The Juggler said:

Why are people so sure there were no signs to tell? I don't get how people are just assuming that. If anything, I think the more likely scenario is the child's parents were pleading for help and their cries may have fallen on deaf ears. Nobody really knows. One thing I do know, is this is not a regular occurrence. 

mace1229 said:

josevolution said:

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

^
He was a republican for probably over 30 years up until LAST year. He was a republican during the time in question. Bravo to him for putting his country over his corrupt political party.

I said his wife and daughters supported Hillary. That does not mean he is/was a supporter. There is no evidence of Comey being a Hillary supporter.

The article you're talking about regarding what he wants to happen in 2020 was from last week. Come on, dude. We are talking about events from two and a half years ago. Of course NOW he wants democrats to win in 2020. Republicans have done nothing but demonize him since Trump fired him. And he is, by all accounts, a sane person who sees the kind of president Trump has been.

The point is you cannot find any evidence that he was a Hillary supporter and wanted her to win in 2016. All of his public actions helped Donald Trump.

No, I cannot find anything where he publicly promotes Hilary. But he removed himself as republican by 2016 election I think before the election. And watching several interviews during his book tour, it was clear to me of his distaste for Trump. He's made it known he doesn't like Trump for a while. That was just he latest of interviews and comments I posted. I dont think Comey is worth talking about, I think we'll ljust have to disagree on who we think he wanted to be president in 2016. I can agree he likely cost Hilary the election, I never disputed that.

It’s best if you just admitted you are wrong all you have been saying is excuses you sound like the Baffoon, Comey helping HRC that’s laughable..

Thanks. I'll take that with a grain of salt coming from someone who calls anyone who disagrees with them a Trump lover without knowing any facts though.
And I already admitted I overstated what I meant to say and some of the facts I assumed were wrong.

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mace1229 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mace1229 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Did this ever happen under previous Administrations? 

https://apple.news/A3fMXpYoGSzmqDEXnL9bFiQ

That is a sad story and I hope it never happens. But my guess is it probably isn't that rare. And one of the big reasons I am against promoting mass immigration like this. The article doesn't give many details, other than she was in custody for about 8 hours until she died and they they had a record number in custody for a small facility. She may not have even been showing sings of serious illness until it was too late. When you have hundreds in custody in places that are meant to house just a few dozen this will continue to happen and conditions will be horrible. The article says that facility received a record number of 227 that day and was "Extremely large" for their standards. Even if water was available, 8 hours is not that long to go without a medical exam when you are not equipped for that number of people, and was probably already beyond the point of needing just water at that point.
I am for granting asylum to those who need it, but this caravan is not the right way to do it. Conditions in Mexico are horrible where they are being housed and I bet disease is rampant there. And y biggest concern is if this caravan is encouraged the numbers will probably grow next time and cases like this will be more common.

For how many weeks/months were told of the invasion? And we’re supposed to be the “greatest” nation on earth? I’m embarrassed by the ineptitude you helped elect.

Her death had absolutely zero to do with providing for the caravan. If the US brought In-In-Out, gatorade and put them in a luxury hotel to everyojn in the caravan she'd still be dead. This was a remote desert in NM several hundred miles away from the caravan, not equipped for large people when they had nearly 400 caught in 2 days, a record high. I couldn't find how many it was built to hold, but they called this an "extremely high" number and say this facility was built to house individuals, not multiple families.
So how would preparing for the caravan have prevented this? It would do nothing for that. And promoting the idea that if you just show up you get in will only encourage wreckless attempts like this and will have the same result. We can't be expected to build stations to house thousands across the entire boarder, and provide food water and medical attention to thousands that show up in even remote areas. That is just unrealistic.  This is the danger of promoting large groups like this, and there is no way to prepare for it and sustain it for the long term. 
If she was one of 20 who were detained she may be alive. But being 1 of 400 who were detained it isn't surprising. Now if she had obvious signs of a serious medical conditions that were made known and went untreated, that would be a different story. None of that is known at the time, so I am going on the assumption that the first physical signs were the seizures, and by then it was too late.

