POLL - The WEAKEST LINK of Opening Track/Debut Album - Round 4

2

Comments

  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    dankind said:
    “Hoes gotta eat, too.”
    I thought you would have more to say about the subject than that.
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    dankind said:
    “Hoes gotta eat, too.”
    I thought you would have more to say about the subject than that.
    "I'm a brotha who'll smother ya mutha, and make your sister think I love her"

    Brutalizing, yes.  The streets were rough and it was meant to show that.  Easy-E wasn't going around asphyxiating people's mommas but wanted to show he can be ruthless.  That was how you portrayed yourself. 
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    tempo_n_groove said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    dankind said:
    “Hoes gotta eat, too.”
    I thought you would have more to say about the subject than that.
    "I'm a brotha who'll smother ya mutha, and make your sister think I love her"

    Brutalizing, yes.  The streets were rough and it was meant to show that.  Easy-E wasn't going around asphyxiating people's mommas but wanted to show he can be ruthless.  That was how you portrayed yourself. 
    That isn't making me want to listen to it nor endorse it. 
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    Why is that a good example of manhood?
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    Manhood anywhere.
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    Manhood anywhere.
    It uncovered a world that many people didn't know existed.  If all you see are lyrics and aren't interested in the rest of the story behind them then there isn't anything I can say that will sway you differently unfortunately...

    No one said it was a good example of manhood either...

    I'm going to drop it after this because it's not going anywhere.
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    tempo_n_groove said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    Manhood anywhere.
    It uncovered a world that many people didn't know existed.  If all you see are lyrics and aren't interested in the rest of the story behind them then there isn't anything I can say that will sway you differently unfortunately...

    No one said it was a good example of manhood either...

    I'm going to drop it after this because it's not going anywhere.
    Has that attitude towards women changed over time in rap music?
  • dankind
    dankind Posts: 20,841
    edited January 2022
    Violent Femmes: "Blister in the Sun"
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    tempo_n_groove said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    Manhood anywhere.
    It uncovered a world that many people didn't know existed.  If all you see are lyrics and aren't interested in the rest of the story behind them then there isn't anything I can say that will sway you differently unfortunately...

    No one said it was a good example of manhood either...

    I'm going to drop it after this because it's not going anywhere.
    Has that attitude towards women changed over time in rap music?
    Not all rap music incorporates misogyny into the lyrics -- just the subgenres in which the misogyny rings true to the culture it's representing.

    And there's an argument to be made that the misogyny in gangsta rap lyrics (and gangsta films for that matter) was beneficial in shining a light on what young black women from that culture were up against. 

    Jesus Christ! A lot of the precious classic rock acts drooled over on these pages (Led Zeppelin, Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, Eagles, RHCP, KISS, Bowie, Iggy Pop) are statutory rapists. They weren't merely representing a culture; they were actively raping teens.
    I SAW PEARL JAM
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    dankind said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    tempo_n_groove said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    Manhood anywhere.
    It uncovered a world that many people didn't know existed.  If all you see are lyrics and aren't interested in the rest of the story behind them then there isn't anything I can say that will sway you differently unfortunately...

    No one said it was a good example of manhood either...

    I'm going to drop it after this because it's not going anywhere.
    Has that attitude towards women changed over time in rap music?
    Not all rap music incorporates misogyny into the lyrics -- just the subgenres in which the misogyny rings true to the culture it's representing.

    And there's an argument to be made that the misogyny in gangsta rap lyrics (and gangsta films for that matter) was beneficial in shining a light on what young black women from that culture were up against. 

    Jesus Christ! A lot of the precious classic rock acts drooled over on these pages (Led Zeppelin, Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, Eagles, RHCP, KISS, Bowie, Iggy Pop) are statutory rapists. They weren't merely representing a culture; they were actively raping teens.
    I was going to go there too.  I was going to list all the songs that say "little girl" in the lyrics from bands that everyone seems to love.
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    I understand some of the points made by both of you, so I don't feel as if this discussion isn't going anywhere. I understand that that segment of society was previously ignored and didn't have a platform. I understand that art is sometimes meant to be uncomfortable. I understand that you believe that I am missing out on something of more consequence somewhere in the totality of the work. Do you understand that I'm wondering if it is merely storytelling or if it is meant to perpetuate this way of thinking 
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    I understand some of the points made by both of you, so I don't feel as if this discussion isn't going anywhere. I understand that that segment of society was previously ignored and didn't have a platform. I understand that art is sometimes meant to be uncomfortable. I understand that you believe that I am missing out on something of more consequence somewhere in the totality of the work. Do you understand that I'm wondering if it is merely storytelling or if it is meant to perpetuate this way of thinking 
    I'm wondering if it is merely storytelling or if it is meant to perpetuate this way of thinking

    Both for sure.  You'll have some rappers act over the top to get a rise and others that really lived that way because they didn't know any better.

