End of the American Republic?

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  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    edited June 10
    You’ve, general you, been warned.

    Trump has unleashed something terrifying in the US – that even he may be powerless to control

    The protests in LA are what everyone feared, and a warning to countries that flirt with populism

    She was live on air to viewers back home, her TV microphone clearly in hand, when the rubber bullet hit her. The Australian reporter Lauren Tomasi was the second journalist after the British photographer Nick Stern to be shot with non-lethal rounds while covering protests in Los Angeles sparked by immigration raids. But she was the first to be caught on camera and beamed around the world. There’s no excuse for not knowing what the US is becoming, now that anyone can watch that clip online. Not when you can hear her scream and see the cameraman quickly swing away to film a panicking crowd.

    It was the scenario everyone feared when Donald Trump took office. Deportation hit squads descending on the kind of Democrat-voting communities who would feel morally bound to resist them, triggering the kind of violent confrontation that creates an excuse to send in national guard troops – and ultimately a showdown between federal and state power that could take US democracy to the brink. Now something like this may be unfolding in California, where the state governor, Gavin Newsom, has accused the president of trying to “manufacture a crisis” for his own ends and warned that any protester responding with violence is only playing into his hands. Suddenly, the idea that this presidency could ultimately end in civil conflict no longer seems quite so wildly overblown as it once did.

    Or to put it another way, Trump has got what he wanted, which is for everyone to switch channels: to stop gawping at his embarrassing fallout with Elon Musk over unfunded tax cuts, and flick over to the rival spectacle he has hastily created. After a brief interruption to scheduled programming, the great showman is back in control. But in the meantime, the world has learned something useful about who wins in a standoff between two giant egos, one of whom has all the money and the other of whom has all the executive power. In US oligarchies just as in Russian ones, it turns out, it’s presidents who still get to set the agenda.

    You can’t ride the tiger. That’s the lesson here: once populism has grasped the levers of power, even the richest man in the world cannot be sure of exploiting it for his own ends, or imposing his own agenda on the chaos. Not when a vengeful White House still has the power to destroy even the most powerful business empire, anyway. At the weekend, Musk meekly deleted explosive tweets about the president’s alleged relationship with the convicted sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein, and by Monday he was loyally sharing Trumpian messages about the LA protests. His father, meanwhile, tactfully blamed the outburst on Musk Junior being “tired” after five months working round the clock for the White House.

    That ought to ring some bells on this side of the Atlantic. For oddly enough, it’s the same excuse offered up by Zia Yusuf, the millionaire businessman brought in to professionalise Reform UK’s perennially chaotic operation, who last week quit as chair in exasperation. Trying to get the party into power was no longer a “good use of his time”, he tweeted, after publicly clashing with its newest MP, Sarah Pochin, over her decision to ask a question in parliament about banning burqas (which isn’t officially Reform policy, or at least not yet). Yusuf, a British Muslim, has long been seen as Farage’s trusted bulwark against those inside Reform desperate to pick up where the jailed thug Stephen Yaxley-Lennon left off, and to become a full-blown, far-right anti-Islam movement.

    But this time, it seems, Yusuf may have bitten off more than the boss was ready to chew. A whole two days after storming out, Yusuf ended up storming awkwardly back in, telling the BBC that actually, having thought about it, he probably would ban burqas and other face coverings. He had just been exhausted, he suggested, after barely having a day off in 11 months. (If nothing else, it seems Reform really means what it says about fighting back against modern HR practices.)

    To be fair to him, even Farage seems to find the process of trying to control his parties exhausting at times, judging by the regularity with which he has taken breaks from them over the years. While Yusuf won’t return as chair, he will now join Reform’s so-called British Doge, supposedly taking a Musk-style chainsaw to council spending – which sounds like a breeze compared with managing Reform MPs. Until, that is, you reflect on how exactly Doge has turned out across the Atlantic.

    The reason parts of Silicon Valley were quietly enthusiastic about their fellow tech tycoon’s slash and burn approach to US bureaucracy was that they saw profitable method in the madness: a plan to hack the state back to the bare minimum, opening up new markets for digital services and unleashing (or so they hoped) a new wave of economic growth by slashing national debt.

    Five months on, however, it’s clear that any Doge savings will be utterly dwarfed by Trump’s forecast to send national debt soaring to uncharted and potentially unsustainable highs. Any tech titan hoping for the US equivalent of Margaret Thatcher on steroids, in other words, has ended up with Liz Truss after one too many espressos instead – plus troops on the streets of California and the slowly dawning realisation that, as the billionaire venture capitalist Michael Moritz put it, they have “no sway” over what they unleashed.

