Etiquette of Collecting

dimitrispearljam · January 2012

Chrisilein wrote:

pjfan31 wrote:

pjradio wrote:

wow...shorty can post!!!

and some length too...

Maybe we can call him longy....

Off topic, but i like shortys avatar..

off topic too,check your pm...

onebadbootleg · January 2012

Do you think anyone will sell you a 500 dollar poster for the 30 dollars they originally paid for it? This place is silly with that kind of thing. Of course flippers suck, but if all the people on this board knew how much those backpacks or blu rays would be commanding on the second hand market, do you think they would have lasted as long as they did? My advice - dont ask for advice. If you have something to sell in order to buy something, both at very inflated prices, do it on eBay. Then come here and hook someone up in the future to appease your conscience. Most people here do similar things, and if they dont then they are hoarders and deserve to love and appreciate their merch. I have a very few PJ items that will never ever leave my collection. Others? If they were to command such crazy prices then so be it. People paying so much have extra money laying around.

Paul Andrews · January 2012

onebadbootleg wrote:

Do you think anyone will sell you a 500 dollar poster for the 30 dollars they originally paid for it? This place is silly with that kind of thing. Of course flippers suck, but if all the people on this board knew how much those backpacks or blu rays would be commanding on the second hand market, do you think they would have lasted as long as they did? My advice - dont ask for advice. If you have something to sell in order to buy something, both at very inflated prices, do it on eBay. Then come here and hook someone up in the future to appease your conscience. Most people here do similar things, and if they dont then they are hoarders and deserve to love and appreciate their merch. I have a very few PJ items that will never ever leave my collection. Others? If they were to command such crazy prices then so be it. People paying so much have extra money laying around.

Probably one of the most honest posts ever. Well played sir.

I only collect what I want to keep, and if i ever find a need to not keep it, then the market probably should decide the price. But then again, nothing I purchased was purchased to be sold, and the crazy prices people pay for the LA3 or LA4 t-shirts mean nothing to me when i wear them.

Chrisilein · January 2012

Paul Andrews wrote:

Great post. I think intent is mostly what it is about. None of my purchases have been made with selling in mind. If i didn't want it for my collection I didn't buy it - not even as trade bait - to me this is flipping - just a different kind of flipping.

I don't regard most selling on ebay as flipping, it is allowing the market to set the rate (the US capitalist way??). I do regarding buying something and selling it on ebay immediately as flipping though, buying loads of posters at a show and sellign them the next day etc.

I have a number of sealed items - vinyls - but i intend to get a record player one day and play them, they're not for sale. I have two vinyls left to collect to have my complete collection (Binaural and LO2L). I only buy sealed because I want to be the first to open them and also want to make sure they are mint - I do realise i could come unstuck here if the record is damaged and unable to be seen, but that's a risk I am willing to take. Buying them sealed protects the investment I am making i guess.

But to get sealed vinyl I have to pay through the nose - mostly on ebay, but by being patient, setting upper limits on bids, not getting sucked into bidding wars in the last minute, i have scored sealed vinyls far lower than I'd have expected. Right now I'm trying to get my last two vinyls and resisting the urge to fork out the near $300 for a sealed binaural on ebay - but i don't see many of these come up. But I'll be patient - but I'll pay far more than I could have paid if I bought it when it came out - even if I buy it from someone here. Them's the breaks i guess. I'm in the open market and I have to accept the price the market places on this items. I'm not interested in reissues or bootlegs, just the first editions that I should have purchased originally - but was quite happy with CDs.

But this brings me to a question. Nothing was purchased to be traded and the few doubles I have may be traded eventually - one of my open Yields has just been traded. But what if i suddenly need cash in a hurry. Trading here would not solve that problem of needing fast cash - ebay would be the only fair place to go and allow the true market value to be established.

I think intent is where it is at, and the only person who really knows the intent is the seller. I see both sides of this and ultimately, ebay can be a godsend or the devil himself.

Totally agree with Paul!
2-3 years ago i collected everything available only to have it, even if i don't really like it. Ebay was the main place to find these things and it helped me to complete all the bootlegs. Unfortunately i bought several things i don't really like and i realized that it is almost impossible to collect everything..posters/cds/vinyls/promos/radio shows/tour itineraries....unless you have unlimited funds. One year ago i started to sell a few things, especially posters but only to raise money for items i really love! I don't see this as flipping. What i don't like is to buy things here and sell it the next day to make money. That's not ok but i can't really see a way to stop these people.

