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America's Gun Violence

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  • riley540riley540 Denver Colorado Posts: 1,132


    Meant to say assault rifles. AR-15 was included in the 94-04 ban.


    Question for you: if two hand guns would do the same damage.....why do we never see any mass shootings with the shooter using two hand guns? Why do they always use assault rifles? My guess is it's way easier...

    I don’t know. I’m not interested in killing a lot of people. All I’m saying is I don’t think school shootings would end if we ban AR-15s. I shot an AR when I was in high school and it was just kind of boring. Not into shooting. But my friend and his dad love it. He loves the collectibility, the craftsmanship, the hobby, ect. He’s an awesome guy. 

    I just know that no matter what happens, there will be a lot of pissed off people. Just trying to offer some alternate perceptive. I don’t have any answers, and obviously no one really does, or this wouldn’t have happened. 
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,087
    edited February 2018
    riley540 said:
    Also, Australia still has a lot of guns, yet no mass shootings. Also mass shooting have been on an upward trend in the US the past 20 years even though we have had fun access for over 200 years. There’s more to it than availability to weapons. Laws didn’t stop this from happening. It’s against the law to murder, and against the law to carry on school grounds. My point is, laws didn’t prevent this guy. A motivated killer will kill. 
    Right....and an intelligent society will make it as difficult as possible for those people to kill.
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  • Meant to say assault rifles. AR-15 was included in the 94-04 ban.


    Question for you: if two hand guns would do the same damage.....why do we never see any mass shootings with the shooter using two hand guns? Why do they always use assault rifles? My guess is it's way easier...

    Lighter. Easier to carry.

    Yah. You won't get a response to this question. One worth anything anyways.
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  • riley540riley540 Denver Colorado Posts: 1,132
    Correct me if I am wrong, 

    in sandy hook, didn’t the medical examiner date that the rifle wasn’t used and it was a short barrel hand gun that was used to kill? 

    I remember the video of him, but I could be wrong. 
  • riley540riley540 Denver Colorado Posts: 1,132
    Virginia tech, and columbine hand guns were also used 
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,107
    Lighter. Easier to carry.

    Yah. You won't get a response to this question. One worth anything anyways.
    Del you are a smart guy, think about why someone wouldn’t use two handguns?  Answer: how the hell are you going to reload in an efficient manner?  With any semi automatic weapon you can walk, drop your mag , load a new mag with your other hand and keep going.

    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,590
    OnWis97 said:
    Maybe we should study why we have so many more problems than this.  We can't spend federal money because someone was scared that it would hurt the NRA (what are they afraid of since guns don't kill people.

    Seriously, places like Australia don't have this problem.  Maybe it's not the supply of guns that causes the problem here.  But there's not much appetite to figure it out.  Because once someone asks the question, those in power jump right to serving the NRA.

    Gun manufacturers have been producing these mass killing machines like never before over the past 14 years since the ban ended. 40 years ago---these kinds of guns were not nearly in as much demand as they are now. I'm sure the NRA drilling the idea that the government is 'coming to take your guns so you better buy as many as possible now' has nothing to do with it though...
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  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 31,463
    At the end of the day the NRA will get its way sales will go up they always do after these massacres..
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,590
    Lighter. Easier to carry.

    Yah. You won't get a response to this question. One worth anything anyways.
    Never.
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  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    At the end of the day the NRA will get its way sales will go up they always do after these massacres..
    Yup, people can be parinoid. 
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  • Why can't we have more stringent background checks and ban weapons that are designed to kill mass amounts of people?

    Hand guns kill more people, but you can make a case for why a law abiding citizen should own one for protection. Can you do the same for a gun like the AR-15? I answered your question earlier about mass shootings prior to the ban in the 90's. Nothing is perfect, but it did curb mass shootings and then they sky rocketed after it expired. Reinstate it and put forth stricter, universal background checks, and also make it mandatory to have a license that needs to be renewed every 5 years in order to own a gun.


    Also, the constitution is a living document....

    I believe I stated I was for more stringent background checks.  

    I think you you could make the case of wanting an assault rifle for protection, but that’s not the argument we are having.

    The assult rifle ban you keep holding up didn’t really cause any change in gun fatalities.

    Also you answered with 3 mass shootings over the course of 30 years prior to the assult rifle ban.  There wasn’t some epidemic of mass shootings before the ban.  This is resent.  The guns didn’t change, we as a society has changed.  You can ban all the assault weapons you want to but just because they are banned doesn’t mean they go away.  

    I think we should find better ways of restricting firearms and also try to figure out why we are having what appears to be more and more people that want to cause these violent acts.

    https://www.factcheck.org/2013/02/did-the-1994-assault-weapons-ban-work/

  • Meant to say assault rifles. AR-15 was included in the 94-04 ban.


    Question for you: if two hand guns would do the same damage.....why do we never see any mass shootings with the shooter using two hand guns? Why do they always use assault rifles? My guess is it's way easier...

    Virgins Tech, and possibly Columbine off the top of my head.
  • Virgins Tech, and possibly Columbine off the top of my head.
    Ha, damn autocorrect from my phone!
  • riley540riley540 Denver Colorado Posts: 1,132
    Ha, damn autocorrect from my phone!
    The school for virgins 
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,590
    I believe I stated I was for more stringent background checks.  

    I think you you could make the case of wanting an assault rifle for protection, but that’s not the argument we are having.

    The assult rifle ban you keep holding up didn’t really cause any change in gun fatalities.