    There will be plenty of people back in Britain who couldn’t care less about obscure comings and goings in the Reform party, even as its poll lead means it’s starting to make the political weather. Others simply don’t expect it to affect their lives much either way if Reform permanently supplants a Conservative party from which it already seems hard to distinguish, and a few may already be calculating that they can turn its rise to their own advantage.

    Yet what the last few frightening days in the US have demonstrated is that once populism has its feet firmly enough under the table, chaos wins. There’s no ability to belatedly impose order, no house-training it either. All you can do is deny it a room in the house in the first place. In Britain, at least, it’s not too late for that.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jun/09/donald-trump-protests-los-angeles-national-guard-unleashed-terrifying


    Excellent article.
    On the same page, this too:

    We are witnessing the first stages of a Trump police state


    The national guard’s deployment in Los Angeles sets the US on a familiar authoritarian pathway. History shows the results

    Now that Donald Trump’s tariffs have been halted, his big, beautiful bill has been stymied, and his multi-billionaire tech bro has turned on him, how does he demonstrate his power?

    On Friday morning, federal agents from Immigration and Customs Enforcement (Ice), the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), the FBI, and the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) conducted raids across Los Angeles – including at two Home Depots and a clothing wholesaler – in search of workers who they suspected of being undocumented immigrants.

    Though figures vary, they reportedly arrested 121 people.

    They were met with protesters who chanted and threw eggs before being dispersed by police wearing riot gear, holding shields, and using batons, guns that shoot pepper balls, rubber bullets, teargas, and flash-bang grenades.

    On Saturday, Trump escalated the confrontations, ordering at least 2,000 national guard troops to be deployed in Los Angeles county to help quell the protests.

    He said that any demonstration that got in the way of immigration officials would be considered a “form of rebellion.” Stephen Miller, the White House deputy chief of staff, called the protests an “insurrection”.

    On Saturday evening, the defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, threatened to deploy active-duty marines, saying: “The violent mob assaults on ICE and Federal Law Enforcement are designed to prevent the removal of Criminal Illegal Aliens from our soil. A dangerous invasion facilitated by criminal cartels (aka Foreign Terrorist Organizations) and a huge NATIONAL SECURITY RISK. Under President Trump, violence and destruction against federal agents and federal facilities will NOT be tolerated.”

    We are witnessing the first stages of a Trump police state.


    More at link






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  • tbergs
    tbergs Posts: 10,401
    I think this Saturday will mark the end of a lot of things. Predicting a dark day for the nation.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    tbergs said:
    I think this Saturday will mark the end of a lot of things. Predicting a dark day for the nation.
    I predict a "lot of good people on both sides". Even the side with swastikas and heil fives. 
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  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    tbergs said:
    I think this Saturday will mark the end of a lot of things. Predicting a dark day for the nation.
    I agree. A lot of Police Departments are going to feel very empowered.
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  • shecky
    shecky San Francisco Posts: 2,683

    L.A. rioters tossed fireworks at the police horses to frighten them and, hopefully, throw their rider.
    Then, the idiot pictured above punches a horse or attempts to grab its reins, in a malicious act.
    I know you all hate cops but, don't we all like horsies? Oh...I guess not...
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    shecky said:

    L.A. rioters tossed fireworks at the police horses to frighten them and, hopefully, throw their rider.
    Then, the idiot pictured above punches a horse or attempts to grab its reins, in a malicious act.
    I know you all hate cops but, don't we all like horsies? Oh...I guess not...
    Yea, sure, that’s what happened.
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    And, horse tastes good.
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    It’s too late.

    Military members boo Newsom, Biden and the press during Trump speech

    Members of a crowd filled with members of the military and their families booed and jeered President Trump’s political rivals and the press Tuesday at the president’s prompting during his address at Fort Bragg in North Carolina.

    The response from attendees, most of whom were wearing military fatigues, was a jarring sight given the military’s history as a traditionally nonpartisan entity. Presidents have historically drawn criticism when they have been seen as using the military as a political pawn.

    https://apple.news/AYfpTDitjSN-y1ZfBe8V6EQ

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  • gotthebottle
    gotthebottle San Diego Posts: 3,743
    tbergs said:
    I think this Saturday will mark the end of a lot of things. Predicting a dark day for the nation.
    I'll be out there finding out... if we can't march to protest he'll have to arrest millions of us 
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,665
    Teimpnhas manufactured the whole situation, the timing of it (right before the totalitarian military parade) is 100% intentional... this is it. We shall see how it plays out, but anyone, and especially Shecky, lol, who thinks this isn't the most contrived "crisis" in American government history has to be absolutely delusional. 
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    From Letter From An American. Amazing that some posters on here are all in because of “the other” and/or Israel. Amazing to watch in real time. Good fucking luck.

