America's Gun Violence

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Comments

  • Gern Blansten
    Gern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,177
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I remember arguing with idiots about this a few years ago when someone shot up an armed forces recruiting center.  Some fat militia fucks showed up with their AR-15s to guard the center after that.  How easy would it have been for a shooter to walk up to them, pull out a handgun and blow them away.  What good does an AR-15 do in that situation?

    Fucking morons
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
    The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
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    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt2
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I remember arguing with idiots about this a few years ago when someone shot up an armed forces recruiting center.  Some fat militia fucks showed up with their AR-15s to guard the center after that.  How easy would it have been for a shooter to walk up to them, pull out a handgun and blow them away.  What good does an AR-15 do in that situation?

    Fucking morons
    This action just begs for trouble, it does.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,104
    More guns is clearly the solution. Assign them at birth. They're going to need it before they turn two.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,769
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I remember arguing with idiots about this a few years ago when someone shot up an armed forces recruiting center.  Some fat militia fucks showed up with their AR-15s to guard the center after that.  How easy would it have been for a shooter to walk up to them, pull out a handgun and blow them away.  What good does an AR-15 do in that situation?

    Fucking morons
    When someone shows up to start shooting people, the open carry Gravy Seals will be the first ones shot. 
  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I was curious about this and read the article but wanted to see the data but couldn't find the link to it.

    I am curious as to how many shootings were of legal carriers.  If you have random licensed citizens deciding to do an OK coral type shoot out then I have a problem with that.  How are we stopping that?  Better vetting?
  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,769
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I was curious about this and read the article but wanted to see the data but couldn't find the link to it.

    I am curious as to how many shootings were of legal carriers.  If you have random licensed citizens deciding to do an OK coral type shoot out then I have a problem with that.  How are we stopping that?  Better vetting?
    Not being flippant, but if you google "do guns increase safety" there's no shortage of hits for studies on it. 


    The consensus seems to be no. 
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,104
    What other country contemplates a national memorial to gun violence? So much winning. And freedumb.

     Museums
    Perspective

    What should a coronavirus memorial look like? This powerful statement on gun violence offers a model.

    April 9, 2021 at 7:00 a.m. EDT
    Add to list

    The Gun Violence Memorial Project, a collaboration between MASS Design Group and the artist Hank Willis Thomas, is a wrenching experience. First seen at the Chicago Architecture Biennial in September 2019, the memorial consists of four gabled houses, each made of 700 glass bricks, with niches that allow families to display a few treasured items left behind by a loved one lost to this country’s scourge of gun violence. The memorial closed in February 2020, just as the coronavirus pandemic was beginning to ravage the country, but has reopened in Washington at the National Building Museum.

    The houses have the simple geometry of a child’s picture of a house, and the objects displayed in the structures are small but potent: a bow tie that belonged to Jajuan McDowell, who lived from 2002 to 2016; a pair of sunglasses and the driver’s license of a boy who died at 17; a toy car, a wrench and a few inspirational words scrawled on a piece of paper, left by man killed in his mid-30s.

    The objects were collected from people in Chicago, Las Vegas, Miami, Detroit and other cities, and the memorial is an ongoing project. The 700 bricks represent the weekly toll of gun violence in America. But if the memorial were to encompass the full, horrifying emotional toll of this tragedy, it would have to grow from four houses to a necropolis of thousands or more.

    The memorial may become permanent in some form. “The installations in Chicago and Washington, D.C. are the first steps to recognizing the great need for a national, permanent memorial to gun violence victims,” MASS says on a website dedicated to the memorial.

    Since the installation was seen in Chicago, the nation has suffered another epidemic that raises serious questions about this country’s ability to grapple with basic, systemic and existential questions. Covid-19 has claimed more than 500,000 lives in the United States. In 2020, gun deaths reached their highest level in two decades — nearly 20,000 from violent encounters, 24,000 from suicide.

    Both plagues are ongoing, and while covid-19 may eventually be contained by mass vaccination, the virus rampaged largely unchecked for months because of this country’s political dysfunction. A culture of libertarian selfishness, grounded in historical myths of national exceptionalism and exploited by political and religious demagogues, has made it difficult for America to defend itself against self-inflicted tragedy.