How about the US provide a minimum of a health assessment, knowing that the people coming to the border have most likely endured a physically demanding environment and experience, as a first reaction to the encounter rather than cuffing and detaining them? Is that beyond our capabilities?
 

I knew this was coming.  Surprised it took this long.

Should we not? Have we lost our humanity? Is the death of a 7 year old in US custody just meh?
 

I'm pretty sure there were no signs to tell.  I'm also not surprised as you paint the whole US border patrol with a broad stroke.


You are good at doing that...

How did I paint the US border patrol with a broad stroke? Typical to make an assumption without any facts.

My criticism is of the Team Trump Treason administration and their politicizing of the issue rather than addressing it. It should be a matter of apprehension policy to conduct a routine basic medical assessment of detainees as part of the process. Ask a few basic questions, how long have you been in the desert? When was the last time you ate? Drank water? How much? Check their vitals. Then offer them MREs and bottled water and one of those reflective blankets. Secure them for the agent's safety. Ask for ID, check for weapons, etc. Then do a basic health assessment. If someone is distressed, hasn't eaten in a few days, hasn't had water, keep an eye on them and maybe they get evacuated to an ER and treated before they're detained, particularly a 7 year old. Any other competent administration would be addressing this issue on multiple fronts, with multiple cabinet level departments involved, inclusive of the State Department to mitigate the issue as they worked with congress to address the longer term immigration issues. Team Trump Treason? Doesn't care for anything but his fucking wall. What comes next? Let the bodies stack up at the base of the wall until they can climb up and drop over? Its not rocket science and every president from Carter, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Bush 2 and Obama would show at least some modicum of respect and compassion for these people.

I'm still proud to live in a country that has the ACLU to sue the government for the actions of the border patrol who, "have a history of cruelty with how they handle migrants." Speaking of your "broad brush."

mace1229 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mace1229 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mace1229 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Did this ever happen under previous Administrations? 

https://apple.news/A3fMXpYoGSzmqDEXnL9bFiQ

That is a sad story and I hope it never happens. But my guess is it probably isn't that rare. And one of the big reasons I am against promoting mass immigration like this. The article doesn't give many details, other than she was in custody for about 8 hours until she died and they they had a record number in custody for a small facility. She may not have even been showing sings of serious illness until it was too late. When you have hundreds in custody in places that are meant to house just a few dozen this will continue to happen and conditions will be horrible. The article says that facility received a record number of 227 that day and was "Extremely large" for their standards. Even if water was available, 8 hours is not that long to go without a medical exam when you are not equipped for that number of people, and was probably already beyond the point of needing just water at that point.
I am for granting asylum to those who need it, but this caravan is not the right way to do it. Conditions in Mexico are horrible where they are being housed and I bet disease is rampant there. And y biggest concern is if this caravan is encouraged the numbers will probably grow next time and cases like this will be more common.

For how many weeks/months were told of the invasion? And we’re supposed to be the “greatest” nation on earth? I’m embarrassed by the ineptitude you helped elect.

Her death had absolutely zero to do with providing for the caravan. If the US brought In-In-Out, gatorade and put them in a luxury hotel to everyojn in the caravan she'd still be dead. This was a remote desert in NM several hundred miles away from the caravan, not equipped for large people when they had nearly 400 caught in 2 days, a record high. I couldn't find how many it was built to hold, but they called this an "extremely high" number and say this facility was built to house individuals, not multiple families.
So how would preparing for the caravan have prevented this? It would do nothing for that. And promoting the idea that if you just show up you get in will only encourage wreckless attempts like this and will have the same result. We can't be expected to build stations to house thousands across the entire boarder, and provide food water and medical attention to thousands that show up in even remote areas. That is just unrealistic.  This is the danger of promoting large groups like this, and there is no way to prepare for it and sustain it for the long term. 
If she was one of 20 who were detained she may be alive. But being 1 of 400 who were detained it isn't surprising. Now if she had obvious signs of a serious medical conditions that were made known and went untreated, that would be a different story. None of that is known at the time, so I am going on the assumption that the first physical signs were the seizures, and by then it was too late.

