The Pope and the Vatican

tempo_n_groove · May 8

We have a new Pope. He's American. That's a first.

Robert Prevost from Chicago and will go as Pope Leo.

josevolution · May 8

😴

shecky · May 8

Pope? Yes!

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5021252/uploads/editor/yi/98pckmmcgmuh.jpg

tempo_n_groove · May 8

shecky said:

Pope? Yes!

Ill take a 3 piece spicy, dark w dirty rice please.

Halifax2TheMax · May 8

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

tempo_n_groove · May 8

Halifax2TheMax said:

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

"In picking the 69-year-old Prevost, the papal conclave looked past allegations that he had mishandled or failed to act on sexual abuse cases involving priests in both Peru and the United States."

A little different from the wiki but I am sure more negativity will come out about him.

If a politician had any inkling of something like this he would not have a chance at being elected unless he was running for mayor in DC. They seem to go for anything there /s.

Halifax2TheMax · May 8

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

"In picking the 69-year-old Prevost, the papal conclave looked past allegations that he had mishandled or failed to act on sexual abuse cases involving priests in both Peru and the United States."

A little different from the wiki but I am sure more negativity will come out about him.

If a politician had any inkling of something like this he would not have a chance at being elected unless he was running for mayor in DC. They seem to go for anything there /s.

And he kept his views on women in the clergy and gays generally to himself but no surprise there. Or in the below wikiwikiwiki:

Prevost has opposed the ordination of women to the diaconate,[35]stating not only that it "doesn’t necessarily solve a problem" but that "it might make a new problem".[36]

As a bishop[when?] Prevost opposed the inclusion of curriculum regarding "teachings on gender in schools" in Peru, stating that the "promotion of gender ideology is confusing, because it seeks to create genders that don't exist".[37] An acquaintance of Pope Leo XIV, Jesus Leon Angeles, noted that he cares for Venezuelan refugees in Peru.[38]

Homosexuality

Further information: Catholic Church and homosexuality

In 2012, Prevost lamented that popular culture fostered "sympathy for beliefs and practices that are at odds with the Gospel", citing the "homosexual lifestyle" and "alternative families comprised of same-sex partners and their adopted children".[37] After Pope Francis's 2023 declaration Fiducia supplicansallowed Catholic priests to blesscouples who are not married according to church teaching(including same-sex couples), he criticized the practicality of the declaration in parts of Africa where homosexuality is still illegal, saying "our cultural situation is such that the application of this document is just not going to work".[39]

Vitalogensia · May 8

I wonder what his views on eating shrimp and wearing mixed fibers and working on the sabbath are. If he cares so much about the gospel and all.

Poncier · May 8

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

"

If a politician had any inkling of something like this he would not have a chance at being elected unless he was running for mayor in DC. They seem to go for anything there /s.

Or if he were the MAGA candidate for President.

Jearlpam0925 · May 8

Poncier said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

"

If a politician had any inkling of something like this he would not have a chance at being elected unless he was running for mayor in DC. They seem to go for anything there /s.

Or if he were the MAGA candidate for President.

Fwiw

https://x.com/AlexanderMcCoy4/status/1920530456656719890?t=m3u6HZDEdaNUPsP1xOcNuA&s=19

josevolution · May 8

Poncier said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Nice. From wikiwikiwiki.

In 2000, Prevost allowed Father James Ray, an Augustinian priest, to reside at St. John Stone Friary in Chicago. Ray had been suspended from public ministry since 1991 due to credible accusations of sexual abuse of minors. Although the priory was close to a Catholic elementary school, Prevost did not notify the school administration about Ray. The Augustinians noted that Ray was assigned a monitor while at St. John Stone. Ray was moved to a different residence in 2002 when the US Conference of Catholic Bishops adopted stricter rules for handling priests accused of abusing minors.[17][18][b]

Alleged victims of abuse dating back to 2007 from two priests, said that Prevost failed to open an investigation in 2022.[24]

"

If a politician had any inkling of something like this he would not have a chance at being elected unless he was running for mayor in DC. They seem to go for anything there /s.

