From ESPN - PJ Vs. Alice

Who I Am

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/thelife/ ... id=4554676


whatever sports guy!

PJammin'

sports guy should stick to sports. his opinion means nothing to me...especially when he says there are only 4 or 5 good songs on backspacer.

SomethingCreative

PJammin' wrote:

sports guy should stick to sports. his opinion means nothing to me...especially when he says there are only 4 or 5 good songs on backspacer.

I'm more hung up on the Metallica comparison...gross

AA64768

The author is Paul Shirley, not Bill Simmons.

WeBelongTogether

"Private Hell" is a f*cking amazing song.

j_web18

AA64768 wrote:

The author is Paul Shirley, not Bill Simmons.

I think they are just saying it like "hey you sports guy!" more than referring to him as "The Sports Guy" Bill Simmons.

I used to read Shirley a lot in college, when he was actually playing basketball (and writing about it) he was pretty interesting. Since then, he has kept writing but every once in a while will come up with some convoluted argument for why HE knows more about music than you do and can prove it. He even wrote an article a few weeks ago about how no one of the X or Y generation could or should like the Beatles as much as modern bands (just a synopsis, but its as dumb as it sounds).

Anyway, if you want to read what he does best check out "Can I Keep my Jersey?" at Amazon or something. I think he even mentions in hehre about how you never want to be one of those guys, like the ones that yell "EDDIE!" at a PJ concert.

locked

I actually agree 100 perecent with what he says...

My opnion may change about the backspacer tunes live.. but on CD the nod goes to AIC here..

Not a diss of PJ overall just these two CD's face to face..

Tangerine

Coming from someone whose listened to both albums, Backspacer is better. I'm not being subjective it's just AIC sounds like AIC like they have over and over and over again. I'm sure they're trying to ensure that Duvall gets his props as sounding as much like Staley as he can and he does sound great, they sound like the same old same old. It's time they try something, anything new.

jubilairesjl

I like the new AIC in all...I think it is pretty good but All I can say is that I enjoyed Backspacer much more and I still do. I've prolly listened to it about 30 some times now and I still think it is good. I don't know if I could ever put it up with Yield, No Code, Vitalogy, Vs. or Ten....but I will definitely put it above Riot Act and Avocado...don't know about Binaural cause that one is just awesome.

PearlJam24

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Tell Paul Shirley what you think...

Keep on Jammin

He seems like a genuine fan of both bands and is stating his opinion. He's entitled.

More than anything, this makes me want to pick up the AIC album that I have been reluctant to. I think it feels like cheating on Layne a little bit. Of course, I did download the first single a while ago from Amazon.

goldrush

Anyone else give up reading this when he started the Metallica comparisons?..

soulsinging

i havent heard the new aic and don't have a lot of interest in it. oddly, i love backspacer, but agree with a lot of his criticisms of it, including the metallica analogy. PJ seems to have forgotten how much power they can bring to a song by letting it breathe and build and produce tension and drama. instead, the opt for short rapid fire songs that slide by and are forgotten. i like backspacer in spite of this... the fast songs are catchy enough for once to be worthwhile, and there are a few tunes that remind me of the epic rocking power the band can bring. so overall, the album scores with me. but they do seem to have moved away from their strengths over the last decade as Ed tries to be punk and the rest of the band follows along. i don't think we're ever going to see a song like present tense or immortality again...

SPEEDY MCCREADY

soulsinging wrote:

i havent heard the new aic and don't have a lot of interest in it. oddly, i love backspacer, but agree with a lot of his criticisms of it, including the metallica analogy. PJ seems to have forgotten how much power they can bring to a song by letting it breathe and build and produce tension and drama. instead, the opt for short rapid fire songs that slide by and are forgotten. i like backspacer in spite of this... the fast songs are catchy enough for once to be worthwhile, and there are a few tunes that remind me of the epic rocking power the band can bring. so overall, the album scores with me. but they do seem to have moved away from their strengths over the last decade as Ed tries to be punk and the rest of the band follows along. i don't think we're ever going to see a song like present tense or immortality again...

Yep....

Unthought Known is a masterpiece....

But you are right ......

