America's Gun Violence

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

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PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

mcgruff10 said:

show previous quotes

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

amen dirty. that's some good stuff right there.

muskydan said:

show previous quotes

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

Oh yeah, when is the last time you spoke to or knew anything about that poor kid in Chicago you mentioned? Trust me, they could care less on what you think is best for them let alone how a kid is brought up in Wenatchee WA. When will tax paying society realize that the inner city "poor Black kid" doesn't want to be changed and loves their environment. Ever hear the term "keeping it real"?

I am all about legalizing some drugs, but the hard drugs cannot ever be legalized

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

show previous quotes

muskydan said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

Oh yeah, when is the last time you spoke to or knew anything about that poor kid in Chicago you mentioned? Trust me, they could care less on what you think is best for them let alone how a kid is brought up in Wenatchee WA. When will tax paying society realize that the inner city "poor Black kid" doesn't want to be changed and loves their environment. Ever hear the term "keeping it real"?

I am all about legalizing some drugs, but the hard drugs cannot ever be legalized

Musky...

I haven't talked to any poor kid in Chicago. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to determine that without a decent upbringing, a kid stands a slim chance at best for 'making it'. Are you trying to tell me that there are tons of opportunities for the youth sector in the poorer sections of Chicago? Are you trying to tell me that Saturdays in Chicago look like Saturdays in Wenatchee - mini vans at soccer fields with nuclear families watching young children chase a soccer ball around... followed by a trip to the ice cream parlor?

Poor housing, poor paying jobs, not a lot of poor paying jobs, poor youth programs, poor recreational opportunities, rampant violence that has established itself as the norm given the aforementioned conditions, broken families as a result of the rampant violence...

What's left? The situation I picture- given your descriptions that you seem to be denying at the moment- parallels the opportunities Mexico offers its youth: go work for nothing in agriculture, resorts, or, say, the police department or military... or go work for a cartel where chicks, cars, drugs, parties, and all those fun things await a guy.

Incredulously, you're like the guy that kicks a kitten everytime you see it... and then curse it when it hisses at you- wondering what it's problem is. You can't be so daft to ignore the fact that the entire country is complicit in the conditions you deplore. The problem is not a result of a demographic of people simple inclined to be that way as you consistently suggest.

mickeyrat said:

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Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

callen said:

mickeyrat said:

so a license and a car are a right? is that right? musta missed that in reading the bill of rights.

The right to not have another human being impede on your freedom! Being able to force you to do something. Take your time. Resources And that of the police. Directed by government, politicians!

The government and police indirectly directed by the people.

Man, Callen... you talk of living in fear... yet here you oppose routine traffic stops that are placed with the safety of the general public in mind.

If they start stopping cars to discover your political affiliations... let us know and we can have a discussion. Right now... they are trying to make a presence to deter drunks from killing our children- hardly something to frown upon.

then sell your car callen. be free from government overreach and tyranny.

mace1229 said:

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callen said:

Degeneratefk said:

callen said:

Degeneratefk said:

callen said:

eddiec said:

mace1229 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

F**k.

Alcohol kills people at times. This is true. Fat kills people too. So does a sedentary lifestyle. Don't forget the f**king sun too- bastard star that strikes us with cancer. And cars... the big comparison for gun strokers.

Big f**king deal. None of the above items have been designed for the purpose of killing things. Every death that results from the discharge of a firearm marks an event where the gun- as a tool- has performed admirably and served its purpose exactly as designed.

Stop trying to weakly validate guns and their rightful place in society by comparing them to esophagus sized wieners that people choke on and the like. If gun lovers would just say, "F**k you guys. I f**king love my military style assault rifle and shooting the shit out of my empty beer cans up at the landfill. You'll have to pry my 'fancy' gun from my cold dead hands before I give up shooting beer cans at the landfill... f**kers"... I'd have more respect.

Stop trying to convince intelligent people that there is a reasonable argument. There is not. It's not even close. It's not even remotely close. But as I said... most people aren't very smart and most people are very selfish: gun lovers do not need to fear having their guns taken from them. Instead, they can continue to fear hostile governments with devious plans and home invaders that are plotting an invasion of their home likely at this minute.

In my first post I said I wasn't trying to win anyone over. And I did say I shoot oranges and apples that are rotting at my parents orchard and hope to never shoot at anything else. More fun than empty beer cans, and it even helps with the compost.