Spags · January 2012

benjs wrote:

I think trading is the way to go - after all, one man's trash is another man's treasure I have the EV songbook and will not put it on eBay, but if I see on here someone looking for a trade and there's an item of significance to me, I will definitely do that. To me it is a vain and useless product, to others it is a gem!

So you bought Song Books (which you obviously dont like) so you can trade it later for something limited that you do want? My eyes have been opened :shock:

Not trying to start any drama, just never crossed my mind to do something like that. Guess it makes sense as I'd never want to trade or sell up any of my PJ/Ed stuff (not that I have much tbh) - maybe I should join a bands club I hate and try for their limited stuff and then try and trade that here for PJ goodies?

Are we allowed to trade non-PJ stuff here?

DS1119 · January 2012

Flipping is flipping is flipping. If you don't want the item up for sale let it go to the next member who does. Just my opinion.

Paul Andrews · January 2012

DS1119 wrote:

Flipping is flipping is flipping. If you don't want the item up for sale let it go to the next member who does. Just my opinion.

Exactly, when 10c sales come up, the rush of people to purchase a lot of it is caused by flippers or people looking to use the item as trade bait - maybe we should call the 'floppers'. I'm not going to call them out and condemn them, because the nature of these limited items, people see the chance to get something and then trade it for something they missed out on previously and lately you really have to be in the right place at the right time to get these items.

I for one don't buy anything I don't want as a collectible or to use. The PJ20 backpack is about the only thing I haven't used (although I originally intended to) and purely because i know i'd ruin it within a year and that just doesn't seem right. Maybe that's my ticket for my Binaural and/or LO2L one day - but to me this seems wrong, I want to keep it as my PJ20 collection. I guess their original prices are similar enough for it to be 'fair' to some. If that day ever came I'd ask here first but if i couldn't arrange that, I'd not feel bad about ebaying it and then using the funds to pay someone else's inflated price for a binaural (one curretnly listed for $300 on ebay!!!). I guess you gotta do what you gotta do, but it was never bought with selling/trading in mind.

The traders forum is great, but it open to abuse where people just buy to either make a quick buck or try to add value to the product to get another. This is probably why it was not added until many requests had been made for it. The community does seem to be policing this well enough though.

Sure the market price of Donkey Kong MSG2 may be $150-$200 or whatever, (thanks to the graciousness of another member mine cost far less - after I missed out at the show) but is a PJ20 or a White Backspacer at a price of $30 or $50 retail suddenly worth that for a trade straight after the sale? They both cost about the same originally, so i guess on one level it is.

Again no slight intended at all on people making these trades, because value is in the eye of the beholder, but I'm not comfortable with people purchasing simply to sell or trade. But at the end of the day opinions are like arseholes and if you were to gauge me on my opinions, you could be forgiven for assuming I have a huge arsehole

benjs · January 2012

Spags wrote:

benjs wrote:

I think trading is the way to go - after all, one man's trash is another man's treasure I have the EV songbook and will not put it on eBay, but if I see on here someone looking for a trade and there's an item of significance to me, I will definitely do that. To me it is a vain and useless product, to others it is a gem!

So you bought Song Books (which you obviously dont like) so you can trade it later for something limited that you do want? My eyes have been opened :shock:

Not trying to start any drama, just never crossed my mind to do something like that. Guess it makes sense as I'd never want to trade or sell up any of my PJ/Ed stuff (not that I have much tbh) - maybe I should join a bands club I hate and try for their limited stuff and then try and trade that here for PJ goodies?

Are we allowed to trade non-PJ stuff here?

Sorry I guess I explained myself poorly, as that is absolutely not what my intentions were! I was hoping for more of a scrap book feel with insight into the songwriting process perhaps (think Bob Dylan's scrapbook that was released, if you've seen it) but instead I found out the book is a tab and lyric book with tons of pictures of Eddie posing with a ukulele. You'll also remember that very few details were provided about what was contained within. It's just not my thing.