How about the US provide a minimum of a health assessment, knowing that the people coming to the border have most likely endured a physically demanding environment and experience, as a first reaction to the encounter rather than cuffing and detaining them? Is that beyond our capabilities?
 

I knew this was coming.  Surprised it took this long.

Should we not? Have we lost our humanity? Is the death of a 7 year old in US custody just meh?
 

I'm pretty sure there were no signs to tell.  I'm also not surprised as you paint the whole US border patrol with a broad stroke.


You are good at doing that...

How did I paint the US border patrol with a broad stroke? Typical to make an assumption without any facts.

My criticism is of the Team Trump Treason administration and their politicizing of the issue rather than addressing it. It should be a matter of apprehension policy to conduct a routine basic medical assessment of detainees as part of the process. Ask a few basic questions, how long have you been in the desert? When was the last time you ate? Drank water? How much? Check their vitals. Then offer them MREs and bottled water and one of those reflective blankets. Secure them for the agent's safety. Ask for ID, check for weapons, etc. Then do a basic health assessment. If someone is distressed, hasn't eaten in a few days, hasn't had water, keep an eye on them and maybe they get evacuated to an ER and treated before they're detained, particularly a 7 year old. Any other competent administration would be addressing this issue on multiple fronts, with multiple cabinet level departments involved, inclusive of the State Department to mitigate the issue as they worked with congress to address the longer term immigration issues. Team Trump Treason? Doesn't care for anything but his fucking wall. What comes next? Let the bodies stack up at the base of the wall until they can climb up and drop over? Its not rocket science and every president from Carter, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Bush 2 and Obama would show at least some modicum of respect and compassion for these people.

I'm still proud to live in a country that has the ACLU to sue the government for the actions of the border patrol who, "have a history of cruelty with how they handle migrants." Speaking of your "broad brush."

But how do you do that? This was  small facility that had a record number of apprehensions. It does not seem they were equipped to handle such a large number of people at once, and that is unfortunately the result. Even if there was a basic health exam, it could take days to process 400+ people, and when someone is dead in 8 hours that is very difficult to treat.
We just cant be expected to have unlimited resources and space at every point on the border, that just isn't possible. But that is what would be needed to prevent this from ever happening again. So as long as large groups of people cross in dangerous terrain, this will always happen. As previously mentioned they are found dead more often than they are found and die a few hours later. And as I said before, encouraging this behavior will create more cases like this. This is nothing new, this has nothing to do with Trump. People have died crossing the boarder for many years.

Train border patrol agents to have a minimum of first aid training or have one member of the team be trained as such, if they're not already. Stop making excuses and making it sound as if its an insurmountable problem. Ask Doctors Without Borders to provide services? Print the forms migrants are asked to sign in Spanish? The father signed a "health form" but it was in English and he doesn't read English. There, I gave you three solutions. Seems your solution is throw your hands in the air and say we can't do anything? What solutions, other than stop encouraging them, would you offer?

How many have died in custody previously and how many children were separated from their parents, over 15,000 children now? Team trump Treason's lack of compassion and treatment of migrants is certainly "new."

Bentleyspop said:

Ignorant xenophobic jackass....

https://twitter.com/bad_takes/status/1073773580985516032?s=19

josevolution said:

The Juggler said:

How’s the INVASION coming along? I haven’t heard anything from our commander in chief about it in a WHILE. WEIRD. 

Exactly he’s busy wishing Flynn good luck today..

The Juggler said:

Trump is doubling down on his strategy that cost the GOP the House

https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/18/politics/trump-ignore-majority-shutdown-wall/index.html

Public opposition to a shutdown over the wall

Uneasy GOP officeholders have legitimate reason for concern: In a National Public Radio/Marist survey last week, just 36% of Americans said Trump should shut down the government if Congress doesn't fund his wall. A 57% majority said he should compromise to avoid a shutdown. 

