America's Gun Violence #2

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  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,380
    update on uvalde police response.....




     
    Uvalde's new anguish: Video shows police waiting in school
    By ACACIA CORONADO and PAUL J. WEBER
    Yesterday

    UVALDE, Texas (AP) — A new wave of anger swept through Uvalde on Tuesday over surveillance footage of police officers in body armor milling in the hallway of Robb Elementary School while a gunman carried out a massacre inside a fourth-grade classroom where 19 children and two teachers were killed.

    The video published Tuesday by the Austin American-Statesman is a disturbing 80-minute recording of what has been known for weeks now about one of the deadliest school shootings in U.S. history: that heavily armed police officers, some armed with rifles and bulletproof shields, massed in the hallway and waited more than an hour before going inside and stopping the May 24 slayings.

    But the footage, which until now had not surfaced publicly, anguished Uvalde residents anew and redoubled calls in the small South Texas city for accountability and explanations that have been incomplete — and sometimes inaccurate — in the seven weeks since the shooting. Hours after the video was published, some residents at a Uvalde City Council meeting said they had not been able to bring themselves to watch it.

    Jesus Rizo said officers who are paid taxpayer dollars to protect people should not have “sat there” when children were in danger.

    “You could've saved some lives. You could have held somebody's hand as they were dying,” he said. “The parents could have seen them one last time as they were dying.”

    Others demanded consequences for police and more information in an investigation marked by confusing statements that have had to be retracted at times.

    “Give these families some closure," said Daniel Myers, a pastor in Uvalde and family friend to one of the victims.

    An investigative committee led by Texas lawmakers had earlier announced plans to show the video to Uvalde residents for the first time Sunday, in addition to sharing their findings after weeks of closed-door testimony from more than 40 witnesses.

    "This has been the most unprofessional investigation or handling of it that I’ve ever seen in my life," Uvalde Mayor Don McLaughlin said in an interview with The Associated Press. “These families get blindsided constantly."

    Surveillance footage captured the gunman in the Uvalde school shooting enter the building with a AR-15 style rifle and later shows officers in body armor milling in the hallway outside the fourth-grade classrooms where 19 children and two teachers were killed. (July 12)

    The footage from a hallway camera inside the school shows the gunman entering the building with an AR-15 style rifle and includes 911 tape of a teacher screaming, “Get down! Get in your rooms! Get in your rooms!”

    Two officers approach the classrooms minutes after the gunman enters, then run back amid the sounds of gunfire.

    As the gunman first approaches the classrooms a child whose image is blurred can be seen poking their head around a corner down the hallway and then running back while shots ring out. Later, about 20 minutes before police breach the room, the video shows a man wearing a vest that says “sheriff” use a hand sanitizer dispenser mounted on the wall.

    Throughout the video, the screams of children are redacted.

    Officials said the 77 minutes of footage they are preparing to release this weekend does not contain images of children in the classroom. Rep. Dustin Burrows, a Republican who is leading the investigation, said after the video was posted by the Statesman that "watching the entire segment of law enforcement’s response, or lack thereof, is also important.”

    But the video alone does not answer all the questions that remain — nearly two months later — about the law enforcement response. Among them are how schools police Chief Pete Arredondo came to the forefront of the massive law enforcement response involving numerous local, state and federal agencies.

    State authorities have cast Arredondo as the on-scene commander and said his errors delayed police killing the gunman. Arredondo, however, has told the Texas Tribune he didn’t consider himself to be in charge of operations and that he assumed someone else had taken control of the law enforcement response. He did not have a police radio at the time.

    The roles of the ranking on-scene officers from other agencies, including the Texas Department of Public Safety, remain unclear. McLaughlin has accused DPS of minimizing its involvement in the response and releasing inaccurate timelines.

    Last week, a critique of the police response written by tactical experts and requested by DPS alleged that a Uvalde police officer had a chance to open fire on the gunman before he entered the school. McLaughlin has said that account was inaccurate.

    “All they keep doing is piling missed facts on missed facts, and throwing it out there and see what sticks,” McLaughlin said.

    In a statement, DPS Director Steve McCraw said the video provides “horrifying evidence" that the law enforcement response was a failure.

    ___

    Weber reported from Austin, Texas. Associated Press writers Jake Bleiberg in Dallas and Robert Jablon in Los Angeles contributed to this report.




