AIPAC official on taking over student gov't
Comments
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silence can sometimes be better than words.
University of Michigan Campus
On October 20 2010, two IDF soldiers came to the University of Michigan campus as part of a national PR campaign by Stand With Us aimed at justifying Israel's recent atrocities in the Middle East. Students, staff, and community members collectively engaged in a silent walk-out in memory and in solidarity with all of the silenced Palestinian children that were killed by the IDF during Israel's most recent offensive on the Gaza Strip who are unable to take a stand and give their account today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPDkq2JHfA00 -
wow....TriumphantAngel wrote:silence can sometimes be better than words.
University of Michigan Campus
On October 20 2010, two IDF soldiers came to the University of Michigan campus as part of a national PR campaign by Stand With Us aimed at justifying Israel's recent atrocities in the Middle East. Students, staff, and community members collectively engaged in a silent walk-out in memory and in solidarity with all of the silenced Palestinian children that were killed by the IDF during Israel's most recent offensive on the Gaza Strip who are unable to take a stand and give their account today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPDkq2JHfA0
that was very powerful. thanks for sharing.
the violin part of "i love the way you lie" was haunting, yet very fitting.
that soldier said the air force does not fire on schools or mosques because it does not want to kill civilians. i guess not, because it does a good enough job by dropping bombs in other civilian populated areas. :twisted:"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."0 -
Drowned Out wrote:
For someone who doesn’t like them, you sure have a defensive tone. Put up or shut up? No. I'm not in a court of law here, and I'm free to speculate, thanks.….the words ‘forced’ and ‘directly’ were all that kept your post from being as big a stretch as any speculation I could have put forth – AIPAC-worthy semantics and spin. No, I can’t prove any allegation in this particular case, but that doesn’t mean there was nothing shady done…. I’m sure I could find proof of many shady dealings involving AIPAC. So I didn’t think it ok to allow the last word to be, essentially, ‘they’re working within the system to educate Berkeley students on their views’, as this severely understates the significance and subversive nature of their efforts.yosi wrote:Look, like I said, I don't like AIPAC. I don't (and wouldn't) expect you to like them either. But at the end of the day it doesn't seem to me that they are doing anything wrong. People keep dealing in innuendo, talking about conspiracies and secret shady dealings without providing any proof to back up the talk. So either put up or shut. Disagree with them all you want, but don't start accusing people of wrongdoing just cause you don't like what they believe.
I was being facetious with my conspiracy comment, but it is technically true. Just to be clear:
Conspiracy: a secret plan or agreement between two or more people to commit an illegal or subversive act
Subversive: intended or likely to undermine or overthrow a government or other institution
So tell me how, aside from blabbing his ‘secret’, this AIPAC member was not a part of a conspiracy?
You're right, you're free to speculate as much as you want. It's just that when your speculation is all but pulled out of thin air, and is supported by absolutely no evidence whatsoever one might think that a more apt term for what you are doing is "making shit up."
Let's play a little game, shall we...I speculate that Drowned Out is involved in a conspiracy to cover up the genocide of every black squirrel in the northern hemisphere...No, I can’t prove any allegation in this particular case, but that doesn’t mean there was nothing shady done…. I’m sure I could find proof of many shady dealings involving Drowned Out.
My, now that I'm using your own words I must say that you make a very convincing case. :roll: Seriously though, if you're going to be making accusations the onus is on you to provide some sort of evidence. Otherwise you're just slinging mud.
And what exactly is so subversive about students taking part in the politics of their student government?you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane0 -
yosi wrote:How exactly are they forcing their viewpoint on anyone?
Like this:
“we’re going to make sure that pro-Israel students take over the student government and reverse the vote…This is how AIPAC operates in our nation’s capital. This is how AIPAC must operate on our nation’s campuses.”0 -
That isn't an example. It's a quote out of context. The question you have to answer is how that is done, and why you think the means used are illegitimate. If you can't do that you don't have a leg to stand on.you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane0
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This goes some way toward explaining how AIPAC operates in relation to Academia in America...intimidation...cocercion...and accusations of anti-Semitism:
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/john-mears ... rael-lobby
The Israel Lobby
John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt
Where the Lobby has had the most difficulty is in stifling debate on university campuses. In the 1990s, when the Oslo peace process was underway, there was only mild criticism of Israel, but it grew stronger with Oslo’s collapse and Sharon’s access to power, becoming quite vociferous when the IDF reoccupied the West Bank in spring 2002 and employed massive force to subdue the second intifada.
