I don't believe in God

RogueStoner said:

brianlux said:

Degeneratefk said:

I can't speak for other religions (hell,  I can't speak for Christianity.  It's just what I grew up around) but it's existence relies on people jammingbjt down everyone's throat. Doesn't Christianity teach that all Christians must spread the word? Why do you think people always say "I'll pray for you?" Aren't they praying that you or whoever will turn to Christ? 

This is certainly true for Christianity.   You're supposed to proselytize.  If you're a "true Christian", a "good Christian", you're supposed to be an evangelical.  I got interested in the Jesus movement for a while back in the seventies because some of the people I knew who were into it were very kind and giving but the two things that turned me off were the notions of having to say the right words ("I accept Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Savior") to get into heaven (otherwise you go to hell?  fuck that) and the insistence that you had to proselytize to be a true Christian.  No thanks.

I hate that! So basically, as long as you accept Jesus..., it can be on your deathbed but you'll still get into heaven, regardless of what kind of person you were in life? Even if heaven existed, that wouldn't be right. What does that even mean? What's the point? 
I respect others' religious beliefs but when they start pushing them on me...it's on! They better have some damn good arguments. They never do.  

HughFreakingDillon said:

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it comes up as my brother is ultra religious, as is his wife and son. their son especially judges me like a motherfucker. i really think he thinks i'm the devil. he creeps me the fuck out. in a unabomber kinda way.

they believe homosexuality is a choice and is curable. my brother told me last night at dinner that the he finds the american (republican) version of christianity is so bastardized that it barely resembles christianity at all. which i found interesting. 

it also comes up in my house a lot as my wife is catholic and so i agreed to raise our kids as such. or rather, i said i'd allow her to teach them that as kids, and they can make their minds up about it when they can frame it themselves. my youngest asks me questions about my beliefs all the time. it's kind of fun as, for an 8 year old, she comes up with fascinatingly intelligent questions. and i enjoy talking to her about it, because she's so young, there's zero judgment, only curiosity. which is refreshing. 

my daughter's guitar teacher gave her a ball to carry around the house as exercise in how to hold her finger picking hand. i looked at it and it said "smile....jesus loves you". i nearly stuffed it in his fucking mouth. 

Serious question...you want others to respect your beliefs, so why the last sentence?  

I persoannly don;t believe in organized religion.  I do believe in something...or maybe I just want to.  But to me it just feels like there is something that ties us all together.  But then there are times when I think there is no way.

I also am a bit like you in that I seem to have a terrible reaction to others beliefs at times and it bothers me.  But I'm trying to not do that as much.  Because some of the time they are being judgmental and deserve it, but most of the time it's pretty innocent and just normal life for them.  And really it doesn't effect me anymore than someone's sexuality so I should stop being such a jerk about it all the time.

the last sentence because it just seems so underhanded to give a "gift" to a child and it turning out to be something that happens to be part of their agenda. I find that disgusting. people do that shit knowing full well how awkward it is to confront the person about it with their child right there and the parent giving them shit for a gift they gave them. it turns into 'how did I become the asshole in this situation?'. 

I wasn't actually as angry about it and that statement made it sound. He's a nice guy, and for all I know, he got it for free to give to his students and thought nothing of it. I don't know. I looked at it, chuckled to myself, and put it down. 

the difference between someone's sexuality and religion is that no one is trying to ram their sexuality down anyone's throat. They are proud, they want to make you aware who they are, but by no means are they trying to convert you. 