    Also you answered with 3 mass shootings over the course of 30 years prior to the assult rifle ban.  There wasn’t some epidemic of mass shootings before the ban.  This is resent.  The guns didn’t change, we as a society has changed.  You can ban all the assault weapons you want to but just because they are banned doesn’t mean they go away.  

    I think we should find better ways of restricting firearms and also try to figure out why we are having what appears to be more and more people that want to cause these violent acts.

    https://www.factcheck.org/2013/02/did-the-1994-assault-weapons-ban-work/


    Sorry. Those three that I mentioned and the one Halifax mentioned were all within the previous 4-5 years leading up to the ban that was also supported by G HW Bush and Ronald Reagan. It was becoming an epidemic. After the ban, mass shootings decreased. After the ban, they started sky rocketing. Simple.

    The answer to the questions you seek in your last paragraph are available all over the rest of the civilized world where these mass shootings happen at far lesser frequency than here--they have much stricter gun laws than we do.

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  • I’m really not sure what your point here is in context of what I said.  You come across as a sensationalist.  I don’t have any problem with it, but it makes it hard to have a grown up discussion.  Ask the other 97% of the family victims if it was worth it to them by going after assault riffles would be my response on your level.  
    You’re dismissive of 3%. 3% of just 5 mass shootings since 2012 is 5 people that might still be alive. 3% of the hundreds injured in just the Vegas shooting is double digits. But go ahead and dismiss it. It’s only 3%.
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  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,388
    Lots of great points being made and some ridiculous ones in here on both sides. Adding armed security at schools (still a longer term solution and budget issue) is a response until the ban of assault rifles is implemented and stricter measures for gun ownership are taken. Arming teachers is a solution I hope never becomes universal because it's a horrible idea. And just adding armed security stops no one from shooting up anywhere, ever. Most of these places had armed security and even police on site. They can't be every where to stop it from occurring.

    Metal detectors, while great in theory, will be impossible to implement at most schools. Think of anywhere you go that has one. Controlled entrance points, lines and staffing at all times when people can enter. Most schools need to utilize multiple entries and exits. Schools still need to conduct fire drills, have recess and allow pick up and drop off.

    Gun control with bans on certain types of firearms and accessories coupled with extensive backgrounds, psychological assessments and gun registries would make a huge impact. Doesn't solve all the problems, but makes it significantly more difficult and frees up the time and money to spend on the social/emotional resources needed to help prevent these types of people from being procured from our shitty society.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,388
    mcgruff10 said:
    Mag limits to 10 or 15 rounds is a great way to start. 
    Why not 5? What do you need 10 to 15 rounds for? 
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • PJPOWERPJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    edited February 2018
    Never.
    Only two handguns used in Virginia Tech, right?
    Post edited by PJPOWER on
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,107
    tbergs said:
    Why not 5? What do you need 10 to 15 rounds for? 
    See what you did, you went with no compromise. If you went 5 then a hell of a lot of guns would be illegal. Revolvers for example, m1 garand s, tube fed .22’s.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • unsungunsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    tbergs said:
    Why not 5? What do you need 10 to 15 rounds for? 

  • I believe I stated I was for more stringent background checks.  

    I think you you could make the case of wanting an assault rifle for protection, but that’s not the argument we are having.

    The assult rifle ban you keep holding up didn’t really cause any change in gun fatalities.

    Also you answered with 3 mass shootings over the course of 30 years prior to the assult rifle ban.  There wasn’t some epidemic of mass shootings before the ban.  This is resent.  The guns didn’t change, we as a society has changed.  You can ban all the assault weapons you want to but just because they are banned doesn’t mean they go away.  

    I think we should find better ways of restricting firearms and also try to figure out why we are having what appears to be more and more people that want to cause these violent acts.

    https://www.factcheck.org/2013/02/did-the-1994-assault-weapons-ban-work/
    https://www.statista.com/chart/12943/is-it-time-to-bring-back-the-assault-weapons-ban/

    Infographic Is It Time To Bring Back The Assault Weapons Ban   Statista
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,590
    unsung said:

    You live in a fantasy world.
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  • unsung said:

    Sill living in fear.
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  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,388
    PJPOWER said:
    Only two handguns used in Virginia Tech, right?
    Do you know that was '07?
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • PJPOWERPJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    tbergs said:
    Do you know that was '07?
    Yes...what’s your point, they asked why handguns were never used in these incidents...did I miss something?
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,590
    PJPOWER said:
    Yes...what’s your point, they asked why handguns were never used in these incidents...did I miss something?


    I didn't say never. Why are they not used as frequently as assault rifles?

    And that kid was also fucked up in the head right? Another example why need a more extensive background check.

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  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,388
    mcgruff10 said:
    See what you did, you went with no compromise. If you went 5 then a hell of a lot of guns would be illegal. Revolvers for example, m1 garand s, tube fed .22’s.
    It's a compromise, just not one you like. It would require changes in manufacturing.moving forward.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • PJPOWERPJPOWER Posts: 6,499


    I didn't say never. Why are they not used as frequently as assault rifles?

    And that kid was also fucked up in the head right? Another example why need a more extensive background check.

    You, in fact, did say “never”:
    .why do we never see any mass shootings with the shooter using two hand guns? Why do they always use assault rifles?”
    But I’m okay with background checks as most are.  You have to get an FBI background check before getting a license to carry...
  • mcgruff10 said:
    Del you are a smart guy, think about why someone wouldn’t use two handguns?  Answer: how the hell are you going to reload in an efficient manner?  With any semi automatic weapon you can walk, drop your mag , load a new mag with your other hand and keep going.

    Exactly.

    The AR15 is the preferred weapon of the homicidal psychopath for so many great reasons.
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