America's Gun Violence

I talked with someone that was trying to get his automatic license.  Very extensive background check.  I believe the weapon needs to be made before 1986 although I'm not certain.  He wanted to buy an M-16 for $30K.

tempo_n_groove said:

dignin said:

tbergs said:

dignin said:

vaggar99 said:

to the people who vote for politicians who consistently vote against gun control: THIS IS ON YOU

I agree. Blood on their hands.

I get what you're saying, but it's not really that simple. I doubt most people truly look at a politicians stance on every issue and most times are balancing the importance of the issues that directly impact them. Many don't think they are contributing to gun violence, but I don't necessarily agree that it is blood on their hands.

You're also viewing it from a liberal lens. Conversatives generally are pro life and would say the same thing to those supporting a pro choice politician. 

I'm totally okay with aiding and abetting a pro-choice candidate. I am complicit in abortions. If I have blood on my hands for being pro-choice I'm at peace with that. 

Can a pro gun nut say the same thing about being okay with being complicit in a mass shooting? And if you vote for these guys, you are pro gun. They wear it with pride.

That's ridiculous. Nobody is complicit about a mass shooting. I'm pro gun but abhor any killing/suicides involving a firearm.

really? not even the NRA , the gun lobbyists and the GOP for refusing any sensible gun control legislation?

tempo_n_groove said:

dignin said:

tbergs said:

dignin said:

vaggar99 said:

to the people who vote for politicians who consistently vote against gun control: THIS IS ON YOU

I agree. Blood on their hands.

I get what you're saying, but it's not really that simple. I doubt most people truly look at a politicians stance on every issue and most times are balancing the importance of the issues that directly impact them. Many don't think they are contributing to gun violence, but I don't necessarily agree that it is blood on their hands.

You're also viewing it from a liberal lens. Conversatives generally are pro life and would say the same thing to those supporting a pro choice politician. 

I'm totally okay with aiding and abetting a pro-choice candidate. I am complicit in abortions. If I have blood on my hands for being pro-choice I'm at peace with that. 

Can a pro gun nut say the same thing about being okay with being complicit in a mass shooting? And if you vote for these guys, you are pro gun. They wear it with pride.

That's ridiculous. Nobody is complicit about a mass shooting. I'm pro gun but abhor any killing/suicides involving a firearm.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

Pro gun people have more blood on their hands today.

So we don't know if these guns were obtained legally.  Automatic guns are extremely hard and expensive to obtain legally.  I support the 2nd amendment.  I have zero blood on my hands.  If you support illegal immigration and an illegal immigrant kills someone, does that mean you have blood on your hands?  Some of these responses are so out there and are just knee jerk reactions.  "Ban the guns!"  "This wouldn't happen if guns were illegal!". My question will be once the facts come in, and if these guns were obtained illegally, how would changing gun laws prevented this?  If the gun was already illegal and obtained illegally then would one more law have made the person stop and say, "oh jeez, I was okay with breaking this law and shooting a bunch of people, but now that they passed this new law, I just don't want to risk it."

At least wait for facts to come in before politicizing and exploiting this situation for your own beliefs.  It's a terrible situation that should never have happened.  Let's get to the issue of why it happened and what could have been done to prevent it.  I think it's best to wait for facts to come in to be able to do that with a clear mind.  Emotional reactions aren't always the best and most thought out reactions.  Just saying.

mattsl1983 said:

So we don't know if these guns were obtained legally.  Automatic guns are extremely hard and expensive to obtain legally.  I support the 2nd amendment.  I have zero blood on my hands.  If you support illegal immigration and an illegal immigrant kills someone, does that mean you have blood on your hands?  Some of these responses are so out there and are just knee jerk reactions.  "Ban the guns!"  "This wouldn't happen if guns were illegal!". My question will be once the facts come in, and if these guns were obtained illegally, how would changing gun laws prevented this?  If the gun was already illegal and obtained illegally then would one more law have made the person stop and say, "oh jeez, I was okay with breaking this law and shooting a bunch of people, but now that they passed this new law, I just don't want to risk it."

