @ MSG, NY is pretty cool...well...Manhattan is anyway. ( man...i hope Eli doesn't see this! )

CHEERS!!!

We are moving in Sep. Oct. buying a house and next years Cinco de Mayo will be huge and I will be sure to invite your sorry ass!!