---President Elect Musk and Convicted Felon Donald J Trump---

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Comments

  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,393
    edited April 2023
    2023
    mickeyrat said:
    it didnt help she took certain voters and their votes for granted too.


    It didn't help, but... If Comey hadn't fucked up like that, we could have avoided that Trump years. It's one thing when a nominee does it to themselves, but another when someone else's decision does it to them.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,609
    I can't understand any argument that he has subpoena power on Bragg. He couldn't enforce one on a executive member,  so what's the argument that he can on an member of the executive branch at the state level? Makes no sense. 
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,382
    mace1229 said:
    I'm not saying he did the right thing. But, despite what Pelosi says, the burden is on the state to prove his guilt, not on Trump to prove his innocence. 
    Their defense is likely going to be pointing at Edwards. He wasn't convicted in part because he claimed it was to protect his family and not help the campaign, despite the fact he was running for president too. 
    The only counterargument to that I've see was the timing, that it happened just weeks before the election, so clearly it wasn't about the family at all. But that's when Stormy shopped er story around. She offered it to the National Inquirer, who in turn warned Trump what she was doing, and then he offered her hush money
    Trump doesn't have to prove his innocence in that. I don't see how the state can prove it was different that Edwards.We can all believe its different, and I do too. It probably was politically motived with Edwards too. But believe and having the burden of proof are different.
    I don't know if the state has a case or not. But based on the information I have right now, I don't see how they would get a guilty verdict.
    Who knows what we don't know though. 

    If the defense brings up edwards, the DA will bring up the serious illness his wife had, and to me at least, that will score with the jury, as trump does not have a comparable 

    the angle in your comment is that Stormy is looking to sell. If I’m the DA I show the jury Team Trump email and phone records the days before access Hollywood and days after. That should tell us that trump was looking to buy. If there is a sizable increase in phone activity after the AH tape became public (as Cohen has stated) and nothing beforehand I’ll bet anyone some money trump is cooked with an impartial jury. Plenty  of men are sitting in jail now with less substantial evidence.

    And regarding your comments about 2011, it could be damning in the eyes of the jury that he wasn’t willing to pay her a cent in 2011 but did fork over six figures two weeks before the election. And paid a second mistress as well. Also, both could be true, trump was concerned with his image AND he wanted to win the election by keeping his affairs private.
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,490
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  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,449
    2023
    of all the things in human history that did not happen, this never happened the most.


    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,153
    2024
    BWAHAHAHA What a fucking liar 
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    “Crying.” Quick, send money so POOTWH can send Kleenex and handkerchiefs to all the employees of the courthouse. And if you act now and make a minimum $100 donation, POOTWH will include a POOTWH Comfort Doll. Quick, donate now! Operators are standing by!
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,924
    2025
    of all the things in human history that did not happen, this never happened the most.


    Kim Jong Trump? 🤣🤣🤣 was three name Marge crying 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,490
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

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    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,490
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697

    If the defense brings up edwards, the DA will bring up the serious illness his wife had, and to me at least, that will score with the jury, as trump does not have a comparable 

    the angle in your comment is that Stormy is looking to sell. If I’m the DA I show the jury Team Trump email and phone records the days before access Hollywood and days after. That should tell us that trump was looking to buy. If there is a sizable increase in phone activity after the AH tape became public (as Cohen has stated) and nothing beforehand I’ll bet anyone some money trump is cooked with an impartial jury. Plenty  of men are sitting in jail now with less substantial evidence.

    And regarding your comments about 2011, it could be damning in the eyes of the jury that he wasn’t willing to pay her a cent in 2011 but did fork over six figures two weeks before the election. And paid a second mistress as well. Also, both could be true, trump was concerned with his image AND he wanted to win the election by keeping his affairs private.
    The versions I've read say that Stormy saw the Access Hollywood tape and thought she could now sell her story. She contacted her publisher/manager/whatever who contacted the National Enquirer in hopes to sell the story now that it is a hot topic with Trump. It wasn't worth much a year earlier, but now maybe she can get some bank with it. 

    The editor of the NE contacted Trump to let him know Stormy was offering her story to sell. That's when Trump bought her silence. 
    So yes, obviously there would be more phone calls and contact after the Access Hollywood video, because that is what prompted Stormy to push it around. Trump didn't offer to buy her out before because she wasn't trying to sell her story.
    I keep hearing Trump waiting until weeks before the election to buy her out because the election was coming or the HA video. But the reality is that is when Stormy was trying to sell it.