    The coronavirus epidemic has made the gun violence memorial even more powerful today than in 2019. It points toward a new generation of memorials that are fundamentally open, memorials not just to past traumas, but to present ones that seem to be expanding, and perhaps permanent. The pandemic has taught us that it is in the nature of America to stagger, not stride; to bleed, not heal. We are self-destructive and unwilling to make the basic changes necessary to get better. And our memorials must reflect that. They must be open-ended, expandable and dynamic, like our propensity to violence and death.

    The dichotomy between open and closed helps make sense of recent history of memorial architecture. Closed memorials commemorate someone or something — usually with a statue or architectural element — that sends a contained, limited and agreed-upon set of messages: This war was good, this man was great. Closed memorials often reflect historical closure — the triumph of one truth over other possibly valid ones — with architectural closure. Friedrich St. Florian’s 2004 World War II memorial in Washington, with its ferocious symmetry of ovals and rectangles, and inward facing pylons and towers, is a classic example of a closed memorial.

    Open memorials respond to the unfinished work of grief and the lack of historic closure. And now, a new generation of them responds also to the unfinished work of mass death. Where there’s no agreement on basic facts — whether the war in Vietnam was just or whether wearing a face mask is necessary — only an open memorial makes sense.

    Maya Lin’s 1982 memorial to the Vietnam War was an open memorial — to those who died in a war that was still a fundamental fault line in American politics and culture. Lin didn’t invent the open memorial, but her work was so radically open that its critics felt compelled to “close” it, which they attempted by forcing the architect to accept a traditional sculpture — Frederick Hart’s bronze “Three Soldiers” — as a 1984 amendment erected near the open, V-shaped, subterranean wall of names.

    The history of open memorials is perhaps best seen in spontaneous gestures of grief that are immemorial. These include the heaps of flowers left by anonymous mourners at a site associated with the life or death of a famous, beloved public figure. Or the small roadside piles of stuffed animals and religious tokens that commemorate a recent accident victim. Or even the impromptu potluck at the house of someone who has recently died, a gesture of ongoing and open-ended support by neighbors, friends and family.

    It isn’t easy to capture that kind of openness with architecture alone. But as demonstrated by a concurrent National Building Museum exhibition that surveys MASS’s larger portfolio, the firm’s designers have a special intuition about “openness.” The exhibition includes images of their 2018 National Memorial for Peace and Justice in Montgomery, Ala., commonly known as the memorial to the victims of lynching.

    That memorial, the most compelling U.S. memorial in decades, includes hundreds of steel columns, each one dedicated to a U.S. county where a lynching occurred. These are hung in an open-air, pergola-like structure. But the memorial also includes a duplicate steel form for every county, with the intention that individual municipalities or counties will claim the duplicate, bring it home and use it as a local memorial.

    This is a monumentally scaled “open” memorial design, which depends not just on a building or fixed object but also on a process — the reclamation and adoption of local lynching memorials. The thousands of racial lynchings in the United States between Reconstruction and the middle of the last century may be historic events, but the openness of the memorial demands that we think of them not as past traumas but as resonant ones, fundamentally connected to an ongoing crisis of racism and systemic inequality.

    Open and closed exist on a spectrum, and they aren’t synonymous with good or bad memorials. Closed design has a particular beauty, a balance of elements, a sense of protection and often enclosure. The Taj Mahal and the Lincoln Memorial are closed designs, and exceptionally beautiful. “Closing” a chapter in our history may be a way of making peace with the past, or at least moving to a place where past traumas no longer inflame contemporary conflicts.

    And open design has its own set of challenges. Like the AIDS crisis, the covid pandemic is ongoing and may not have a definitive end point. The AIDS quilt, an inspiration for the gun violence memorial, was a classic open design and eventually became so large it could be displayed only in pieces. Today, it weighs about 54 tons. There is a dark, Borgesian danger to open memorial design, the threat that eventually the map of grief will be so large, and so detailed, it can’t be distinguished from the landscape of sadness that it maps.

    Today, all signs point to the same fate for the Gun Violence Memorial Project. It can only grow — more houses, more memories, more grief — until eventually everyone has lost someone, and every one of these glass houses feels like home. Even then it can keep growing, until we are all dead.

    That is the fear that will haunt our memories and our memorials long after the current pandemic ends. It is the fear that not only have we learned nothing, but that we are incapable of learning, and will be no better at warding off death the next time it marches on America.

    Memorial to gun violence points to how we should remember victims of the pandemic - The Washington Post

    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,359
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I was curious about this and read the article but wanted to see the data but couldn't find the link to it.