At least wait for facts to come in before politicizing and exploiting this situation for your own beliefs.  It's a terrible situation that should never have happened.  Let's get to the issue of why it happened and what could have been done to prevent it.  I think it's best to wait for facts to come in to be able to do that with a clear mind.  Emotional reactions aren't always the best and most thought out reactions.  Just saying.

no, because even if this is a case where someone purchased these illegally it's still fucking insane to think someone can purchase a weapon meant for combat legally in this country.  whether this event happened or not it's still insane we allow those type of guns to be obtained by citizens.  so no let's politicize the fucker now.

it's just not gun laws. it's gun culture in the US. it's mental health services in the US. it's veteran treatment after they come home from war in the US. it's multi-faceted. screaming "gun control" after every mass shooting does nothing to open dialogue. blaming all gun enthusiasts after every mass shooting does nothing but shuts down the conversation. 

it seems everything in the US is black and white to so many people, and if you don't agree with my opinion, you are a "stupid asshole". yeah, that's going to get shit changed. 

this isn't trump's fault, either. his response was typical of his "only brown people can be terrorists" bullshit, so that's not a surprise. but it's not on him. it's not on the NRA. it's not on anyone but the american voting public who are so apathetic they don't vote for real change. people have the power to make change, and they sit on their hands. 

one shooting in Australia and they make all guns illegal and the general public agrees and no shootings since. of course, the US isn't Australia. But it's not irreversible. change CAN happen. but it's up to the people. 

tbergs said:

dignin said:

tempo_n_groove said:

dignin said:

tbergs said:

dignin said:

vaggar99 said:

to the people who vote for politicians who consistently vote against gun control: THIS IS ON YOU

I agree. Blood on their hands.

I get what you're saying, but it's not really that simple. I doubt most people truly look at a politicians stance on every issue and most times are balancing the importance of the issues that directly impact them. Many don't think they are contributing to gun violence, but I don't necessarily agree that it is blood on their hands.

You're also viewing it from a liberal lens. Conversatives generally are pro life and would say the same thing to those supporting a pro choice politician. 

I'm totally okay with aiding and abetting a pro-choice candidate. I am complicit in abortions. If I have blood on my hands for being pro-choice I'm at peace with that. 

Can a pro gun nut say the same thing about being okay with being complicit in a mass shooting? And if you vote for these guys, you are pro gun. They wear it with pride.

That's ridiculous. Nobody is complicit about a mass shooting. I'm pro gun but abhor any killing/suicides involving a firearm.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

Pro gun people have more blood on their hands today.

There's a difference between pro gun and anti gun control. The anti gun control supporters are the ones with blood on their hands here.

A difference? Yes, I agree. But just varying degrees of guilt.

And for the record, I'm not emotional right now. Just stating my long held beliefs.

rgambs said:

Jason P said:

That sounded like an automatic weapon that would lay down ground cover for advancing troops in a war zone.

It did, the one burst of shots goes on for a very long time for an automatic, with such high fire rate the rounds are usually fired within a few seconds...whatever was being shot, there were hundreds of rounds between reloads.

I just can't believe he was able to get all of that stuff up to his room on the 32nd floor. Large duffel bag after large duffel bag of ammo and guns. Fucking sadistic. Can you imagine the shell casings pile and the set up he had to do this? Unreal.

In the meantime, some Hollywood exec is contemplating how to make this in to a "based on actual events" movie.

Did a pastor write Trump's speech for this press conference? 

pjhawks said:

mattsl1983 said:

So we don't know if these guns were obtained legally.  Automatic guns are extremely hard and expensive to obtain legally.  I support the 2nd amendment.  I have zero blood on my hands.  If you support illegal immigration and an illegal immigrant kills someone, does that mean you have blood on your hands?  Some of these responses are so out there and are just knee jerk reactions.  "Ban the guns!"  "This wouldn't happen if guns were illegal!". My question will be once the facts come in, and if these guns were obtained illegally, how would changing gun laws prevented this?  If the gun was already illegal and obtained illegally then would one more law have made the person stop and say, "oh jeez, I was okay with breaking this law and shooting a bunch of people, but now that they passed this new law, I just don't want to risk it."

At least wait for facts to come in before politicizing and exploiting this situation for your own beliefs.  It's a terrible situation that should never have happened.  Let's get to the issue of why it happened and what could have been done to prevent it.  I think it's best to wait for facts to come in to be able to do that with a clear mind.  Emotional reactions aren't always the best and most thought out reactions.  Just saying.

no, because even if this is a case where someone purchased these illegally it's still fucking insane to think someone can purchase a weapon meant for combat legally in this country.  whether this event happened or not it's still insane we allow those type of guns to be obtained by citizens.  so no let's politicize the fucker now.

So you are going to attack someone's rights, that if they can pass the extensive background check, that has nothing to do with what happened?  Should we ban alcohol because a minor gets his hands on some and drives drunk and kills someone?