    Edwards cheating on his dying wife will score points for who? The prosecution or Trump?
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,490
    mace1229 said:
    The versions I've read say that Stormy saw the Access Hollywood tape and thought she could now sell her story. She contacted her publisher/manager/whatever who contacted the National Enquirer in hopes to sell the story now that it is a hot topic with Trump. It wasn't worth much a year earlier, but now maybe she can get some bank with it. 

    The editor of the NE contacted Trump to let him know Stormy was offering her story to sell. That's when Trump bought her silence. 
    So yes, obviously there would be more phone calls and contact after the Access Hollywood video, because that is what prompted Stormy to push it around. Trump didn't offer to buy her out before because she wasn't trying to sell her story.
    I keep hearing Trump waiting until weeks before the election to buy her out because the election was coming or the HA video. But the reality is that is when Stormy was trying to sell it.

    Edwards cheating on his dying wife will score points for who? The prosecution or Trump?

    SO FUCKING WHAT!!!! HE PAID. THEN COVERED UP THE PAYMENTS. WHILE SITTING IN THE OVAL CUTTING CHECKS.
    AGAINST NY LAW.
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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    mickeyrat said:

    SO FUCKING WHAT!!!! HE PAID. THEN COVERED UP THE PAYMENTS. WHILE SITTING IN THE OVAL CUTTING CHECKS.
    AGAINST NY LAW.
    It actually matters because I keep hearing it was only illegal because it was for political gain. And proof it was for political gain was because Trump waiting until a couple weeks before the election to buy her out.

    Its just funny because there are some holes in this case. I've seen dozens of posts of people pointing to the timing or other issues and every time I point one out the response is so what?

    The fact if it was illegal or not should matter. The whole argument that this is different that Edwards was the timing made it more political. So it does matter.
  • Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 12,377
    mace1229 said:
    The versions I've read say that Stormy saw the Access Hollywood tape and thought she could now sell her story. She contacted her publisher/manager/whatever who contacted the National Enquirer in hopes to sell the story now that it is a hot topic with Trump. It wasn't worth much a year earlier, but now maybe she can get some bank with it. 

    The editor of the NE contacted Trump to let him know Stormy was offering her story to sell. That's when Trump bought her silence. 
    So yes, obviously there would be more phone calls and contact after the Access Hollywood video, because that is what prompted Stormy to push it around. Trump didn't offer to buy her out before because she wasn't trying to sell her story.
    I keep hearing Trump waiting until weeks before the election to buy her out because the election was coming or the HA video. But the reality is that is when Stormy was trying to sell it.

    Edwards cheating on his dying wife will score points for who? The prosecution or Trump?
    lol
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,577
    2023
    Common sense, here folks. 

    And, quite honestly, I think this case will be on the back burner of most people's minds after the other indictments drop. 
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    edited April 2023
    And that may be true.
    I'm just bringing up the potential issues I see with the current indictments and people don't seem to care, as long as Trump was arrested, that's all that matters.
    You know what the defense is going to be. Its going to be Trump paid for the hush money, therefore its not a donation and no campaign laws were broken.
    Then they're going to point to the Edwards case, and explain personal hush money has been okay. The prosecution will claim it was different because its political. The defense is going to point to the fact they silenced her in 2011, years before he even ran. And they only paid out money when she was shopping her story around.
    Understanding the prosecution has the burden of proof, not Trump, I don't know how to disprove that.
    Tehy will admit to mislabeling funds. When Hilary mislabeled campaign funds as attorney fees that paid for the dossier, she was fined $8,000. So that's what they will compare this to.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    The versions I've read say that Stormy saw the Access Hollywood tape and thought she could now sell her story. She contacted her publisher/manager/whatever who contacted the National Enquirer in hopes to sell the story now that it is a hot topic with Trump. It wasn't worth much a year earlier, but now maybe she can get some bank with it. 

    The editor of the NE contacted Trump to let him know Stormy was offering her story to sell. That's when Trump bought her silence. 
    So yes, obviously there would be more phone calls and contact after the Access Hollywood video, because that is what prompted Stormy to push it around. Trump didn't offer to buy her out before because she wasn't trying to sell her story.
    I keep hearing Trump waiting until weeks before the election to buy her out because the election was coming or the HA video. But the reality is that is when Stormy was trying to sell it.

    Edwards cheating on his dying wife will score points for who? The prosecution or Trump?
    Link, please?
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    It actually matters because I keep hearing it was only illegal because it was for political gain. And proof it was for political gain was because Trump waiting until a couple weeks before the election to buy her out.

    Its just funny because there are some holes in this case. I've seen dozens of posts of people pointing to the timing or other issues and every time I point one out the response is so what?

