Only 2 Drummers Get In? RnRHOF. Merged

mcgruff10 said:

KV4053 said:

ledvedderman said:

tbergs said:

KV4053 said:

mcgruff10 said:

tbergs said:

vaggar99 said:

whitepants said:

Happy New Year all!

I'm just going to chime in that the decision has been made which drummers are going to be inducted into the Hall of Fame with Pearl Jam, and I think the two selected are the right ones, period. I feel bad for Dave A, but his public begging has been embarrassing and providing proof as to why he was not selected to be included. He needs to get on with life and be well. His contribution to the band will never be forgotten, but he ain't getting inducted into the RNRHoF.

all i'll say to that is that the band was extremely lucky to get Jack Irons as a replacement. He was able to carry the band into making 5 classic albums in a row. Cameron is great, but never has been able to add that sort of 'tick tock' the band needs in the studio to make their songs shine.

Really? So you don't think anything past Yield shines. Matt drums the shit out of all their albums. Binaural and especially Riot Act and Self Titled shine all around besides a few songs. I'm not a huge fan of Backspacer and Lightning Bolt, but that has nothing to do with the drumming. Matt brings Got Some and MYM to the table.

the first five albums are classics. you have to admit after yield their studio albums definitely went down hill.

Pfffttt Riot Act is their best album lyrically

I don't feel that way. I love No Code and Yield, but Binaural is their masterpiece to me. I know I'm in the minority on that. Both No Code and Yield fizzle out near the end. Everything after Present Tense I could skip. Yield is the same after DTE, except In Hiding and ATY. I'd skip less songs on RA and Self Titled combined.

I'm with you all the way, man. Well, I'd add Low Light onto meaningful Yield songs but Binaural was easily their most creative and diverse recording session. Just think of the album, the Lost Dogs, Drifting and Strangest Tribe, and stuff from Anything In Between. Lyrically it's their best as well. Whatever broke Ed's writers block from those session sure opened the flood gates. Between Binaural, Riot Act and much of Ukulele Songs, 2000-2002 was an awesome time for fans of PJ lyrics.

We should takeover this thread and make it all about the best lyrics (and Angel won't be on anyone's best lyrics list I'm sure)

I was row 8 (very good fan club #) in front of stone at fenway and couldn't believe how few of the "hardcore" fans knew that song. Literally no one was singing it around me.

That's why the "Just A Girl" petition has me baffled. Why waste a song when there are so many better ones that don't get played enough. I understand the nostalgia, but it isn't a good song.

Anyway, I digress. Back to whining about drummers!

ledvedderman said:

You had me until the Fatal comment. That's a great song.

A lot of these could be addressed though if they would do an acoustic tour. I think that's the problem with some of the rare songs we want to hear, they're better suited for a more intimate atmosphere.

But back to the thread, Dave is a baby.

Agreed on the first comment. LOL on the second.

RIVAL!?!?! That guitar is incredible!

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

This thread being merged and all is a giant shitshow all because of one drummer.
Pearl Jam is who they are now and will be inducted as they are now.

Except that's now how the RRoF claims to induct bands/people. They induct them based on the impact and influence they've had. Pearl Jam had the biggest influence and biggest impact during their first 3 albums. If they started at No Code or started at Binaural they don't get in. They're getting in because of the big impact they had (one of the biggest rock bands of all time.. at least in respect to sales of their first 3 albums) I would think it was a foregone conclusion that PJ would be inducted at 25 years regardless of whether or not Matt picked up the drums for Binaural. They had already cemented an epic enough legacy to get inducted by 1998. A band doesn't have to be together or be alive at 25 years to be inducted. Nirvana got inducted with only two big/impactful albums. Pearl Jam would of gotten inducted whether or not they kept going. They'd done enough by the time Yield came out.

Kiss and Journey have the opposite issues. As per my argument above it's supposed to be about the influence and impact of a band. Something that's usually a result of their biggest and most influential albums. KISS was pissed that it's new members didn't get inducted. Journey isn't happy the new singer didn't get inducted. I agree with the decisions. KISS hasn't made anything influential with the new members (Even though the new members have been in the band for over 10 years). Journey hasn't come anywhere to making something legendary with the new guy. He sounds like the original singer, but he's filling up arenas singing someone elses songs.

At the heart of the argument I agree with the RRoF. Their criteria is to induct the musicians that had an impact. Inducting the ones that come late and didn't perform on the albums that made them influential. As we've seen with these older touring bands it often becomes a rotating crew of replacement musicians. Not everyone should get inducted. Could you imagine if all the replacements in GNR had got inducted.. lol.

I suppose the problem is the RRHOF is a bit inconsistent with implementation. I still agree with the heart of the argument.

Dave A. drummed on two of the three epic PJ albums. The big ones. The ones that were so epic/huge the masses knew who they were. Ask an average joe to name a Pearl Jam song and most of the time it'll be Alive or Even Flow. Sometimes you'll even get a daughter or betterman, but you'll never get a light years.. lol

In short I disagree and I think the heart of how the RRoF usually nominates disagrees. They don't nominate a band based on who they are now. They nominate a band on the impact/influcence they've had. Something I believe Dave A. was a big part of. I think the RRHoF missed the mark on this one. I suppose Dave A. could of stayed quiet and taken his lumps, but he has the right to be vocal about it (Even if he paints himself in a negative light).

People say there was nothing PJ could of done about it, but there is. They could ask, try and change minds. The 90's PJ might have boycotted all together. It was only last year they boycotted an entire state. Maybe they don't have the fight in them for this one, because of the way they let him go in the first place. Not a battle they want to fight.

It's Stones fault...

People really overrate Dave as an influence on the two records he drummed on and especially overrate him as a drummer in general. Had Matt been the drummer on the first three albums, the songs would have very likely ended up the same way. The thesis statement above mentions Alive, Daughter, Evenflow and Betterman...all of which would have been a hit no matter who was drumming. No one hears those songs and thinks, "Wow. This drummer makes this song whole". It's the music, melody and lyrics that make them catchy. Sorry Dave. I could have drummed on those (and I'm terrible) and they would have been hit songs. Only difference is, twenty plus years later I wouldn't be bitching about it online like I'm some amazing drummer when I'm a hack who hasn't been able to land a legit gig since my time in Pearl Jam.

:grimacing:

Dave A was just in the right place at the right time. Im sure any other decent drummer could of done the same thing with Pearl Jam that he did. Why make a big deal over it anyways? The RnRHOF is kind of a joke. Im just looking forward to watching Pearl Jam perform that night and thats pretty much it.