But about two-thirds of self-identified Republicans in the survey said they would support a shutdown for the wall, and it is that core of immigration hardliners in the party that Trump has targeted with his agenda and rhetoric on the issue. 

During the 2016 Republican presidential primaries, Trump's tough approach on immigration, symbolized by his calls for a wall across the southern border that he would compel Mexico to fund, was his distinguishing feature in the crowded field. Trump won largely by consolidating the portions of the GOP electorate most antagonistic to undocumented immigrants and immigration more broadly. 

Exit polls in 20 states during the GOP primary asked if voters thought that undocumented immigrants should be allowed to obtain legal status or if they should be deported; in only two of the 20 states did a majority of voters even in the GOP primaries support deportation. Yet that hardline minority backed Trump in such overwhelming numbers that they provided a majority of his votes in 18 of the 20 states, the exit polls found. 

The foundation of Trump's coalition is cracking

But Trump's call for the wall has never won broad public support. For years, polls have consistently found that while Americans support a pathway to legal status or citizenship for undocumented immigrants without criminal records, they also place a high priority on ensuring border security. Yet even within that broad consensus, Trump's specific solution -- the border wall -- has always faced lopsided opposition. 

In 10 Quinnipiac University national polls from April 2017 through August 2018, no more than 40% of Americans ever expressed support for the wall. Consistently, the share of Americans opposing construction of the wall has been much higher, from 57% to 64%. A CNN Poll conducted by SSRS that was released last week found 57% against a wall, compared with 38% in favor. 

Opposition to the wall is overwhelming among all the groups that moved decisively away from Trump and the GOP in last month's election. In CNN's poll, Trump's border wall faced opposition from 76% of African-Americans, 66% of Latinos, 66% of adults younger than 35, 57% of independents, 66% of college-educated white voters and 56% of people aged 35 to 49.

A Texas woman who voted for President Donald Trump in 2016 tells the Los Angeles Times that she’s now afraid her family’s land will be seized in order to build the president’s proposed border wall.

Rios tells the LA Times that she voted for Trump in 2016 because she wanted to stop undocumented immigrants from coming into the United States.

However, she was disturbed earlier this year when her family received a letter from the federal government asking them to let surveyors access their lands so they could determine whether any of it needed to be used for the wall along the U.S.-Mexico border.

“This is our land,” said the 60-year-old Rios, whose family founded the tiny De La Cruz colonia in the Rio Grande Valley decades ago.

In addition to being worried about Trump taking some of her family’s land, she also says she’s disturbed by rumors that the government will build the wall to the north of their neighborhood.

“They can’t leave us on the Mexican side,” Rios pleaded to the LA Times.

Rios also tells the publication that her daughter has recently spent money renovating her home and is worried that all her work will be ruined if her house gets cut off from the rest of the country by a giant wall.

The Juggler said:

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/12/texas-trump-voter-now-fears-president-will-seize-familys-land-build-border-wall/?__twitter_impression=true

Texas Trump voter now fears the president will seize her family’s land to build his border wall

A Texas woman who voted for President Donald Trump in 2016 tells the Los Angeles Times that she’s now afraid her family’s land will be seized in order to build the president’s proposed border wall.

Rios tells the LA Times that she voted for Trump in 2016 because she wanted to stop undocumented immigrants from coming into the United States.

However, she was disturbed earlier this year when her family received a letter from the federal government asking them to let surveyors access their lands so they could determine whether any of it needed to be used for the wall along the U.S.-Mexico border.

“This is our land,” said the 60-year-old Rios, whose family founded the tiny De La Cruz colonia in the Rio Grande Valley decades ago.

In addition to being worried about Trump taking some of her family’s land, she also says she’s disturbed by rumors that the government will build the wall to the north of their neighborhood.

“They can’t leave us on the Mexican side,” Rios pleaded to the LA Times.

Rios also tells the publication that her daughter has recently spent money renovating her home and is worried that all her work will be ruined if her house gets cut off from the rest of the country by a giant wall.