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  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,911
    I couldn't imagine being an adult hearing children getting shot and retreating like cowards.  let alone as a well armed police officer.  utterly disgusting. i  can't imagine the anger i would have if i was a parent of those children
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,380
    pjhawks said:
    I couldn't imagine being an adult hearing children getting shot and retreating like cowards.  let alone as a well armed police officer.  utterly disgusting. i  can't imagine the anger i would have if i was a parent of those children

    "I was afraid for my life....."


    meanwhile unarmed parents are seeking to go in...
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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
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  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,055
    the uvalde police response may very well be the worst thing i have ever seen in my whole life. and that is saying something.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    It really does show us a huge problem with a state of policing in this country right now. They are not really entering the job because they want to protect and serve. They seem to like the power and flexing that power in ways that are not particularly challenging or courageous. I don’t think it is an issue of bad people as much as it is an issue of bad culture. And right now that culture seems to be love of power and no interest in actually helping people. Not even children.
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  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,380
    OnWis97 said:
    It really does show us a huge problem with a state of policing in this country right now. They are not really entering the job because they want to protect and serve. They seem to like the power and flexing that power in ways that are not particularly challenging or courageous. I don’t think it is an issue of bad people as much as it is an issue of bad culture. And right now that culture seems to be love of power and no interest in actually helping people. Not even children.

    bad culture built by bad people.....
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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    mickeyrat said:
    OnWis97 said:
    It really does show us a huge problem with a state of policing in this country right now. They are not really entering the job because they want to protect and serve. They seem to like the power and flexing that power in ways that are not particularly challenging or courageous. I don’t think it is an issue of bad people as much as it is an issue of bad culture. And right now that culture seems to be love of power and no interest in actually helping people. Not even children.

    bad culture built by bad people.....
    There are definitely bad people. But I think it's a bigger/different problem...and removing "bad people" can't solve it.
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  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,074
    the uvalde police response may very well be the worst thing i have ever seen in my whole life. and that is saying something.
    Worse than Minneapolis police responding to an allegedly counterfeit $20?  
    Scio me nihil scire

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  • stuckinline
    stuckinline Posts: 3,406
    OnWis97 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    OnWis97 said:
    It really does show us a huge problem with a state of policing in this country right now. They are not really entering the job because they want to protect and serve. They seem to like the power and flexing that power in ways that are not particularly challenging or courageous. I don’t think it is an issue of bad people as much as it is an issue of bad culture. And right now that culture seems to be love of power and no interest in actually helping people. Not even children.

    bad culture built by bad people.....
    There are definitely bad people. But I think it's a bigger/different problem...and removing "bad people" can't solve it.
    What's the solution? 

  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,074
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
    They don't have to do anything...."WASHINGTON, June 27 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation." from 2006 https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect.html
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • Gern Blansten
    Gern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,177
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
    It isn't a good look at all. Just a horrible situation all together. Too bad the car wreck didn't incapacitate the fucker.
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  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    static111 said:
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
    They don't have to do anything...."WASHINGTON, June 27 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation." from 2006 https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect.html
    Not sworn to protect and to serve?  That is the main reason, I thought, was their job. Protect...
  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,074
    static111 said:
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
    They don't have to do anything...."WASHINGTON, June 27 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation." from 2006 https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect.html
    Not sworn to protect and to serve?  That is the main reason, I thought, was their job. Protect...
    They have to protect society not individuals I believe is the gist of their oath.  SC ruling basically states that they have discretion when it comes to individuals.  So even though this was a school, i guess it could be argued that they protected "society" by isolating the shooter and keeping him from wreaking grater havoc on society as a whole.  LE is a joke these days. So is the "justice" system
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    static111 said:
    static111 said:
    Just watched the video.  

    I'm not sure what the protocol is for going after a person in a room w a semiautomatic rifle but with hostages present kids at that, I'd think you'd do more than hang back and wait for reinforcements?

    This is all hindsight now but man, It just doesn't look good. 
    They don't have to do anything...."WASHINGTON, June 27 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation." from 2006 https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/justices-rule-police-do-not-have-a-constitutional-duty-to-protect.html
    Not sworn to protect and to serve?  That is the main reason, I thought, was their job. Protect...
    They have to protect society not individuals I believe is the gist of their oath.  SC ruling basically states that they have discretion when it comes to individuals.  So even though this was a school, i guess it could be argued that they protected "society" by isolating the shooter and keeping him from wreaking grater havoc on society as a whole.  LE is a joke these days. So is the "justice" system
    When I worked in Alaska in the Bering, Gulf, Straits, if anyone radioed for help you hightailed it over there and helped.  We trained for that.

    In the construction world it's the same thing, you help anyone in a situation.

    I understand that someone isn't shooting at us but man...
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    edited July 2022
    OnWis97 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    OnWis97 said:
    It really does show us a huge problem with a state of policing in this country right now. They are not really entering the job because they want to protect and serve. They seem to like the power and flexing that power in ways that are not particularly challenging or courageous. I don’t think it is an issue of bad people as much as it is an issue of bad culture. And right now that culture seems to be love of power and no interest in actually helping people. Not even children.

    bad culture built by bad people.....
    There are definitely bad people. But I think it's a bigger/different problem...and removing "bad people" can't solve it.
    What's the solution? 

    I have no idea. I wish I did.
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,135
    Another “responsible” gun owner. Sheriff misspoke though. I think what he should have said was, “that those gun owners who don’t secure their firearms are one stupid incident away from spending ten years in prison.”

    Or, “too bad there were so many doors and if only the 8 year old could have defended themselves with a gun.”

    https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/14/us/arkansas-boy-accidentally-fatally-shoots-brother/index.html
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,135
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  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,587
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
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