I was merely pointing out all the attention that guns receive and a major topic at every debate. Why not spend some of that focus on something that kills even more, like drunk driving? Alcohol may not be designed to kill, but more innocent children die from drunk drivers than as a result from a homicide where a gun was used regardless of that fact. Alcohol is designed to impair judgment, and every time someone gets into a car and kills a 5 year old child because they were drunk and couldn't make the right judgment, the alcohol "has performed admirably and served its purpose exactly as designed." What difference does the purpose make? I think a ban on alcohol is extreme, but when was the last time you heard any politician talk about reducing DUI's? But they can't talk for 5 minutes without bringing up guns.

We can agree on one thing at least....That Bastard Star of ours!

When people see a DUI checkpoint most people are glad the law is being enforced (except for the idiot who had too many and decided to drive).

If police enforced gun laws like they do alcohol laws people would bitch that they are trying to take their guns away.

And Most people are sheep. I don't want to live in a police state and NO human has the right to impead my travels on public lands.

Are you serious? So you're against random checkpoints in high DUI areas? That's far from living in a police state.

And yes, the police do have the right to impede your travel if you are driving by car. A license isn't a right.

Are you serious about living in a place where the police can stop you at anytime and fuck with you??? REALLY? Like in China and North Korea?

Cops pull everyone over Into a Church parking lot, file them through check point. Herding the sheep. And many just say bahhhhhh.

Fk that.

and the dwi thing so many are willing to give up their liberty, there's already an avenue, .."probable cause".

............fk imagine being a minority in fkn South Carolina coming up to a road block.

I've never said racism doesn't still exist, especially in my,state. I've never been through a checkpoint and been "herded" through a parking lot. Every single time ive been through one, the entire process took no more than 5 minutes. Seems like a small price to pay in an effort to decrease DUIs. But what do I know? I've only been a fireman for 13 years. I guess I haven't seen enough death yet directly caused by impaired driving.

Horrible price to pay. Giving up your rights as a free human.

I don't see how this is giving up a right. Driving is not a right, it requires a license. That also requires time, going to the DMV, paperwork, etc. Is giving yup an afternoon to go to the DMV taking away your human rights too? In many states by having a driver's license you are granting permission to perform alcohol tests. I have never even been asked to exit my vehicle when at a DUI checkpoint.
They simply ask 1 or 2 questions and wave me on. And as others have pointed out if you don't wish to agree to that, no one is forcing you to drive.

callen said:

show previous quotes

mickeyrat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

callen said:

mickeyrat said:

so a license and a car are a right? is that right? musta missed that in reading the bill of rights.

The right to not have another human being impede on your freedom! Being able to force you to do something. Take your time. Resources And that of the police. Directed by government, politicians!

The government and police indirectly directed by the people.

Man, Callen... you talk of living in fear... yet here you oppose routine traffic stops that are placed with the safety of the general public in mind.

If they start stopping cars to discover your political affiliations... let us know and we can have a discussion. Right now... they are trying to make a presence to deter drunks from killing our children- hardly something to frown upon.

then sell your car callen. be free from government overreach and tyranny.

show previous quotes

mace1229 said:

callen said:

Degeneratefk said:

callen said:

Degeneratefk said:

callen said:

eddiec said:

mace1229 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

F**k.

Alcohol kills people at times. This is true. Fat kills people too. So does a sedentary lifestyle. Don't forget the f**king sun too- bastard star that strikes us with cancer. And cars... the big comparison for gun strokers.

Big f**king deal. None of the above items have been designed for the purpose of killing things. Every death that results from the discharge of a firearm marks an event where the gun- as a tool- has performed admirably and served its purpose exactly as designed.

Stop trying to weakly validate guns and their rightful place in society by comparing them to esophagus sized wieners that people choke on and the like. If gun lovers would just say, "F**k you guys. I f**king love my military style assault rifle and shooting the shit out of my empty beer cans up at the landfill. You'll have to pry my 'fancy' gun from my cold dead hands before I give up shooting beer cans at the landfill... f**kers"... I'd have more respect.

Stop trying to convince intelligent people that there is a reasonable argument. There is not. It's not even close. It's not even remotely close. But as I said... most people aren't very smart and most people are very selfish: gun lovers do not need to fear having their guns taken from them. Instead, they can continue to fear hostile governments with devious plans and home invaders that are plotting an invasion of their home likely at this minute.

In my first post I said I wasn't trying to win anyone over. And I did say I shoot oranges and apples that are rotting at my parents orchard and hope to never shoot at anything else. More fun than empty beer cans, and it even helps with the compost.

I was merely pointing out all the attention that guns receive and a major topic at every debate. Why not spend some of that focus on something that kills even more, like drunk driving? Alcohol may not be designed to kill, but more innocent children die from drunk drivers than as a result from a homicide where a gun was used regardless of that fact. Alcohol is designed to impair judgment, and every time someone gets into a car and kills a 5 year old child because they were drunk and couldn't make the right judgment, the alcohol "has performed admirably and served its purpose exactly as designed." What difference does the purpose make? I think a ban on alcohol is extreme, but when was the last time you heard any politician talk about reducing DUI's? But they can't talk for 5 minutes without bringing up guns.