PJ-Cubs · January 2012

DS1119 wrote:

Flipping is flipping is flipping. If you don't want the item up for sale let it go to the next member who does. Just my opinion.

+1

apirk72 · January 2012

Personally I think that if you are buying an item to turn around and sell or trade for something else it is flipping, to there is really no difference. I think the Lost Dogs section getting flooded with people trying to trade items they just bought is just as bad as someone throwing it on ebay, but people will try to justify it as not flipping. But if you have the opportunity to buy something who am I really to tell you what you can and can't do with the item.

ewokpelts · January 2012

pjfan31 wrote:

ps... didn't mean it in a mean way... just fun and to answer your question...

If you buy something to make a profit off pearl jams name then thats wrong...

I had the deluxe blu-ray which I saw going for $500... and I may well be out of work next year (due to increase studies and practical requirements), and I thought $500 would be pretty hard to turn down... but then I thought, hey its Pearl Jams name, I shouldn't be able to profit out of it...

Maybe in time I could sell it, but its too soon...

SO I opened it, and played it...

Good luck... and welcome..

PEARL JAM profits off Pearl Jam's name.

Not justifying anything, but simply putting it in perspective.

I've been a collector of variosu things over the last 20 years. Buying AND selling is the nature of the game.

Suziemay · January 2012

I think you will get varying opinions on this with no consensus. You just have to do what feels right to you. I have my own opinions, but don't judge others for theirs. I just won't engage if I disagree with what they are doing.

guacamolejoe · January 2012

ewokpelts wrote:

pjfan31 wrote:

ps... didn't mean it in a mean way... just fun and to answer your question...

If you buy something to make a profit off pearl jams name then thats wrong...

I had the deluxe blu-ray which I saw going for $500... and I may well be out of work next year (due to increase studies and practical requirements), and I thought $500 would be pretty hard to turn down... but then I thought, hey its Pearl Jams name, I shouldn't be able to profit out of it...

Maybe in time I could sell it, but its too soon...

SO I opened it, and played it...

Good luck... and welcome..

PEARL JAM profits off Pearl Jam's name.

Not justifying anything, but simply putting it in perspective.

I've been a collector of variosu things over the last 20 years. Buying AND selling is the nature of the game.

Just as every cop is a criminal
And all sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me (you) lucifer
Cause I'm in need of some restraint
So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy & some taste
Use all your well made politesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste :twisted:
(Not) Please to meet you
Hope you guessed my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game :roll:.......RS

Suziemay · January 2012

guacamolejoe wrote:

ewokpelts wrote:

pjfan31 wrote:

ps... didn't mean it in a mean way... just fun and to answer your question...

If you buy something to make a profit off pearl jams name then thats wrong...

I had the deluxe blu-ray which I saw going for $500... and I may well be out of work next year (due to increase studies and practical requirements), and I thought $500 would be pretty hard to turn down... but then I thought, hey its Pearl Jams name, I shouldn't be able to profit out of it...

Maybe in time I could sell it, but its too soon...

SO I opened it, and played it...

Good luck... and welcome..

PEARL JAM profits off Pearl Jam's name.

Not justifying anything, but simply putting it in perspective.

I've been a collector of variosu things over the last 20 years. Buying AND selling is the nature of the game.

Just as every cop is a criminal
And all sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me (you) lucifer
Cause I'm in need of some restraint
So if you meet me
Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy & some taste
Use all your well made politesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste :twisted:
(Not) Please to meet you
Hope you guessed my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game :roll:.......RS