    I wonder how many dead we’ll be singing about in a few weeks.

    Then the governor launched into a wholesale condemnation of the Trump regime. He warned that “[i]f some of us can be snatched off the streets without a warrant, based only on suspicion or skin color, then none of us are safe. Authoritarian regimes begin by targeting people who are least able to defend themselves. But they do not stop there.”

    Newsom called Trump out for firing the government watchdogs that could hold him accountable for fraud, and for declaring war “on culture, on history, on science, on knowledge itself. Databases quite literally are vanishing. He’s delegitimizing news organizations and he’s assaulting the First Amendment…. [H]e’s dictating what universities themselves can teach. He’s targeting law firms and the judicial branch that are the foundations of an orderly and civil society. He’s calling for a sitting governor to be arrested for no other reason than…, in his own words, ‘for getting elected.’”

    “[T]his isn’t just about protests here in Los Angeles,” Newsom said. “When Donald Trump sought blanket authority to commandeer the National Guard, he made that order apply to every state in this nation. This is about all of us. This is about you. California may be first, but it clearly will not end here. Other states are next.”

    “Democracy is under assault right before our eyes,” Newsom said. “This moment we have feared has arrived. He’s taking a wrecking ball…to our founding fathers’ historic project: three coequal branches of independent government.”

    Newsom urged Americans to stand up for the country. “I know many of you are feeling deep anxiety, stress, and fear,” he said. “But I want you to know that you are the antidote to that fear and that anxiety. What Donald Trump wants most is your fealty, your silence, to be complicit in this moment,” Newsom said.

    Do not give in to him.”
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  • DE4173
    DE4173 Posts: 2,799
    From Letter From An American. Amazing that some posters on here are all in because of “the other” and/or Israel. Amazing to watch in real time. Good fucking luck.

    I wonder how many dead we’ll be singing about in a few weeks.

    Then the governor launched into a wholesale condemnation of the Trump regime. He warned that “[i]f some of us can be snatched off the streets without a warrant, based only on suspicion or skin color, then none of us are safe. Authoritarian regimes begin by targeting people who are least able to defend themselves. But they do not stop there.

    Newsom called Trump out for firing the government watchdogs that could hold him accountable for fraud, and for declaring war “on culture, on history, on science, on knowledge itself. Databases quite literally are vanishing. He’s delegitimizing news organizations and he’s assaulting the First Amendment…. [H]e’s dictating what universities themselves can teach. He’s targeting law firms and the judicial branch that are the foundations of an orderly and civil society. He’s calling for a sitting governor to be arrested for no other reason than…, in his own words, ‘for getting elected.’”

    “[T]his isn’t just about protests here in Los Angeles,” Newsom said. “When Donald Trump sought blanket authority to commandeer the National Guard, he made that order apply to every state in this nation. This is about all of us. This is about you. California may be first, but it clearly will not end here. Other states are next.”

    “Democracy is under assault right before our eyes,” Newsom said. “This moment we have feared has arrived. He’s taking a wrecking ball…to our founding fathers’ historic project: three coequal branches of independent government.”

    Newsom urged Americans to stand up for the country. “I know many of you are feeling deep anxiety, stress, and fear,” he said. “But I want you to know that you are the antidote to that fear and that anxiety. What Donald Trump wants most is your fealty, your silence, to be complicit in this moment,” Newsom said.

    Do not give in to him.”
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    You shouldn’t have any illusions. Buh, buh, buh, buh we were told that it couldn’t happen here.

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  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,665
    It's going to be even easier for Trump to end the American Republic now. Nothing like bombing Iran to distract everyone from setting up an authoritarian state. Yeehaw. 
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    PJ_Soul said:
    It's going to be even easier for Trump to end the American Republic now. Nothing like bombing Iran to distract everyone from setting up an authoritarian state. Yeehaw. 