We can agree on one thing at least....That Bastard Star of ours!

When people see a DUI checkpoint most people are glad the law is being enforced (except for the idiot who had too many and decided to drive).

If police enforced gun laws like they do alcohol laws people would bitch that they are trying to take their guns away.

And Most people are sheep. I don't want to live in a police state and NO human has the right to impead my travels on public lands.

Are you serious? So you're against random checkpoints in high DUI areas? That's far from living in a police state.

And yes, the police do have the right to impede your travel if you are driving by car. A license isn't a right.

Are you serious about living in a place where the police can stop you at anytime and fuck with you??? REALLY? Like in China and North Korea?

Cops pull everyone over Into a Church parking lot, file them through check point. Herding the sheep. And many just say bahhhhhh.

Fk that.

and the dwi thing so many are willing to give up their liberty, there's already an avenue, .."probable cause".

............fk imagine being a minority in fkn South Carolina coming up to a road block.

I've never said racism doesn't still exist, especially in my,state. I've never been through a checkpoint and been "herded" through a parking lot. Every single time ive been through one, the entire process took no more than 5 minutes. Seems like a small price to pay in an effort to decrease DUIs. But what do I know? I've only been a fireman for 13 years. I guess I haven't seen enough death yet directly caused by impaired driving.

Horrible price to pay. Giving up your rights as a free human.

I don't see how this is giving up a right. Driving is not a right, it requires a license. That also requires time, going to the DMV, paperwork, etc. Is giving yup an afternoon to go to the DMV taking away your human rights too? In many states by having a driver's license you are granting permission to perform alcohol tests. I have never even been asked to exit my vehicle when at a DUI checkpoint.
They simply ask 1 or 2 questions and wave me on. And as others have pointed out if you don't wish to agree to that, no one is forcing you to drive.

You don't see because you aren't seeing g the real problem. And are willing to give up your rights so easily.

This had nothing to do with DWI's. This has nothing to do with licenses or what society deems necessary prior to allowing someone to drive 2 tons of steal at 70MPH.

This has to do with being okay with the government to stop you and detain you for no reason. To allow yourself to be arrested. Fuck that.



Think people think.

mcgruff10 said:

show previous quotes

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Degeneratefk said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

muskydan said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

Oh yeah, when is the last time you spoke to or knew anything about that poor kid in Chicago you mentioned? Trust me, they could care less on what you think is best for them let alone how a kid is brought up in Wenatchee WA. When will tax paying society realize that the inner city "poor Black kid" doesn't want to be changed and loves their environment. Ever hear the term "keeping it real"?

I am all about legalizing some drugs, but the hard drugs cannot ever be legalized

Musky...

I haven't talked to any poor kid in Chicago. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to determine that without a decent upbringing, a kid stands a slim chance at best for 'making it'. Are you trying to tell me that there are tons of opportunities for the youth sector in the poorer sections of Chicago? Are you trying to tell me that Saturdays in Chicago look like Saturdays in Wenatchee - mini vans at soccer fields with nuclear families watching young children chase a soccer ball around... followed by a trip to the ice cream parlor?

Poor housing, poor paying jobs, not a lot of poor paying jobs, poor youth programs, poor recreational opportunities, rampant violence that has established itself as the norm given the aforementioned conditions, broken families as a result of the rampant violence...

What's left? The situation I picture- given your descriptions that you seem to be denying at the moment- parallels the opportunities Mexico offers its youth: go work for nothing in agriculture, resorts, or, say, the police department or military... or go work for a cartel where chicks, cars, drugs, parties, and all those fun things await a guy.

Incredulously, you're like the guy that kicks a kitten everytime you see it... and then curse it when it hisses at you- wondering what it's problem is. You can't be so daft to ignore the fact that the entire country is complicit in the conditions you deplore. The problem is not a result of a demographic of people simple inclined to be that way as you consistently suggest.

It was my understanding that there would be no dictionaries needed in this discussion. I kid.

Well said.

Lol.

Sorry. I go too far sometimes trying to sound really 'fancy' (like an AR15 Scruffy... lol).

Love my ar 15! Hopefully getting a new .22 soon. Maybe I ll start you with that when we go to the range.
But you do make excellent points. Musky just seems very angry.

mcgruff10 said:

show previous quotes

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

mcgruff10 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Degeneratefk said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

muskydan said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

PJPOWER said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Bottom line: more guns equals more deaths by guns.