The Lobby moved immediately to ‘take back the campuses’. New groups sprang up, like the Caravan for Democracy, which brought Israeli speakers to US colleges. Established groups like the Jewish Council for Public Affairs and Hillel joined in, and a new group, the Israel on Campus Coalition, was formed to co-ordinate the many bodies that now sought to put Israel’s case. Finally, AIPAC more than tripled its spending on programmes to monitor university activities and to train young advocates, in order to ‘vastly expand the number of students involved on campus … in the national pro-Israel effort’.
The Lobby also monitors what professors write and teach. In September 2002, Martin Kramer and Daniel Pipes, two passionately pro-Israel neo-conservatives, established a website (Campus Watch) that posted dossiers on suspect academics and encouraged students to report remarks or behaviour that might be considered hostile to Israel. This transparent attempt to blacklist and intimidate scholars provoked a harsh reaction and Pipes and Kramer later removed the dossiers, but the website still invites students to report ‘anti-Israel’ activity.
Groups within the Lobby put pressure on particular academics and universities. Columbia has been a frequent target, no doubt because of the presence of the late Edward Said on its faculty. ‘One can be sure that any public statement in support of the Palestinian people by the pre-eminent literary critic Edward Said will elicit hundreds of emails, letters and journalistic accounts that call on us to denounce Said and to either sanction or fire him,’ Jonathan Cole, its former provost, reported. When Columbia recruited the historian Rashid Khalidi from Chicago, the same thing happened. It was a problem Princeton also faced a few years later when it considered wooing Khalidi away from Columbia.
LRB Book Bags
A classic illustration of the effort to police academia occurred towards the end of 2004, when the David Project produced a film alleging that faculty members of Columbia’s Middle East Studies programme were anti-semitic and were intimidating Jewish students who stood up for Israel. Columbia was hauled over the coals, but a faculty committee which was assigned to investigate the charges found no evidence of anti-semitism and the only incident possibly worth noting was that one professor had ‘responded heatedly’ to a student’s question. The committee also discovered that the academics in question had themselves been the target of an overt campaign of intimidation.
Perhaps the most disturbing aspect of all this is the efforts Jewish groups have made to push Congress into establishing mechanisms to monitor what professors say. If they manage to get this passed, universities judged to have an anti-Israel bias would be denied federal funding. Their efforts have not yet succeeded, but they are an indication of the importance placed on controlling debate.
A number of Jewish philanthropists have recently established Israel Studies programmes (in addition to the roughly 130 Jewish Studies programmes already in existence) so as to increase the number of Israel-friendly scholars on campus. In May 2003, NYU announced the establishment of the Taub Center for Israel Studies; similar programmes have been set up at Berkeley, Brandeis and Emory. Academic administrators emphasise their pedagogical value, but the truth is that they are intended in large part to promote Israel’s image. Fred Laffer, the head of the Taub Foundation, makes it clear that his foundation funded the NYU centre to help counter the ‘Arabic [sic] point of view’ that he thinks is prevalent in NYU’s Middle East programmes.0 -
yosi wrote:You're right, you're free to speculate as much as you want. It's just that when your speculation is all but pulled out of thin air, and is supported by absolutely no evidence whatsoever one might think that a more apt term for what you are doing is "making shit up."
Seriously though, if you're going to be making accusations the onus is on you to provide some sort of evidence. Otherwise you're just slinging mud.
I saw your response to Byrnzie... What is taken out of context in that quote? It is a direct quote about how to influence or "take over" the Berkely student council and reverse a vote. If a filmed confession is not evidence, what is? I'm not a judge, it's enough for me...
But they don't operate directly on university campuses. :roll:
What is subversive is not the students taking part in their schools politics…it’s a massive political lobby taking part in the school’s politics…by undermining, or to quote AIPAC’s Leadership Development Director “take over”, their governments. And that’s exactly what they do, the same way they undermine or “take over” the process of democratic government in Washington….in fact, it’s their pull in Washington that makes attending this conference so appealing. Meet n greets on Capitol Hill? 1300 students from 365 campuses, in all 50 states, 400 of which are on their student councils ….I wonder which Berkeley students got invites for next year? Just slingin mud…yosi wrote:And what exactly is so subversive about students taking part in the politics of their student government?0 -
You know you really should read the piece I posted. I know it's long, but it is incredibly relevant. If you're too lazy a very brief summary would be that it basically demolishes everything you are saying.you couldn't swing if you were hangin' from a palm tree in a hurricane0
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