We may never get a
Present Tense
Immortality
Red Mosquito
Sad
etc.
etc.
again..............

Niko80

soulsinging wrote:

i havent heard the new aic and don't have a lot of interest in it. oddly, i love backspacer, but agree with a lot of his criticisms of it, including the metallica analogy. PJ seems to have forgotten how much power they can bring to a song by letting it breathe and build and produce tension and drama. instead, the opt for short rapid fire songs that slide by and are forgotten. i like backspacer in spite of this... the fast songs are catchy enough for once to be worthwhile, and there are a few tunes that remind me of the epic rocking power the band can bring. so overall, the album scores with me. but they do seem to have moved away from their strengths over the last decade as Ed tries to be punk and the rest of the band follows along. i don't think we're ever going to see a song like present tense or immortality again...

Well said..

GR8Dane

The new Alice in Chains is an incredible listen and if you haven't given it a try you are cheating yourself.

Expand your mind people.

Poncier

Well he did praise "Unknown Thought", so either he's dyslexic or really didn't pay a whole lot of attention when reviewing the record.

At least he got the part about him not being cool right.

DewieCox

Poncier wrote:

Well he did praise "Unknown Thought", so either he's dyslexic or really didn't pay a whole lot of attention when reviewing the record.

So just b/c he doesn't know the song title he can't know the music??


I'd say they are pretty equal albums, with the rest being up to personal preference.

Johnny Abruzzo

I was really annoyed with this review when I first read it. But I think I may agree with some of what he said. I think Ed really does dominate some of the songs, like Johnny Guitar for instance. Just when this song starts to work into a frenzy, it fades out unceremoniously. I could've taken another minute or two of Amongst the Waves & Unthought Known. Force of Nature could be expanded a bit. I guess I don't really get the punk thing.

As far as Black Gives Way to Blue, I haven't listened to it enough times to give a valid review, but it is pretty good. It doesn't seem like they're breaking any new ground here; just trying to recapture the AiC sound I guess. That song Private Hell is pretty amazing.

rrivers

It just his opinion. Who cares? He did make me want to check out the AIC album. I am excited to hear "Private Hell" which everyone seems to like (and which I think is a great title for a song and should have been the album title).

I remember listening to Vs. when it first came out and thinking they didn't let the songs breathe like the songs on Ten did. While they have done it somewhat since, he is right about them definitely moving more towards Eddie dominating the songs.

I agree somewhat on his Metallica thoughts. The main problem I have with Metallica is how bad their lyrics are post Black Album. I do like Death Magnetic for the music.

rrivers

j_web18 wrote:

He even wrote an article a few weeks ago about how no one of the X or Y generation could or should like the Beatles as much as modern bands (just a synopsis, but its as dumb as it sounds).

I read that article. At first I agreed with him because I thought his premise was going to be not to like a band just because you are supposed to like them. But it became just about how you should not like a band outside your generation as much as one in your generation.

cutz

What i don't understand, is how he liked The Fixer, and that got him excited to hear the whole album. Then to ONLY like 5 songs, after listening to the album? The Fixer MIGHT be the weakest song on the album.

soulsinging

rrivers wrote:

j_web18 wrote:

He even wrote an article a few weeks ago about how no one of the X or Y generation could or should like the Beatles as much as modern bands (just a synopsis, but its as dumb as it sounds).

I read that article. At first I agreed with him because I thought his premise was going to be not to like a band just because you are supposed to like them. But it became just about how you should not like a band outside your generation as much as one in your generation.

yeah, i was intrigued by the beatles article, but felt like i could make a better argument against beatles hype than he did. i mean, he keeps mentioning gnr building on the beatles... maybe, but i was outside both generations and i'll take most beatles albums over most gnr albums any day, even though i love both. and i'm a huge oasis fan, and their best moments rival any band for me, but the beatles have a lot of albums that are better listens than oasis albums and that has nothing to do with generations or reverence for beatles mythology.

Rhinocerous Surprise

soulsinging wrote:

rrivers wrote:

j_web18 wrote:

He even wrote an article a few weeks ago about how no one of the X or Y generation could or should like the Beatles as much as modern bands (just a synopsis, but its as dumb as it sounds).