The US has the most guns per capita by far... and correspondingly... more gun deaths by far.

Per capita of course (on edit).

That is interesting. The fact that there are millions of guns in TX means that every city should have a higher rate of gun deaths than Chicago, Detroit, other places where gun rights are restricted...right? Gun shows should be bloodbaths because there are a ton of guns there, right?
Wonder what the correlation is to the rise in violent media access and acceptance? Seems like desensitization may have a more direct correlation. How has the graphically violent media changed over the past few decades?
I know there have been plenty of studies done showing how there is a correlation with children entering puberty faster due to the easy access of explicit material. It would make sense that access to graphic violenct imagery is changing the brain of this generation as well.

If your last statement is true... then it would be true in other countries as well; however, other countries- outside of impoverished, relatively lawless, war shows- don't even come remotely close to the US for the deaths by firearms.

You've got a gun problem. Are you denying this?

How do their systems of education and media compare? Serious question as I truly have not traveled abroad much. Sounds like impoverishment and lawlessness may be contributing factors. I would add that depression, anxiety, violent media, gang culture, poor parenting skills have more effect on murder rates and suicides than simply owning a firearm. Maybe other countries are doing something right in those categories?
I'll agree that the gun industry has gone crazy over the past few years and feel that our "leader's" approach to the issue is somewhat to blame. All that has been accomplished by the notion of tighter regulations is more gun sales. Less stigma associated with mental health issues, more crack down of gangs, proper parenting and discipline, better education systems would all assist in curbing violence.
Are deaths by firearms in situations of self/home defense factored into your statistics of "firearm deaths" or are you just talking about mass shootings? I welcome higher rates of gun deaths if it means more people are protecting themselves from burglars/rapists and the like. These "statistics" that are always thrown out are nearly always scewed one way or another...

In my opinion, the one variable that differs between the US and other developed countries that complicates the gun problem is the disparity between rich and poor.

The US seems to have a 'dog eat dog' attitude where many people resist social programs that might have the chance to help those that struggle due to their circumstances. I don't want to hear someone say that a black kid born in the poor side of Chicago has just as much chance as a white kid born in, say, Wenatchee, WA.

Take care of your people. Heal them with decent medical programs and educate them with a quality public education system. That's going to mean money and, ultimately, taxes (seemingly a dirty word for Americans).

If people feel as if they are meaningful... I think they are less likely to develop animosity, feel hopeless, and resort to killing others.

Oh yeah... legalize drugs and remove those homicides from the equation.

Oh yeah, when is the last time you spoke to or knew anything about that poor kid in Chicago you mentioned? Trust me, they could care less on what you think is best for them let alone how a kid is brought up in Wenatchee WA. When will tax paying society realize that the inner city "poor Black kid" doesn't want to be changed and loves their environment. Ever hear the term "keeping it real"?

I am all about legalizing some drugs, but the hard drugs cannot ever be legalized

Musky...

I haven't talked to any poor kid in Chicago. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to determine that without a decent upbringing, a kid stands a slim chance at best for 'making it'. Are you trying to tell me that there are tons of opportunities for the youth sector in the poorer sections of Chicago? Are you trying to tell me that Saturdays in Chicago look like Saturdays in Wenatchee - mini vans at soccer fields with nuclear families watching young children chase a soccer ball around... followed by a trip to the ice cream parlor?

Poor housing, poor paying jobs, not a lot of poor paying jobs, poor youth programs, poor recreational opportunities, rampant violence that has established itself as the norm given the aforementioned conditions, broken families as a result of the rampant violence...

What's left? The situation I picture- given your descriptions that you seem to be denying at the moment- parallels the opportunities Mexico offers its youth: go work for nothing in agriculture, resorts, or, say, the police department or military... or go work for a cartel where chicks, cars, drugs, parties, and all those fun things await a guy.

Incredulously, you're like the guy that kicks a kitten everytime you see it... and then curse it when it hisses at you- wondering what it's problem is. You can't be so daft to ignore the fact that the entire country is complicit in the conditions you deplore. The problem is not a result of a demographic of people simple inclined to be that way as you consistently suggest.

It was my understanding that there would be no dictionaries needed in this discussion. I kid.

Well said.

Lol.

Sorry. I go too far sometimes trying to sound really 'fancy' (like an AR15 Scruffy... lol).

Love my ar 15! Hopefully getting a new .22 soon. Maybe I ll start you with that when we go to the range.
But you do make excellent points. Musky just seems very angry.

I grew up with a .22. I want to fire that bad boy.

(Then I want to come on here and talk down to people who live firing their guns lol!)

are semi auto .22 rifle's hard to get in canada?