Or if he were the MAGA candidate for President.

Touché

Halifax2TheMax · May 8

Anyone here think the pope can be bought? Elongitaint bought COOTWH for around $300M. How much does a pope cost? Anyone?

Vitalogensia · May 8

Benedict IX supposedly sold the papacy to his grandfather in the early 11th century. Couldn’t find a figure. But part of the Medici family were popes too, doubt they did it for free. Cost of children has gone up a lot too.

Berlin2000 · May 8

Here’s to hoping that the first American pope will show the world that it’s possible for an American to get elected for high office and actually try to make the world better instead of worse! 🤞

DE4173 · May 8

Found out he served two years on the board of directors between 1999-2001 at a prep school here in Tulsa. People seem pretty excited about it. 🤷‍♂️

josevolution · May 8

Maybe the 🤡 can have a private meeting dressed for the occasion
https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/news/2025/05/08/melania-trump-pope-photo-catholics-leo-joke-conclave/83517510007/

mickeyrat · May 9

it will be several generations before the priesthood as a whole is clean of that egregious scandel.

mickeyrat · May 9

https://apnews.com/article/pope-leo-twitter-x-trump-vance-criticism-9c311123985ebce282877071f75b6d80

brianlux · May 9

If I didn't know better and were only reading what is in this thread so far, I would have thought you all were talking about t as Pope. It's like reading a MAGA take on the new Pope. Read Heather's letter of 5/8/25, then maybe slow down a bit here.

Man, I'm not saying y'all are totally wrong, but this all sounds like knee jerk to me. Anybody really research this stuff? Is the guy really pure evil? Are you itching for a good old fashioned lynching? Or did he change some of his view in the last 12 years? I don't know, but it happens.

People, I hate to say it, but AMT is getting to be awfully goddamn thick with all the negativity, darkness, and hate. "A Morose Train". Maybe let's not fight darkness with darkness. Maybe let's fight darkness with light. Strong light, not wimpy-ass light.

It's spring. Get out and smell some wildflowers (or leaves turning if you're in the southern hemisphere. They're both great this year.

mickeyrat · May 9

May 8, 2025 (Thursday)

Today, on the second day of the papal conclave, the cardinal electors—133 members of the College of Cardinals who were under the age of 80 when Pope Francis died on April 21—elected a new pope. They chose 69-year-old Cardinal Robert Prevost, who was born in Chicago, thus making him the first pope chosen from the United States. But he spent much of his ministry in Peru and became a citizen of Peru in 2015, making him the first pope from Peru, as well.

New popes choose a papal name to signify the direction of their papacy, and Prevost has chosen to be known as Pope Leo XIV. This is an important nod to Pope Leo XIII, who led the church from 1878 to 1903 and was the father of modern Catholic social teaching. He called for the church to address social and economic issues, and emphasized the dignity of individuals, the common good, community, and taking care of marginalized individuals.

In the midst of the Gilded Age, Leo XIII defended the rights of workers and said that the church had not just the duty to speak about justice and fairness, but also the responsibility to make sure that such equities were accomplished. In his famous 1891 encyclical Rerum Novarum, translated as “Of New Things,” Leo XIII rejected both socialism and unregulated capitalism, and called for the state to protect the rights of individuals.

Prevost’s choice of the name Leo invokes the principles of both Leo XIII and his own predecessor, Pope Francis. In his lifetime he has aligned himself with many of Francis’s social reforms, and his election appears to be a rejection of hard-line right-wing Catholics in the U.S. and elsewhere who have used their religion to support far-right politics.

In the U.S., Vice-President J.D. Vance is one of those hard-line right-wing Catholics. Shortly after taking office in January, Vance began to talk of the concept of ordo amoris, or “order of love,” articulated by Catholic St. Augustine, claiming it justified the MAGA emphasis on family and tribalism and suggesting it justified the mass expulsion of migrants.