I read that article. At first I agreed with him because I thought his premise was going to be not to like a band just because you are supposed to like them. But it became just about how you should not like a band outside your generation as much as one in your generation.

yeah, i was intrigued by the beatles article, but felt like i could make a better argument against beatles hype than he did. i mean, he keeps mentioning gnr building on the beatles... maybe, but i was outside both generations and i'll take most beatles albums over most gnr albums any day, even though i love both. and i'm a huge oasis fan, and their best moments rival any band for me, but the beatles have a lot of albums that are better listens than oasis albums and that has nothing to do with generations or reverence for beatles mythology.

The problem with the Beatles article was, of all the arguments you could make against the Beatles, saying that they're precluded from being the favourite band of anyone born after 1970 is probably the single most boneheaded one. I'd hate to hear who his favourite classical composer is.

But he's right about Pearl Jam. I like Backspacer, but it's short on memorable music. Catchy songs, some decent lyrics, but very little memorable music. Whereas the new AiC is a pretty great effort (although I do disagree with him about the title track - it's beautiful).

j_web18

Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:

soulsinging wrote:

rrivers wrote:

I read that article. At first I agreed with him because I thought his premise was going to be not to like a band just because you are supposed to like them. But it became just about how you should not like a band outside your generation as much as one in your generation.

yeah, i was intrigued by the beatles article, but felt like i could make a better argument against beatles hype than he did. i mean, he keeps mentioning gnr building on the beatles... maybe, but i was outside both generations and i'll take most beatles albums over most gnr albums any day, even though i love both. and i'm a huge oasis fan, and their best moments rival any band for me, but the beatles have a lot of albums that are better listens than oasis albums and that has nothing to do with generations or reverence for beatles mythology.

The problem with the Beatles article was, of all the arguments you could make against the Beatles, saying that they're precluded from being the favourite band of anyone born after 1970 is probably the single most boneheaded one. I'd hate to hear who his favourite classical composer is.

But he's right about Pearl Jam. I like Backspacer, but it's short on memorable music. Catchy songs, some decent lyrics, but very little memorable music. Whereas the new AiC is a pretty great effort (although I do disagree with him about the title track - it's beautiful).

Yeah, I am not completely against the Backspacer critique but after the Beatles thing (is it just me, or did he conveniently pretend the verb transcend doesn’t exist in that article?) it is almost impossible to take him seriously on the subject.

Here is the thing: if you want to write about music, great! But create a personal Tumbler or a blog and do it. Don’t force the few words you get on ESPN.com to be about something you aren’t particularly good at yet and has nothing to do with the content people are coming to your site to consume. It is very selfish when you think about it.

For example, Will Leitch started Deadspin and writes mainly about sports. However, he is also an adamant movie fan. So, he created a Tumbler page where he can write film reviews for people to read if they so chose. He didn’t waste Deadspin reader’s time with a review of “Whatever Works”. Are his pieces on film as good as sports? No, of course not. He has spent a lot more time writing about sports and has developed a style that few have (the same way Paul did with basketball). But, he is getting better at the movie thing and is starting to write about them more frequently in the New York Magazine. Maybe the same would work for Paul, because as it stands now I tend to raise an eyebrow when I see his name attached to an article.

This all may be a moot point because it may come down to the editors, Will’s may have not been allowed to write on film for Gawker and (knowing ESPN.com) some disconnected editor probably thought Paul’s Beatles article was insightful.

EP1973

Tangerine
Coming from someone whose listened to both albums, Backspacer is better. I'm not being subjective it's just AIC sounds like AIC like they have over and over and over again. I'm sure they're trying to ensure that Duvall gets his props as sounding as much like Staley as he can and he does sound great, they sound like the same old same old. It's time they try something, anything new.

What's wrong with a band sounding like themselves ? I think that is important to a band. The sound can morph a little but I like it when a band stays true to their sound. Nothing wrong with that. There is no prerequisite that states a band has to change their sound at least once to be great. I think Duvall brings a lil more soul to their new album. I love Backspacer, but I love Black Gives Way to Blue just as much.