What's a living wage?

unsung · December 2013

Let's just pay everyone no matter what their job title or education $500/hr. Everyone is rich.

What could possibly go wrong? :roll:

lukin2006 · December 2013

unsung wrote:

Let's just pay everyone no matter what their job title or education $500/hr. Everyone is rich.

What could possibly go wrong? :roll:

:fp: :fp: :fp:

Hugh Freaking Dillon · December 2013

lukin2006 wrote:

unsung wrote:

Let's just pay everyone no matter what their job title or education $500/hr. Everyone is rich.

What could possibly go wrong? :roll:

:fp: :fp: :fp:

I second that and raise you a :roll:

Jason P · December 2013

lukin2006 wrote:

here's the problem as I see it ... the people at Wal Mart or Mc Donalds working on the front lines are more important to those business's than many people higher up, they may not have a skill with a college degree. I would counter that the front line workers in the service industry contribute more to the success of their business than a dude in marketing or accounting at said business.

in Canada living wage should be set at between 15-20 an hour ... I have no idea how someone survives off 10.25 an hour in Ontario where I live, not to mention places like Toronto, I suspect many visit the food bank.

$20/hr is how much I made an hour after getting an engineering degree a decade ago.

Now that I think about it is even more because I was salary and working around 60 hours a week.

puremagic · December 2013

unsung wrote:

Be specific. How much should someone who has no skills other than assembling a Big Mac earn?

You can't be this naive. You make an assumption that these people are only mentally capable of working at a fast food place. Throughout your postings, not once do you offer any discussion as to options or opportunities that are available to the average faces working in fast food places. You need to pay attention to some of the unemployment #s; they’re acceptable because people are taking part-time jobs, fast food jobs, seasonal jobs, jobs that offer a paycheck not a living wage.

As someone posted – what advance skill set does it take to be a trash collector or postal delivery person that is not possessed by many of the workers at a fast food place? NONE. The difference between the trash collector and the postal worker wages vs. the fast food worker wages is their UNION.

Yet, if things keep going the way of Wisconsin, State union workers, will soon be just as dependent on supplemental social welfare programs as fast food workers and military families.

As another person posted – is the Wal-Mart practice that maintains the bulk of its workers at poverty-level wages which makes Wal-Mart workers eligible for social welfare programs while allowing Wal-Mart to forego having to pay full or partial benefit packages to these workers fair to the taxpayer, NO. Yet, instead of going after Wal-Mart (too big to fail) we go after the people trying to earn legitimate wages.

Hugh Freaking Dillon · December 2013

puremagic wrote:

unsung wrote:

Be specific. How much should someone who has no skills other than assembling a Big Mac earn?

You can't be this naive.

correct. he's not. he's trolling again. he must be bored.

Last-12-Exit · December 2013

lukin2006 wrote:

here's the problem as I see it ... the people at Wal Mart or Mc Donalds working on the front lines are more important to those business's than many people higher up, they may not have a skill with a college degree. I would counter that the front line workers in the service industry contribute more to the success of their business than a dude in marketing or accounting at said business.

in Canada living wage should be set at between 15-20 an hour ... I have no idea how someone survives off 10.25 an hour in Ontario where I live, not to mention places like Toronto, I suspect many visit the food bank.

The workers that manufacture goods are way more important than the people who sell them.

Vitalogensia · December 2013

I have a friend who was working as an endoscopy technician. Several times she had her hands inside someone, where one wrong move meant possibly puncturing someone's bowels. She was paid between $10-12 an hour. Thought I'd throw that out there for pondering.

Cosmo · December 2013

unsung wrote:

Let's be honest, corporate fat cats are going to get their cut no matter what. It's irrelevant if their minions make $5/hr or $50/hr, they won't suffer.

Yes I do believe that someone that has invested in themselves should earn more than someone who is 40 and flips burgers part time. I don't think of them as lesser humans, but they don't have skills, and their pay directly reflects that.

If Walmart offered $1/hr would people work there?

If Walmart offered $5/hr would people work there?

So Walmart offers $8/hr (fed min wage iirc) and the jobs fill.

But why? Why does $8 get what $5 can't? Because that's what they can get away with by law. People take those jobs because they know that's all that has to be offered. But I'm asking what if. What if there were no min wage? I think we can agree that nobody would work for $1/hr. What if people held out together for $10/hr? Guess what, Walmart would be forced to pay it. The way it works now all they have to do is offer the min and say take it or leave it.

If there were no min wage the employees would have the bargaining chip because they could hold out for better pay. With the min wage the company has the power, and feels that's all they have to offer. The market works better for the worker when the worker is holding the cards.

...
Can I ask... What do you do for a living?
Why can't your company... the entire market slash your high wages and hire some that is capable of doing your job... for a lot less money?
I am certain that you are not at the top of your field and there are many others willing to wdo the same work.. for less pay.

Gern Blansten · December 2013

I always find these arguments interesting.

As if it's really harder to drive a truck, pick up garbage, be a meter maid, etc. than it is to work at McDonald's and be good at what you do.

This economy demands that some people simply take what they can get. It's pathetic that someone could conceivably work two full time jobs at minimum wage and still only make $29,000/year.

mickeyrat · December 2013

unsung wrote:

Eh, I'm against a minimum wage, and I don't see how someone who can't survive on min wage will find $1400 a year before taxes to be the amount that brings them above the line.