    The fact if it was illegal or not should matter. The whole argument that this is different that Edwards was the timing made it more political. So it does matter.
    From who? Link, please?
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    It actually matters because I keep hearing it was only illegal because it was for political gain. And proof it was for political gain was because Trump waiting until a couple weeks before the election to buy her out.

    Its just funny because there are some holes in this case. I've seen dozens of posts of people pointing to the timing or other issues and every time I point one out the response is so what?

    The fact if it was illegal or not should matter. The whole argument that this is different that Edwards was the timing made it more political. So it does matter.
    You still don’t get it.
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,577
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    And that may be true.
    I'm just bringing up the potential issues I see with the current indictments and people don't seem to care, as long as Trump was arrested, that's all that matters.
    You know what the defense is going to be. Its going to be Trump paid for the hush money, therefore its not a donation and no campaign laws were broken.
    Then they're going to point to the Edwards case, and explain personal hush money has been okay. The prosecution will claim it was different because its political. The defense is going to point to the fact they silenced her in 2011, years before he even ran. And they only paid out money when she was shopping her story around.
    Understanding the prosecution has the burden of proof, not Trump, I don't know how to disprove that.
    It's not that people don't care, mace. People just disagree with your assessment. 
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    Link, please?
    I think I posted a different link yesterday, but this was the first one.
    I didn't think Stormy trying to sell her story was in debate? I thought it was common knowledge she took it to the National Enquirer, who then warned trump. 
    https://www.axios.com/2023/03/18/trump-stormy-daniels-payment-probe
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,490
    edited April 2023
    mace1229 said:
    It actually matters because I keep hearing it was only illegal because it was for political gain. And proof it was for political gain was because Trump waiting until a couple weeks before the election to buy her out.

    Its just funny because there are some holes in this case. I've seen dozens of posts of people pointing to the timing or other issues and every time I point one out the response is so what?

    The fact if it was illegal or not should matter. The whole argument that this is different that Edwards was the timing made it more political. So it does matter.

    illegal or not shouldnt matter? wtf are you talking about. he broke the law surrounding an otherwise legal payment BUT FOR he paid to keep it quiet a few weeks before the election. FALSIFIED RECORDS TO COVER UP THOSE THE REPAYMENT.

    He isnt charged for the payment. as always with shit like this , its the cover up. what is so hard to understand about that? and its not just her, it is mcdougal and a payment to a doorman that was hidden the same way.

    His agent in the matter went to prison for his part in this as well. 
    sso is your contention cohen is solely culpable in this? and further that Bragg is incompetent? being so expert on ny business law.....
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    edited April 2023
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    I think I posted a different link yesterday, but this was the first one.
    I didn't think Stormy trying to sell her story was in debate? I thought it was common knowledge she took it to the National Enquirer, who then warned trump. 
    https://www.axios.com/2023/03/18/trump-stormy-daniels-payment-probe
    You claimed “versions,” like there’s multiple sources of information all saying the same thing. You’ve linked to one article or source. Why don’t you cut and paste the direct source of your information that backs your claim? You didn’t post a link yesterday, unless I missed it, and your link here is just a timeline of events. It doesn’t help your speculation.

    Regardless, it’s the manner by which POOTWH knew and kept his business records in NYS. Not that he paid “hush money.” The absence of a retainer makes the claim of “legal fees” as a “business expense”, even “hush money” problematic. You want to bet POOTWH also claimed those “business expenses” as tax deductions? Of which he’s not currently being charged?
    Post edited by Halifax2TheMax on
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  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,153
    2024
    mickeyrat said:

    illegal or not shouldnt matter? wtf are you talking about. he broke the law surrounding an otherwise legal payment BUT FOR he paid to keep it quiet a few weeks before the election. FALSIFIED RECORDS TO COVER UP THOSE THE REPAYMENT.

    He isnt charged for the payment. as always with shit like this , its the cover up. what is so hard to understand about that? and its not just her, it is mcdougal and a payment to a doorman that was hidden the same way.

    His agent in the matter went to prison for his part in this as well. 
    sso is your contention cohen is solely culpable in this? and further that Bragg is incompetent? being so expert on ny business law.....
    read it again, mick. 
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    edited April 2023
    mickeyrat said:

    illegal or not shouldnt matter? wtf are you talking about. he broke the law surrounding an otherwise legal payment BUT FOR he paid to keep it quiet a few weeks before the election. FALSIFIED RECORDS TO COVER UP THOSE THE REPAYMENT.

    He isnt charged for the payment. as always with shit like this , its the cover up. what is so hard to understand about that? and its not just her, it is mcdougal and a payment to a doorman that was hidden the same way.