    Apparently this is what America wants.  The majority voted for him.  And they voted for lawmakers who support or at least bend to him.  And though they are a small majority, they are a majority.  Half the fucking country is insane.  
    And it's all so incredibly depressing.  Every American should be concerned, depressed, disturbed, and/or mad as fuck, but I guess not enough of us are.  That's the hardest part.  Living in the huge insane asylum with all these people thinking this is winning.  
    But of course, I'll be accused of exaggerating or being overly dramatic. I guess reality is just too much for some people to handle.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • gotthebottle
    gotthebottle San Diego Posts: 3,743
    brianlux said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    It's going to be even easier for Trump to end the American Republic now. Nothing like bombing Iran to distract everyone from setting up an authoritarian state. Yeehaw. 

    Apparently this is what America wants.  The majority voted for him.  And they voted for lawmakers who support or at least bend to him.  And though they are a small majority, they are a majority.  Half the fucking country is insane.  
    And it's all so incredibly depressing.  Every American should be concerned, depressed, disturbed, and/or mad as fuck, but I guess not enough of us are.  That's the hardest part.  Living in the huge insane asylum with all these people thinking this is winning.  
    But of course, I'll be accused of exaggerating or being overly dramatic. I guess reality is just too much for some people to handle.
    So many that didn't vote.. this is on them. My anxiety is so high right now I can't sleep and can only function enough to get through day. My future hinges on that awful bill in the Senate. None of those gop care about any of us. Reality is unbearable 
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,370

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    brianlux said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    It's going to be even easier for Trump to end the American Republic now. Nothing like bombing Iran to distract everyone from setting up an authoritarian state. Yeehaw. 

    Apparently this is what America wants.  The majority voted for him.  And they voted for lawmakers who support or at least bend to him.  And though they are a small majority, they are a majority.  Half the fucking country is insane.  
    And it's all so incredibly depressing.  Every American should be concerned, depressed, disturbed, and/or mad as fuck, but I guess not enough of us are.  That's the hardest part.  Living in the huge insane asylum with all these people thinking this is winning.  
    But of course, I'll be accused of exaggerating or being overly dramatic. I guess reality is just too much for some people to handle.
    So many that didn't vote.. this is on them. My anxiety is so high right now I can't sleep and can only function enough to get through day. My future hinges on that awful bill in the Senate. None of those gop care about any of us. Reality is unbearable 

    I'm sorry for your very understandable anxiety.   I know it's a very difficult time right now, and many of us are feeling the way you do.  Hopefully we can do enough to build a strong resistance and stop this insanity- and I believe resistance is building. And some of that hinges on getting enough people who voted for T to realize he will only make their lives worse, not better, and hope they too will speak out. 

    One thing that really gets me is how unreal that there are people you can run into at election time who say, "I don't vote because it doesn't make a difference."  The difference this time was between democracy and authoritarianism.  What a catastrophe that led to, and now we all have to live with the consequences.

    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,107
    The next three years will be the nail in the coffin. Good fucking luck everybody.

    Supreme Court limits ability of judges to stop Trump

    In a scathing solo dissent penned by Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson, the appointee of former President Joe Biden accused her conservative colleagues of creating “an existential threat to the rule of law” by allowing Trump to “violate the Constitution.”

    She warned that the “executive lawlessness will flourish” if lower-court judges are now required to let a president “act unlawfully.”

    “Eventually, executive power will become completely uncontainable, and our beloved constitutional Republic will be no more,” Jackson wrote.

    She continued: “Perhaps the degradation of our rule-of-law regime would happen anyway. But this Court’s complicity in the creation of a culture of disdain for lower courts, their rulings, and the law (as they interpret it) will surely hasten the downfall of our governing institutions, enabling our collective demise.”

    https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/supreme-court-decisions-06-27-25

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  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,072
    The next three years will be the nail in the coffin. Good fucking luck everybody.

    Supreme Court limits ability of judges to stop Trump

    In a scathing solo dissent penned by Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson, the appointee of former President Joe Biden accused her conservative colleagues of creating “an existential threat to the rule of law” by allowing Trump to “violate the Constitution.”

    She warned that the “executive lawlessness will flourish” if lower-court judges are now required to let a president “act unlawfully.”

    “Eventually, executive power will become completely uncontainable, and our beloved constitutional Republic will be no more,” Jackson wrote.

    She continued: “Perhaps the degradation of our rule-of-law regime would happen anyway. But this Court’s complicity in the creation of a culture of disdain for lower courts, their rulings, and the law (as they interpret it) will surely hasten the downfall of our governing institutions, enabling our collective demise.”

    https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/supreme-court-decisions-06-27-25

    It can't happen here
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
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