    I am curious as to how many shootings were of legal carriers.  If you have random licensed citizens deciding to do an OK coral type shoot out then I have a problem with that.  How are we stopping that?  Better vetting?
    Not being flippant, but if you google "do guns increase safety" there's no shortage of hits for studies on it. 


    The consensus seems to be no. 
    I wanted the info from this direct link which it did not supply.  I get curious on how numbers are made and the data used is all.  Some of these things they actually create their own scenarios to show how their data works.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,104
    From the Capitol Riots thread post:

    Police on Jan. 6 charged only a handful of firearms offenses in Capitol-related cases. Because so few arrests were made on the scene that day, however, investigators say the true number of rioters who were carrying firearms will never be known.

    In charging papers, the FBI and Justice Department allege that many defendants discussed bringing firearms to Washington, as well as not carrying them to the Capitol because of the District’s gun laws.

    One of those arrested late Jan. 6 for not leaving Capitol grounds was Maryland tow truck driver Christopher Alberts. Police said they stopped him outside the building carrying a loaded black Taurus G2C 9mm handgun on his hip and a loaded, 12-round spare magazine in separate holsters, along with a gas mask, pocket knife and first-aid kit.

    The oldest detained defendant, Lonnie L. Coffman, 70, of Alabama was arrested after returning to his truck parked near the Capitol, where police allegedly found 11 homemade, molotov cocktail-type incendiary devices, a rifle, shotgun, two 9mm pistols, a .22-caliber pistol — all loaded — as well as a crossbow, several machetes, a stun gun and smoke devices. Prosecutors alleged that the 11 jars were made with gasoline and melted plastic foam to produce a dangerous “napalm-like” explosion of sticky, flammable liquid.

    Other charging and detention documents allege that many defendants discussed leaving weapons in vehicles, parking lots, hotel rooms, bags or with others to ensure quick access.

    New York dating coach Samuel Fisher, also known as Brad Holiday, was arrested after allegedly posting on social media photos of himself at the Capitol and with firearms including a pistol and a rifle.

    “If it kicks off I got a Vest and My Rifle,” he wrote, according to court documents.

    Prosecutors have alleged that Erik Munchel of Nashville stashed weapons in a tactical bag outside the Capitol before bringing a stun gun inside. A search of his home found a legal arsenal of 15 firearms including assault rifles, a sniper rifle and tripod, other types of rifles, shotguns and pistols, a drum-style magazine, and other magazines and ammunition.

    Searching the home of Karl Dresch of Calumet, Mich., investigators say they found a backpack containing a Hagerstown, Md., gas station receipt, a Metro transit card, radar detector, handheld radio and 160 rounds of ammunition. In his home they found a 12-gauge shotgun, a Glock pistol, a Remington rifle and a Russian-made AK-47-style rifle compatible with the ammunition.

    A Dresch attorney said the weapons were “the type of ordinary firearms that are commonplace in rural households throughout America.” Attorneys for the other defendants have emphasized that they are not accused of weapons-related crimes.

    D.C. police Officer Daniel Hodges said in a January interview that one reason he did not draw his weapon during the riot was that police understood the crowd to be armed.

    “I knew they had guns — we had been seizing guns all day,” he said. “And the only reason I could think of that they weren’t shooting us was they were waiting for us to shoot first.”

    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,769
    dignin said:
    I've always believed Americans need to see the actual carnage of these mass shootings before anything meaningful can be done. Make it real. Similar to the images broadcast home from the war in Vietnam.

    Release pictures and videos of the crime scenes. Show the destruction these weapons have on the himan body. 

    In Sandy Hook those little kids had their little bodies literally ripped apart.

    Show the cost of your hobby.
    Agreed.

    My FB feed is full of idiots talking about how the FedEx people should have been armed.  If we all walk around with assault rifles how do we know who the bad guys are?  How do the cops know?  I really can't believe the police aren't more vocal about this.
    Fucking geniuses think they’re safer, but carrying a weapon actually has the opposite effect. 

    https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/

    America really needs to start putting money back into the education system, our country is dumb AF. 
    I was curious about this and read the article but wanted to see the data but couldn't find the link to it.

    I am curious as to how many shootings were of legal carriers.  If you have random licensed citizens deciding to do an OK coral type shoot out then I have a problem with that.  How are we stopping that?  Better vetting?
    Not being flippant, but if you google "do guns increase safety" there's no shortage of hits for studies on it. 