HughFreakingDillon said:

mace1229 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it comes up as my brother is ultra religious, as is his wife and son. their son especially judges me like a motherfucker. i really think he thinks i'm the devil. he creeps me the fuck out. in a unabomber kinda way.

they believe homosexuality is a choice and is curable. my brother told me last night at dinner that the he finds the american (republican) version of christianity is so bastardized that it barely resembles christianity at all. which i found interesting. 

it also comes up in my house a lot as my wife is catholic and so i agreed to raise our kids as such. or rather, i said i'd allow her to teach them that as kids, and they can make their minds up about it when they can frame it themselves. my youngest asks me questions about my beliefs all the time. it's kind of fun as, for an 8 year old, she comes up with fascinatingly intelligent questions. and i enjoy talking to her about it, because she's so young, there's zero judgment, only curiosity. which is refreshing. 

my daughter's guitar teacher gave her a ball to carry around the house as exercise in how to hold her finger picking hand. i looked at it and it said "smile....jesus loves you". i nearly stuffed it in his fucking mouth. 

Serious question...you want others to respect your beliefs, so why the last sentence?  

I persoannly don;t believe in organized religion.  I do believe in something...or maybe I just want to.  But to me it just feels like there is something that ties us all together.  But then there are times when I think there is no way.

I also am a bit like you in that I seem to have a terrible reaction to others beliefs at times and it bothers me.  But I'm trying to not do that as much.  Because some of the time they are being judgmental and deserve it, but most of the time it's pretty innocent and just normal life for them.  And really it doesn't effect me anymore than someone's sexuality so I should stop being such a jerk about it all the time.

the last sentence because it just seems so underhanded to give a "gift" to a child and it turning out to be something that happens to be part of their agenda. I find that disgusting. people do that shit knowing full well how awkward it is to confront the person about it with their child right there and the parent giving them shit for a gift they gave them. it turns into 'how did I become the asshole in this situation?'. 

I wasn't actually as angry about it and that statement made it sound. He's a nice guy, and for all I know, he got it for free to give to his students and thought nothing of it. I don't know. I looked at it, chuckled to myself, and put it down. 

the difference between someone's sexuality and religion is that no one is trying to ram their sexuality down anyone's throat. They are proud, they want to make you aware who they are, but by no means are they trying to convert you. 

Reminds me of what Penn and Teller said (well...just Penn I guess).
They are outspoken atheists, but in an interview Penn said he is offended when a Christian doesn't ask him about God. If they don't say anything, its like saying "I believe you're going to hell and I don't care."
Even if he went out of his way to obtain that ball to give it out I don't see why anyone would care. I don;t care at the end of a Chinese meal the waiter drops off something with Buddhist images and writing on it. Yeah, I'd be pretty annoyed if he kept coming by and preaching to me while I'm trying to eat, but just dropping something off at the end of a meal or inside a cookie why would that bother anyone?

as I said, my statement about "shoving it in his mouth" was an exaggeration, and I clarified that I just chuckled to myself and gave it back to my daughter. My point was that, it seems underhanded to give something like that to a child. it's manipulation. give it to me, fine, no big deal.

that being said, we all react in different ways to different circumstances. I'm tired of people getting judged for how they react to any given situation, just because it wouldn't bother someone else, somehow means the person it bothered is over reacting. No, the experiences of my 43 years on earth led me to react that way. Just as your XX amount of years led you to react in a certain way to something else that wouldn't necessarily bother me.  

cincybearcat said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

RogueStoner said:

brianlux said:

Degeneratefk said:

I can't speak for other religions (hell,  I can't speak for Christianity.  It's just what I grew up around) but it's existence relies on people jammingbjt down everyone's throat. Doesn't Christianity teach that all Christians must spread the word? Why do you think people always say "I'll pray for you?" Aren't they praying that you or whoever will turn to Christ? 

This is certainly true for Christianity.   You're supposed to proselytize.  If you're a "true Christian", a "good Christian", you're supposed to be an evangelical.  I got interested in the Jesus movement for a while back in the seventies because some of the people I knew who were into it were very kind and giving but the two things that turned me off were the notions of having to say the right words ("I accept Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Savior") to get into heaven (otherwise you go to hell?  fuck that) and the insistence that you had to proselytize to be a true Christian.  No thanks.