Min wage is that for a reason, they have no skills, why do they deserve to be paid so much when all they can do is wash dishes?

this assumes an awful lot about an employee. what about no experience to start? umm, HS diploma only or GED or neither of those? None of that means someone isnt capable of doing more that what you suggest which I know wasnt a blanket statement.

mickeyrat · December 2013

Gern Blansten wrote:

I always find these arguments interesting.

As if it's really harder to drive a truck, pick up garbage, be a meter maid, etc. than it is to work at McDonald's and be good at what you do.

This economy demands that some people simply take what they can get. It's pathetic that someone could conceivably work two full time jobs at minimum wage and still only make $29,000/year.

stress level with 4 wheelers, myriad fed regulations, paperwork, map reading trip planning, being constantly aware of all sides of the vehicle while soccer mom with her kids in the car cuts you off while she putting on makeup and texting her girlfriends. Backing a 70 foot long articulated vehicle in a spot that just barely fits that trailer from an angle while 4 wheelers cut behind you. Oh lets not forget the deer that seem to really like the grass at the roadside.

fuck just working within the federal hours of service rules is a task in itself!!!!

11 hrs driving within a 14 hour time frame and at or before 8 hours of onduty/driving status you must take a 30 min break.must take 10 hours offduty for rest before driving again, allowed to restart your 70 hr in 8 days clock with a min of 34 hours offduty that includes two time periods of 0100 to 0500. if you can tget your restart in then you recap your hours. meaning the hours you were considered on duty including driving 9 days ago would be regained today. etc etc etc, delays at shippers and receivers who dont give a flying fuck that you only have so much time left to find a place to park. Oh and dont idle that truck ,driver, if its hot you have the side vents open for air and get to smell the baked in urine smell and human feces in plastic shopping bag that fat fuck who was too lazy to even find the trash can so he threw it on the ground

AlOT of knowledge needs to be readily recalled from memory upon inspection which should occur daily both pre and post trip.

the driving forward part is the easy part.

Jason P · December 2013

Being a meter maid requires a heart as black as coal and a hatred for fellow humanity. :geek:

Gern Blansten · December 2013

Don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking truck drivers.

I guess in my mind I was picturing someone driving a Staples delivery truck rather than long haul trucking but I think you get my point.

I've worked in fast food. I'm currently a CPA with my own business. There are shitty fast food workers and great workers. Shitty truck drivers and great truck drivers, shitty CPAs and great ones, etc.

I can tell you though from some of the tax returns I've done that some long haul drivers get screwed. Long hours and not much net pay once all expenses are paid. Again...not in all cases. I've seen some do very well.

mickeyrat · December 2013

Gern Blansten wrote:

Don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking truck drivers.

I guess in my mind I was picturing someone driving a Staples delivery truck rather than long haul trucking but I think you get my point.

I've worked in fast food. I'm currently a CPA with my own business. There are shitty fast food workers and great workers. Shitty truck drivers and great truck drivers, shitty CPAs and great ones, etc.

I can tell you though from some of the tax returns I've done that some long haul drivers get screwed. Long hours and not much net pay once all expenses are paid. Again...not in all cases. I've seen some do very well.

depends on how diligent a driver is. I need to find a good cpa myself for tax time. have saved some receipts, am home mostly daily so I can only claim so many days full per diem and so many days partial in addition to the receipts I have saved.

Yes drivers get screwed over often and hard. coming going and any way in between.

Question for you,. best search criteria for a good tax preparer that has knowledge of transportation? How should I word the search?

Gern Blansten · December 2013

Honestly the best thing to do is ask your friends or fellow truck drivers. I would think that most CPAs have a pretty good grasp of the transportation industry....but definitely ask them if they are familiar with it and using per diem rates, etc.

mickeyrat · December 2013

Gern Blansten wrote:

Honestly the best thing to do is ask your friends or fellow truck drivers. I would think that most CPAs have a pretty good grasp of the transportation industry....but definitely ask them if they are familiar with it and using per diem rates, etc.

biggest headache is going to be going through my logs to find the out of town in the truck days. I halfheartedly tried to keep a journal. to no avail!!

unsung · December 2013

Walmart welcomes a min wage hike, because it will kill the small business competition.

http://reason.com/blog/2013/12/03/why-w ... in-dcs-min

brianlux · December 2013

Another way to look at this would be for us to stop supporting toxic fast "food" road kill "restaurants" and reduce our frivolous spending in general and specifically cease our purchasing of cheap worthless plastic shit from places like Walmart and put more people to work doing something useful. And, of course, at the very least, pay everyone a living wage.

People will say, "But the poor need places like Walmart." I disagree. Durable items last longer, impact the planet less and cost less in the long run. Let's teach people how to shop wisely and responsibly. We don't need no stinkin' Walmart!

unsung · December 2013

I agree with all of that except the mandatory living wage, but because I believe the market would fix the wage situation.

Kudos for being the only person to at least offer a living wage number.

Of course since I'm of the opposite thought I'm a troll. Ah labels, the sign that the argument is lost.

I believe our economy would right itself if people demanded quality made in USA goods instead of demanding the cheapest price.

What's a living wage?

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