WOO WOO... WOO WOO

cmalisze · January 2012

I believe that collecting anything of any sort has what is called supply and demand. PJ's items are no different than baseball cards or stamps or coins or vinyl's or anything else worth collecting. The issue we have here as members of the 10c who choose to post within threads is that we all have a passion for a particular band that we all cherish and significantly value items related to them. However, it is my belief that the members in the band understand that by limiting certain items such as the PJ20 DVD or backpack or the Benny LP there will be a secondary market. I cannot say I know exactly but, obviously they are receiving some sort of compensation for putting the bands name on items and that is how they are being paid for merchandising. It is no different than someone selling or trading a Babe Ruth or Michael Jordan autograph for much more than it was originally worth or even what they paid for it. Professional athletes receive extra compensation for allowing their likeness to be used. I believe as within anything discretion is key. I personally have no problem with people doing what they internally are comfortable with. I mean look, this week someone sold a Benny LP for $700 and they were applauded for the price they were asking. I am pretty sure the original price was NOT $700. I am a collector and choose to collect not sell. The last year has been much more intense with the marketing of PJ20 and it is my belief that people have gotten insane over items and what others are doing with them because we realize they are scarce. Bottom line if you sell or trade items all you can do is ask for fair market value and should people choose to partake so be it an if not that is there choice as well. I hope I did not offend or piss anyone off as I do want to remain in the good graces because I enjoy this message board and my ability to buy and maybe even one day trade items within. Good luck!

Shorty · January 2012

This has been great. Thanks for all the replies and emails. I understand the definition of a flipper more accurately now - and - have a better perspective of what would constitute a jackass within the community. I'm sure most understand that my initial post was to gain information for myself - as well as initiate a discussion - BECAUSE - I really wanted to know - without having previously determining what I was specifically going to do when (if) presented with the situation. I certainly wouldn't call attention to myself so blatently if I was indeed going to be one who could be deemed a jackass within the community. Honestly - acheiving then maintaining board cred is most important to me - I plan on being here long term.

A few comments....

EdsonNascimento wrote:

I've always thought if you feel the need to ask an ethics question, you already know the answer. Do what feels right.

I agree 99% of the time - if you have to ask a question about ethics - you likely already know the answer - I just wanted to get a concensus on what could be considered the grey area.

pjradio wrote:

wow...shorty can post!!!

Thanks...

pjfan31 wrote:

pjradio wrote:

wow...shorty can post!!!

and some length too...

Maybe we can call him longy....

Anyone calls me Longy down the road gets an official lol from me - I'll know what caused it.

I like my avatar too - thanks Chrisilein

Love this one....

onebadbootleg wrote:

Do you think anyone will sell you a 500 dollar poster for the 30 dollars they originally paid for it? This place is silly with that kind of thing. Of course flippers suck, but if all the people on this board knew how much those backpacks or blu rays would be commanding on the second hand market, do you think they would have lasted as long as they did? My advice - dont ask for advice. If you have something to sell in order to buy something, both at very inflated prices, do it on eBay. Then come here and hook someone up in the future to appease your conscience. Most people here do similar things, and if they dont then they are hoarders and deserve to love and appreciate their merch. I have a very few PJ items that will never ever leave my collection. Others? If they were to command such crazy prices then so be it. People paying so much have extra money laying around.

Some really great stuff. Thanks again. I agree - concensus will not be acheived. But I do understand more. The only thing that sucks is - no matter what is said - FOR SURE - the next limited issue PJ whateverthefuck - will be gobbled up quick - and some (most) of them will be by those who don't really want it.

Cheers
Longy out for now,

EdsonNascimento · January 2012

Shorty wrote:

EdsonNascimento wrote:

I've always thought if you feel the need to ask an ethics question, you already know the answer. Do what feels right.

I agree 99% of the time - if you have to ask a question about ethics - you likely already know the answer - I just wanted to get a concensus on what could be considered the grey area.

If it's grey, how could anyone answer your question? I find these types of questions are generally folks looking for approval of things they know they shouldn't be (or, at least feel uncomfortable) doing.

Again - I'm on the side of as long as you don't do real harm to others, do what you want. But, at the end of the day, you are the one that has to live with your decisions and actions. And in situations such as these, you should do what you feel is right, and not look for external approval to justify your actions.

You should not read into my answer which side I am on. What I would do is irrelevant to what you should do. The world will be fine whichever path you take. So, I personally couldn't care less. But, you should.

Of The Aggie · January 2012

pjradio wrote:

buy it when you can...sit on it for awhile...sell it...

thats how it is

Buy it when you can, use it for it's intended purpose, enjoy the experience for many years

Kat · January 2012

DS1119 wrote:

Flipping is flipping is flipping. If you don't want the item up for sale let it go to the next member who does. Just my opinion.

http://forums.pearljam.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=147179

http://forums.pearljam.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=91525

http://www.pearljam.com/content/legal-disclaimer

Etiquette of Collecting

Comments

Categories