    You have older rappers now that changed their ways and dropped the misogyny after being married or having a child.
  • 1ThoughtKnown
    1ThoughtKnown Posts: 6,155
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    I can understand being anti-mysogynistic. 

    I also find the hypocrisy in it, and in this case I cannot eliminate the fact that somehow race plays a part. Apparently it is ok to be an Aerosmith fan (lead singer becomes legal guardian of a 16 year old girl then starts dating her) or a myriad of other artists in rock history who have undeniable creep factors (Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, etc.)  Somehow they get a pass, with the one common denominator being they are all white.  “That’s the way it was back then”.

    However, these rap stars, all black, are seemingly being held to another level of scrutiny in lyrics. Not that they actually DID any of the things they sang about, just the fact they SANG about it. 

    I think people should check themselves prior to vilifying an artist about providing the public a window into a world they know nothing about. That is one of the most important roles of the artist.  I’ve said before, I am not a rap aficionado, but NWAs debut simply rocked. It also gave me pause to peer into a world I didn’t know existed…. It fascinated me. 

    This won’t be a popular post, and it is not pointed at anyone in particular, but it may be a good idea to analyze how you look at things. Cancel culture may seem very arbitrary, but the fact is everyone has internal biases. People generally don’t recognize their own internal biases.
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    tempo_n_groove said:
    OffSheGoes35 said:
    I understand some of the points made by both of you, so I don't feel as if this discussion isn't going anywhere. I understand that that segment of society was previously ignored and didn't have a platform. I understand that art is sometimes meant to be uncomfortable. I understand that you believe that I am missing out on something of more consequence somewhere in the totality of the work. Do you understand that I'm wondering if it is merely storytelling or if it is meant to perpetuate this way of thinking 
    I'm wondering if it is merely storytelling or if it is meant to perpetuate this way of thinking

    Both for sure.  You'll have some rappers act over the top to get a rise and others that really lived that way because they didn't know any better.

    You have older rappers now that changed their ways and dropped the misogyny after being married or having a child.
    Thank you for answering my question. I feel as if I was heard and I hope you feel that way too. Maybe I will see things differently in the future.
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    Very good discussions here.
  • HesCalledDyer
    HesCalledDyer Maryland Posts: 16,491
    Violent Femmes: "Blister in the Sun"
    There aren't words in the history any language to express how much I loathe this fucking song.
    Star Lake 00 / Pittsburgh 03 / State College 03 / Bristow 03 / Cleveland 06 / Camden II 06 / DC 08 / Pittsburgh 13 / Baltimore 13 / Charlottesville 13 / Cincinnati 14 / St. Paul 14 / Hampton 16 / Wrigley I 16 / Wrigley II 16 / Baltimore 20 / Camden 22 / Baltimore 24 / Raleigh I 25 / Raleigh II 25 / Pittsburgh I 25
  • dankind
    dankind Posts: 20,841
    Violent Femmes: "Blister in the Sun"
    Musical interlude 

    https://youtu.be/IIokD6Ni7-4

    “I met a critic, I made her shit her draws
    She said she thought hip hop was only guns and alcohol
    I said "Oh, hell naw!" But yet it's that, too
    You can't discrima-hate cause you done read a book or two”

    —Andre 3000
    I SAW PEARL JAM
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    dankind said:
    Musical interlude 

    https://youtu.be/IIokD6Ni7-4

    “I met a critic, I made her shit her draws
    She said she thought hip hop was only guns and alcohol
    I said "Oh, hell naw!" But yet it's that, too
    You can't discrima-hate cause you done read a book or two”

    —Andre 3000
    I just read your earlier post. I completely missed it before. I know there's more examples of wrongdoing to women from rock bands than from rappers. I'm finding that out more and more and that's not okay with me either.
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    Not that it really matters.
  • OffSheGoes35
    OffSheGoes35 Posts: 3,517
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    HesCalledDyer said:
    There aren't words in the history any language to express how much I loathe this fucking song.
    :lol:
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    Ramones: “Blitzkrieg Bop”
    Ice-T's definition of a bitch is great.  

    "So ladies
    We ain't just talkin' bout you
    Cause some of you n****s
    Is bitches too!"
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