    The consensus seems to be no. 
    I wanted the info from this direct link which it did not supply.  I get curious on how numbers are made and the data used is all.  Some of these things they actually create their own scenarios to show how their data works.
    Here you go - it doesn't mention legal / illegal carriers, but they did exclude anyone under the age of 21 from the study, as they are not eligible to legally carry: 

    https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/full/10.2105/AJPH.2008.143099

    "Participant Identification and Matching

    Gunshot assault cases caused by powder charge firearms were identified as they occurred, from October 15, 2003, to April 16, 2006. The final 6 months of this period were limited to only fatal cases. We excluded self-inflicted, unintentional, and police-related shootings (an officer shooting someone or being shot), and gun injuries of undetermined intent. We excluded individuals younger than 21 years because it was not legal for them to possess a firearm in Philadelphia and, as such, the relationship we sought to investigate was functionally different enough to prompt separate study of this age group. We excluded individuals who were not residents of Philadelphia as they were outside our target population and individuals not described as Black or White as they were involved in a very small percentage of shootings (< 2%). Even after these exclusions, the study only needed a subset of the remaining shootings to test its hypotheses. A random number was thus assigned to these remaining shootings, as they presented, to enroll a representative one third of them."

  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,830
    mrussel1 said:
    So was it Covid that stopped these incidents for a period of time?  Cause it sure seems like that was a lull and now it's back full force.  Or was it just media reporting?  
    It's not media.  Today's was big.  It's so sad.  Christ. 
    No i mean it seems like over the last 12 months it hasn't been as noticeable for me.  Just wondering if it was just me and my focus or if there were fewer or just not as much coverage...or me just paying attention to different things this last year. 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,072
    mrussel1 said:
    So was it Covid that stopped these incidents for a period of time?  Cause it sure seems like that was a lull and now it's back full force.  Or was it just media reporting?  
    It's not media.  Today's was big.  It's so sad.  Christ. 
    No i mean it seems like over the last 12 months it hasn't been as noticeable for me.  Just wondering if it was just me and my focus or if there were fewer or just not as much coverage...or me just paying attention to different things this last year. 
    There were fewer mass shootings but just as much run of the mill non mass shooting gun violence
    Scio me nihil scire

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  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,050
    only in america can you go to bed with news of a mass shooting and wake up to news of another one that happened overnight.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,769

  • cblock4life
    cblock4life Posts: 1,855
    mrussel1 said:
    So was it Covid that stopped these incidents for a period of time?  Cause it sure seems like that was a lull and now it's back full force.  Or was it just media reporting?  
    It's not media.  Today's was big.  It's so sad.  Christ. 
    No i mean it seems like over the last 12 months it hasn't been as noticeable for me.  Just wondering if it was just me and my focus or if there were fewer or just not as much coverage...or me just paying attention to different things this last year. 
    I think it felt like less with all the schools shut down so no school shootings....
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,104
    Single digit victim mass shootings don’t even register with the conscious of ‘Muricans. Less is the new more.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,369

    FBI says it interviewed FedEx mass shooter last year
    By CASEY SMITH and RICK CALLAHAN
    4 mins ago

    INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — FBI agents last year interviewed the gunman who fatally shot eight people at a FedEx facility in Indianapolis, the bureau said Friday, as investigators searched the home of the 19-year-old former FedEx employee.

    Coroners began the slow process of identifying the victims as family members spent hours agonizing over word of their loved ones. The slayings Thursday night marked the latest in a string of recent mass shootings to rock the U.S.

    The shooter was identified as Brandon Scott Hole of Indianapolis, Deputy Police Chief Craig McCartt told a news conference. Investigators searched a home in Indianapolis associated with Hole and seized evidence, including desktop computers and other electronic media, McCartt said.

    Paul Keenan, the special agent in charge of the FBI’s Indianapolis field office, said Friday that agents questioned Hole last year after his mother called police to say that her son might commit “suicide by cop.” He said the FBI was called after items were found in Hole’s bedroom but he did not elaborate on what they were. He said agents found no evidence of a crime and that they did not identify Hole as espousing a racially motivated ideology.

    McCartt said Hole was a former employee of the company and last worked for FedEx in 2020. McCartt said he did not know why Hole left the job or if he had ties to the workers in the facility. He said police have not yet uncovered a motive for Thursday’s shooting but added that law enforcement officers seized a gun from him last year. McCartt also said authorities are still identifying the victims and that not all of the victims’ families have been notified.