    His agent in the matter went to prison for his part in this as well. 
    sso is your contention cohen is solely culpable in this? and further that Bragg is incompetent? being so expert on ny business law.....
    This is another example of what H2H asked for, the timing is what keeps getting brought up. He had been threatening her for 5 years to keep quiet, so this just didn't come out of thin air 2 weeks before the election. But that is when the National Enquirer got a hold of it. it was going on for 5 years before the election, not 2 weeks that a lot of people keep repeating. 
    And, again, it is important because how do you prove it was for political gain when he's been threatening her for 5 years before the election?

    He falsified records, no doubt about that. The back story behind it is the difference between an $8,000 fine or 34 felonies though. 

    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    mace1229 said:
    This is another example of what H2H asked for, the timing is what keeps getting brought up. He had been threatening her for 5 years to keep quiet, so this just didn't come out of thin air 2 weeks before the election. But that is when the National Enquirer got a hold of it. it was going on for 5 years before the election, not 2 weeks that a lot of people keep repeating. 
    And, again, it is important because how do you prove it was for political gain when he's been threatening her for 5 years before the election?

    He falsified records, no doubt about that. The back story behind it is the difference between an $8,000 fine or 34 felonies though. 

    Was Hillary charged in NYS court with violations of NYS law?

    Was John Edwards charged in NYS court with violations of NYS law?

    Those, I believe, were FEC violations and charged in federal courts. No bearing other than being similar. And to Micky’s point, was Cohen falsely accused and convicted for an illegal campaign contribution, then? To which he was “directed” to do so knowingly by “subject 1?” Directed by his client in the absence of a retainer?

    I look forward to reading the court transcripts and hearing the jury’s verdict. Think copping a plea is in the future?
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,995
    2023
    mickeyrat said:
    And yup, very stable genius ready for the oval. 
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    edited April 2023
    Was Hillary charged in NYS court with violations of NYS law?

    Was John Edwards charged in NYS court with violations of NYS law?

    Those, I believe, were FEC violations and charged in federal courts. No bearing other than being similar. And to Micky’s point, was Cohen falsely accused and convicted for an illegal campaign contribution, then? To which he was “directed” to do so knowingly by “subject 1?” Directed by his client in the absence of a retainer?

    I look forward to reading the court transcripts and hearing the jury’s verdict. Think copping a plea is in the future?
    For Trump to be facing felony charges the prosecution has to prove 2 things. This was for political gain and was a political contribution. The mislabeling of funds is minor in comparison, usually just a fine. What he is being charged with is falsifying those records with intent to cover up another crime.
    I haven't seen a real response why I am wrong. Which is why it is difficult to think many here are taking it seriously, they just want to see him locked up. If I am incorrect, then please explain.
    It matters where the money came from because if it came from trump, then there is no campaign donation violation, and therefore no coverup of an illegal donation. 
    If it was to protect him and his family, then it isn't a campaign matter either, just like In the case with Edwards.
    So how does the state prove this was a donation when Trump reimbursed Cohen? How do you prove it was for political gain when they had been threatening her to keep silent for 5 years?
    the burden of proof is on the state, not on trump to prove his innocence. 
    Without proving those things, its a record keeping infraction, similar to what Hilary was fined $8000 for when she disguised the dossier financing payments as legal fees. One they are probably all aware of and happy to pay a fine to keep the real spending hidden. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,609
    mace1229 said:
    This is another example of what H2H asked for, the timing is what keeps getting brought up. He had been threatening her for 5 years to keep quiet, so this just didn't come out of thin air 2 weeks before the election. But that is when the National Enquirer got a hold of it. it was going on for 5 years before the election, not 2 weeks that a lot of people keep repeating. 
    And, again, it is important because how do you prove it was for political gain when he's been threatening her for 5 years before the election?

    He falsified records, no doubt about that. The back story behind it is the difference between an $8,000 fine or 34 felonies though. 

    I suggest you read this excellent summary from The Bulwark.  It discusses the conspiracy between Pecker, Cohen and Trump that occurred a month before the election, mostly due to the Access Hollywood tape.  The combination of that tape with the McDougal, door man and Daniels issue is what led to the crimes.  FTR, the Bulwark is a conservative publication, although constructed of true "never Trump" conservatives.  

    https://www.thebulwark.com/sorry-doubters-but-bragg-was-right-to-indict-trump/
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,924
    2025
    I just don’t see why Bragg would of committed himself to bring charges without being sure a trial in the end would bring back a guilty verdict! He’s got too much to lose compared to Trumpolinni even with a guilty verdict won’t result in any jail time! The one putting his career on the line is Bragg not Trumpolinni 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
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