I hate that! So basically, as long as you accept Jesus..., it can be on your deathbed but you'll still get into heaven, regardless of what kind of person you were in life? Even if heaven existed, that wouldn't be right. What does that even mean? What's the point? 
I respect others' religious beliefs but when they start pushing them on me...it's on! They better have some damn good arguments. They never do.  

this is yet another in a long list of things I never understood about it, as you mentioned here. It was even made into a joke on the Simpsons when Homer quit going to church. Another character asked him about getting into heaven, and Homer replied "meh, I'll recant on my deathbed". it's such a stupid idea. 

Not so stupid.  It's the whole, you can always be forgiven....but you have to mean it.  It's not really meant as an excuse to do a bunch of terrible things and then get away with it...

Degeneratefk said:

I can't speak for other religions (hell,  I can't speak for Christianity.  It's just what I grew up around) but it's existence relies on people jammingbjt down everyone's throat. Doesn't Christianity teach that all Christians must spread the word? Why do you think people always say "I'll pray for you?" Aren't they praying that you or whoever will turn to Christ? 

cincybearcat said:

Smellyman said:

I don't get weird looks, but I don't live in the bible belt.   It's another reason the USA is so backwards (In many areas).


Another good Gervais.

… If you took every holy book, every holy book there’s ever been, every religious book, every bit of spirituality, and hid them or destroyed them… then you took every science book and destroyed that, in a thousand years’ time, those science books would be back exactly the same, because the tests would always turn out the same.

Those religious books would either never exist or they’d be totally different

Wow genius....describing the difference between science and faith...who knew.

cincybearcat said:

Smellyman said:

I don't get weird looks, but I don't live in the bible belt.   It's another reason the USA is so backwards (In many areas).


Another good Gervais.

… If you took every holy book, every holy book there’s ever been, every religious book, every bit of spirituality, and hid them or destroyed them… then you took every science book and destroyed that, in a thousand years’ time, those science books would be back exactly the same, because the tests would always turn out the same.

Those religious books would either never exist or they’d be totally different

Wow genius....describing the difference between science and faith...who knew.

Degeneratefk said:

Kev - Coat and Keys said:

Degeneratefk said:

I understand d what you guys are saying. And the premise of this wasn't to have a debate on whether or not God exists or in what form. 

I'm trying to gauge other peoples reactions to someone saying they don't believe. People literally look at me like I'm the devil himself. 

Well in that regards I only have an opposite experience with a research supervisor doing Evolutionary Algorithms whose religious beliefs meant he didn't think evolution was a real thing - and I thought that was crazy!

Yea, it's difficult to debate evolution vs creationism with people of faith. They're completely blinded by faith. Most of them have zero regard for provable science.

Gern Blansten said:

brianlux said:

Degeneratefk said:

I can't speak for other religions (hell,  I can't speak for Christianity.  It's just what I grew up around) but it's existence relies on people jammingbjt down everyone's throat. Doesn't Christianity teach that all Christians must spread the word? Why do you think people always say "I'll pray for you?" Aren't they praying that you or whoever will turn to Christ? 

This is certainly true for Christianity.   You're supposed to proselytize.  If you're a "true Christian", a "good Christian", you're supposed to be an evangelical.  I got interested in the Jesus movement for a while back in the seventies because some of the people I knew who were into it were very kind and giving but the two things that turned me off were the notions of having to say the right words ("I accept Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Savior") to get into heaven (otherwise you go to hell?  fuck that) and the insistence that you had to proselytize to be a true Christian.  No thanks.

yeah I have said for years that I have more respect for the Mormons and Jehovah's Witness groups than your typical Christian.  At least they go door to door and try to recruit....their belief is stronger than the poseurs that dress up nice and go to the fashion show every week (i.e. church)

Degeneratefk said:

I had someone I csre about very much explain to me that we are all nothing but energy. Everything in the universe is energy. She believes in god. But God to her is energy. Some sort of divine energy. That God is in all of us through this energy. Now, if I had to believe in a god, that may be the best option for me to go with.