    Eight people were shot and killed in a late-night shooting at a FedEx facility in Indianapolis, and the shooter has killed himself, police said. Multiple other people were injured Thursday night. (April 16)

    Hole started randomly firing at people in the parking lot and then went into the building and continued shooting late Thursday night, McCartt said. He said the shooter apparently killed himself shortly before police entered the building.

    “There was no confrontation with anyone that was there,” he said. “There was no disturbance, there was no argument. He just appeared to randomly start shooting."

    McCartt said four people were killed outside the building and another four inside. Several people were also wounded, including five who were taken to the hospital. McCartt said the slayings took place in a matter of minutes.

    Officials with the coroner's office began the process of identifying victims Friday afternoon, a process they said would take several hours.

    Police Chief Randal Taylor noted that a “significant” number of employees at the FedEx facility are members of the Sikh community, and the Sikh Coalition later issued a statement saying it was “deeply saddened to learn” that Sikh community members were among the wounded and killed.

    The coalition, which identifies itself as the largest Sikh civil rights organization in the U.S., said in the statement that it expected authorities to “conduct a full investigation — including the possibility of bias as a factor.” The coalition's executive director, Satjeet Kaur, noted that more than 8,000 Sikh Americans live in Indiana.

    The agonizing wait by the workers' families was exacerbated by the fact that most employees aren’t allowed to carry cellphones inside the FedEx building, making contact with them difficult.

    “When you see notifications on your phone, but you’re not getting a text back from your kid and you’re not getting information and you still don’t know where they are … what are you supposed to do?” Mindy Carson said early Friday, fighting back tears.

    Carson later said she had heard from her daughter Jessica, who works in the facility, and that she was OK. She was going to meet her, but didn't say where.

    FedEx said in a statement that cellphone access is limited to a small number of workers in the dock and package sorting areas to “support safety protocols and minimize potential distractions.”

    FedEx Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Frederick Smith called the shooting a “senseless act of violence.”

    “This is a devastating day, and words are hard to describe the emotions we all feel,” he wrote in an email to employees.

    The killings marked the latest in a string of recent mass shootings across the country and the third mass shooting this year in Indianapolis. Five people, including a pregnant woman, were shot and killed in the city in January, and a man was accused of killing three adults and a child before abducting his daughter during at argument at a home in March. In other states last month, eight people were fatally shot at massage businesses in the Atlanta area, and 10 died in gunfire at a supermarket in Boulder, Colorado.

    Indianapolis Mayor Joe Hogsett said the community must guard against resignation and “the assumption that this is simply how it must be and we might as well get used to it.”

    President Joe Biden said he had been briefed on the shooting and called gun violence “an epidemic” in the U.S.

    Full Coverage:
     

    “Too many Americans are dying every single day from gun violence. It stains our character and pierces the very soul of our nation,” he said in a statement. Later, he tweeted, “We can, and must, do more to reduce gun violence and save lives.”

    House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said she was “horrified and heartbroken” by the shooting and called for congressional action on gun control.

    “As we pray for the families of all affected, we must work urgently to enact commonsense gun violence prevention laws to save lives & prevent this suffering,” the Democratic leader said in a tweet.

    A witness said he was working inside the building when he heard several gunshots in rapid succession.

    “I see a man come out with a rifle in his hand and he starts firing and he starts yelling stuff that I could not understand,” Levi Miller told WTHR-TV. “What I ended up doing was ducking down to make sure he did not see me because I thought he would see me and he would shoot me.”

    A man told WTTV that his niece was sitting in the driver’s seat of her car when the gunfire erupted, and she was wounded.

    “She got shot on her left arm,” said Parminder Singh. “She’s fine, she’s in the hospital now.”

    Gov. Eric Holcomb ordered flags to be flown at half-staff until April 20, and he and others decried the shooting.

    Chris Bavender, a spokesperson for the FBI’s Indianapolis office, said the bureau is helping with the investigation.

    ___

    Associated Press reporters Michael Balsamo and Eric Tucker in Washington contributed to this report. Casey Smith is a corps member for the Associated Press/Report for America Statehouse News Initiative. Report for America is a nonprofit national service program that places journalists in local newsrooms to report on undercovered issues.


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    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,576
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,104
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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