Vance told Sean Hannity of the Fox News Channel, “[Y]ou love your family, and then you love your neighbor, and then you love your community, and then you love your fellow citizens in your own country, and then, after that, you can focus and prioritize the rest of the world. A lot of the far left has completely inverted that.” When right-wing influencer Jack Posobiec, who is Catholic, posted Vance’s interview approvingly, Vance added: “Just google ‘ordo amoris.’ Aside from that, the idea that there isn’t a hierarchy of obligations violates basic common sense.”

On February 10, Pope Francis responded in a letter to American bishops. He corrected Vance’s assertion as a false interpretation of Catholic theology. “Christians know very well that it is only by affirming the infinite dignity of all that our own identity as persons and as communities reaches its maturity,” he wrote. “Christian love is not a concentric expansion of interests that little by little extend to other persons and groups…. The true ordo amoris that must be promoted is that which we discover by…meditating on the love that builds a fraternity open to all, without exception.”

“[W]orrying about personal, community or national identity, apart from these considerations, easily introduces an ideological criterion that distorts social life and imposes the will of the strongest as the criterion of truth,” Pope Francis wrote. He acknowledged “the right of a nation to defend itself and keep communities safe from those who have committed violent or serious crimes while in the country or prior to arrival,” but defended the fundamental dignity of every human being and the fundamental rights of migrants, noting that the “rightly formed conscience” would disagree with any program that “identifies the illegal status of some migrants with criminality.” He continued: “I exhort all the faithful of the Catholic Church, and all men and women of good will, not to give in to narratives that discriminate against and cause unnecessary suffering to our migrant and refugee brothers and sisters.”

The next day, Trump’s border czar, Tom Homan, who said he was “a lifelong Catholic,” told reporters at the White House, “I’ve got harsh words for the Pope…. He ought to fix the Catholic Church and concentrate on his work and leave border enforcement to us.”

Cardinal Prevost was close to Pope Francis, and during this controversy he posted on X after Vance’s assertion but before Pope Francis’s answer: “JD Vance is wrong: Jesus doesn’t ask us to rank our love for others.” After the pope published his letter, Prevost reposted it with the comment: “Pope Francis’ letter, JD Vance’s ‘ordo amoris’ and what the Gospel asks of all of us on immigration.”

On April 14, Prevost reposted: “As Trump & [Salvadoran president Nayib] Bukele use Oval to [laugh at] Feds’ illicit deportation of a US resident [Kilmar Abrego Garcia], once an undoc[ument]ed Salvadorean himself, [Bishop Evelio Menjivar] asks, ‘Do you not see the suffering? Is your conscience not disturbed? How can you stay quiet?’”

The new Pope Leo XIV greeted the world today in Italian and Spanish as he thanked Pope Francis and the other cardinals, and called for the church to “be a missionary Church, building bridges, dialogue, always open to receiving with open arms for everyone…, open to all, to all who need our charity, our presence, dialogue, love…, especially to those who are suffering.”

As an American-born pope in the model of Pope Francis, Pope Leo XIV might be able to appeal to American far-right Catholics and bring them back into the fold. But today, MAGAs responded to the new pope with fury. Right-wing influencer Laura Loomer, who is close to Trump, called Pope Leo “another Marxist puppet in the Vatican.” Influencer Charlie Kirk suggested he was an “[o]pen borders globalist installed to counter Trump.”

In the U.S., President Donald Trump, who said he would like to be pope and then posted a picture of himself dressed as a pope on May 2, prompting an angry backlash by those who thought it was disrespectful, posted on social media that the election of the first pope from the United States was “a Great Honor for our Country” and that he looks forward to meeting him. ‘It will be a very meaningful moment!” he added.

Vitalogensia · May 9

Most of my Catholic family and friends are maga. We’ll see if new pope is able to sway them, as that article references. He’s also a Villanova grad, which I found interesting.

tempo_n_groove · May 9

brianlux said:

If I didn't know better and were only reading what is in this thread so far, I would have thought you all were talking about t as Pope. It's like reading a MAGA take on the new Pope. Read Heather's letter of 5/8/25, then maybe slow down a bit here.
Man, I'm not saying y'all are totally wrong, but this all sounds like knee jerk to me. Anybody really research this stuff? Is the guy really pure evil? Are you itching for a good old fashioned lynching? Or did he change some of his view in the last 12 years? I don't know, but it happens.
People, I hate to say it, but AMT is getting to be awfully goddamn thick with all the negativity, darkness, and hate. "A Morose Train". Maybe let's not fight darkness with darkness. Maybe let's fight darkness with light. Strong light, not wimpy-ass light.
It's spring. Get out and smell some wildflowers (or leaves turning if you're in the southern hemisphere. They're both great this year.

