Noam Chomsky: America is accelerating the apocalypse

polaris_x wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

This is what I'm getting at...

I have no interest in countering any of your points because i believe them to be a) beside my point and b) ground we have already covered. I am not saying that anything you have said in this thread is either correct or incorrect. What I am saying is that it is easy to say that whatever comes next will be better but you have no way to know that for sure. Simply rehashing why you believe the US to be bad does not change that fact.

(I do see that you dropped in earlier that I have issues. Whatever dude.)

then why pose the question then? ... and pose it twice as you weren't happy that no one responded? ... obviously, i have no way of knowing nor you ... but you asked the question ... so, what did you want to hear? ...

are you playing victim too? ... is it not true that you believe i have a prejudicial hatred for america? ... i don't think that's false in any way ... it's well documented ...

polaris_x wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

I posed the question because, as I said, I was curious to hear people's thoughts. That so few have answered it I think shows that it is difficult to answer. I am not particularly interested in your answer because i could have predicted it rather accurately. Was there really any new ground in your answer that we haven't already covered? I don't think so.

But, again, whatever dude.

you're right ... no new ground ... you didn't address them before and you aren't now ...

just know this - you asked a hypothetical question that can only be answered with a hypothetical response ... if my response was predictable - so was yours ... i would have hoped you would have engaged in a dialogue in a discussion you asked for ... twice ... but i guess not ...

JimmyV wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

I am curious, if America is the greatest threat to world peace what do people think the world would look like if the US disappeared tomorrow? Would the world be more or less safe? What nation or nations would fill the vacuum left by the US? Would that nation or nations be better or worse? Would the Middle East find peace?

I don't believe the US is the greatest threat to world peace there is and I don't think there is any guarantee that whatever comes next will be much better. Probably a likelihood that it will be much worse, actually, but I am probably in the minority on that here. So I am curious to hear how people envision a post-American global world.

the world would most definitely be more safe ... and i pose these points for why i believe it to be so:

a) US foreign policy is based strictly on economic imperialism ... this means that while many want to believe the US venture into foreign lands to instill democracy and build hospitals ... that is simply not factual ... incursions into central america and the middle east have all been to ensure US corporations have access to resources ... and in some degree provide "engineering contracts" for companies like haliburton ... is it a coincidence that you get into a war in iraq based on lies then hand out no bid contracts to haliburton and have them overcharge the gov't? ...

b) the military industrial complex ... any country that bases a good chunk of their economy on war profiteering cannot be good for peace ... how do you promote arms sales? ... you create wars and create political instability in regions ... who's arming the "rebels" in Syria? ... known al qaeda operatives? ... that's right the world's biggest purveyor of arms ... the US ...

c) now, if we focus on other threats to peace such as population destabilization ... i could go on about global warming and famine and disease ... but i'm sure many here would simply ignore it ... so, i'll save my fingers the time ...

But doesn't proclaiming that the world would be more safe just assume that whatever nation filled the vacuum created at the top would be better? I think that is a rather large assumption.

JimmyV wrote:

I pointed out that I believe you are making an assumption. You disagreed and trotted out a bunch of stuff that we have already gone over. I have no desire to retread that ground with you. Particularly because this time I don't believe any of it actually rebutted my point.

I'm not putting anyone on foe. If there is a worthwhile discussion to be had I will have it with anyone, you included.

polaris_x wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

I pointed out that I believe you are making an assumption. You disagreed and trotted out a bunch of stuff that we have already gone over. I have no desire to retread that ground with you. Particularly because this time I don't believe any of it actually rebutted my point.

I'm not putting anyone on foe. If there is a worthwhile discussion to be had I will have it with anyone, you included.

again - you asked a hypothetical question that asked for a hypothetical response ... there was no way in answering your question without making an assumption ... all i asked from you is that if you disagreed ... explain to me why ... that is all ...

polaris_x wrote:

if you didn't want to engage in the conversation or with me for that matter ... then don't respond ... but you did and i responded in kind ... saying i make assumptions is absurd that in order to answer your question we all have to ... even in countering it ... all i ask is that you have a rationale for believing other countries would act worse ... i don't think that was too much to ask considering it was your question to begin with ...

polaris_x wrote:

your position was that it would probably be worse ... i don't think i was putting words in your mouth ... if you are going to claim semantics so be it ...

JimmyV wrote:

I don't believe the US is the greatest threat to world peace there is and I don't think there is any guarantee that whatever comes next will be much better. Probably a likelihood that it will be much worse, actually, but I am probably in the minority on that here. So I am curious to hear how people envision a post-American global world.

JimmyV wrote:

I think there is a good chance that it would be. Certainly no guarantee, but a strong possibility.

polaris_x wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

I think there is a good chance that it would be. Certainly no guarantee, but a strong possibility.

so, all i'm asking for is why? ... what is your reasoning? ... if you think it's a strong possibility - you obviously didn't just randomly come to that conclusion ...

PJ_Soul wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

I agree.

Yes, hilarious. :?

polaris_x wrote:

PJ_Soul wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

Yes, hilarious. :?

you did read the posts where i said it was frustrating to hear someone offer an opinion with no rationale only to have someone else say i agree or ditto ... and right on cue ...