Brian I expected this. I couldn't find much on him but I do know he adopted the last Popes views on inclusion but this is the AMT and they love to knock someone down.

Tim Simmons · May 9

As a recovering Catholic, I'm bullish on the guy. Hopefully he's evolved in the past decade. We'll see.

I do think he's gonna bother MAGA types though.

DE4173 · May 9

brianlux said:

If I didn't know better and were only reading what is in this thread so far, I would have thought you all were talking about t as Pope. It's like reading a MAGA take on the new Pope. Read Heather's letter of 5/8/25, then maybe slow down a bit here.
Man, I'm not saying y'all are totally wrong, but this all sounds like knee jerk to me. Anybody really research this stuff? Is the guy really pure evil? Are you itching for a good old fashioned lynching? Or did he change some of his view in the last 12 years? I don't know, but it happens.
People, I hate to say it, but AMT is getting to be awfully goddamn thick with all the negativity, darkness, and hate. "A Morose Train". Maybe let's not fight darkness with darkness. Maybe let's fight darkness with light. Strong light, not wimpy-ass light.
It's spring. Get out and smell some wildflowers (or leaves turning if you're in the southern hemisphere. They're both great this year.

I think that's where we are now (or have been for awhile). Not AMT specific, but US overall, when some things happen, some people on various sides rush to see what they find on the subject to "own/burn" the other side. So for this "thing", it's a mad Google search to see his past, beliefs etc. to take shots at the other side first and how he benefits their side, second. 🤷‍♂️

Vitalogensia · May 9

If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the new pope, that is fair. If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the Catholic Church, that’s a completely separate and IMO irrational stance.

DE4173 · May 9

Vitalogensia said:

If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the new pope, that is fair. If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the Catholic Church, that’s a completely separate and IMO irrational stance.

Just the new Pope.

Example is people scrambling to see if he aligns with liberals so it's "cry more maga" and if he aligns with conservatives it's "owning the libs."

Then on to the next "thing" and on and on...

tempo_n_groove · May 9

DE4173 said:

Vitalogensia said:

If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the new pope, that is fair. If you’re saying it’s rash and unfair to be critical of the Catholic Church, that’s a completely separate and IMO irrational stance.

Just the new Pope.

Example is people scrambling to see if he aligns with liberals so it's "cry more maga" and if he aligns with conservatives it's "owning the libs."

Then on to the next "thing" and on and on...

And this is where we are... Perfectly said.

brianlux · May 9

Good comments, tempo and DE.

I'm not an anything when it comes to religion. If I had to say which religion most closely described me in spiritual terms, I would say Unitarian Universalist. There is wisdom in all major religions-- as well as atheism, though I do not personally identify as an atheist as I believe in Mystery- the unknown and unknowable.

So let's give this Pope a chance. My sense is that he cares about people. And hopefully the planet as well. Surely more so than MAGA's progenitors and many of it's staunch adherents.

Halifax2TheMax · May 9

Pope Woke the First!

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DJaH9ULyX5e/?igsh=NWhzcnpxOW1hOWkw

tempo_n_groove · May 9

Halifax2TheMax said:

Pope Woke the First!

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DJaH9ULyX5e/?igsh=NWhzcnpxOW1hOWkw

lol so he pisses of the right and now u like him?

Halifax2TheMax · May 9

I’ll be critical of any pope and any organized religion for that matter. Why? Because it’s the hypocrisy, nevermind the crimes committed in “Jesus’” name. All religions are flawed? Why? Because of humans. Spiritual? Maybe. Religious? Hard no.

The Pope and the Vatican

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