Israeli army condemns publication of Gaza 'war criminals'

ذهب wrote:

and as for so many conclusions being drawn just because i vehemently opposes the israeli occupation well yeah that's a valid point. i'm used to people jumping to the wrong conclusions and i'm tired of defending myself.

so yeah. carry on with your thread.

NOBODY IS ATTACKING YOU, so ther eis no need for you to defend yourself. you accused me of attention seeking, yet i never changed my screen name to something in another language. like it or not, that move got you attention, and curiosity.

how can you accuse people of jumping to conclusions when they were just trying to understand where you were coming from?

and yes i know you oppose the occupation. so do 97% of all of the posters on the moving train.

ذهب wrote:

i'm not talking about what the people on the moving train think. this is a pearl jam message board and how proactive i am and what people say to me here is insignificant in the scope of things. i'm talking about personally. i am tired of people jumping to conclusions GENERALLY. there has been plenty of occassions when i've had to defend myself. i've been called anti semetic, i've lost friends because of my committment to the Palestinian people and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

so get back to your thread. thanks.

then what are you getting at then? you got all hot and bothered when people started asking about your new screen name. and i am sorry, but you could have called yourself "gone" instead of taking the dramatic route of going with the arabic name. that is not a shot at you, but you need to understand why people are concerned. you take concern as people "jumping to conclusions" and making you "have to defend yourself". the fact is, most of us who get criticized on this forum bring it on ourselves. that has happend to me numersous times. yet i never changed my screen name to mandarin or anything to avoid that criticism. i came back with facts and good debate skills. and at worst, just cut my losses and bailed on a thread and came back on a different day. yes you have been called anti semitic, so have i. i got banned for 2 weeks for condemning the flotilla raid. but it does not matter. but it is the people in your life whose opinions truely matter. not those on this fucking message board. we have all lost friends here. i lost the most important person in my life on this message board. i can not even have a fucking simple conversation with her anymore......we have all lost, but do you think that i let people that i disagree with have any bearing on my life or my opinions or my posts? no. neither should you. you are righteous, so you should act like it and win with facts and without drama.

catefrances wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

i condemn those giving the orders. i think those giving the orders should be tried at the hague. the thing that bothers me is no charges are ever pressed. in the US justice system you have to have enough evidence for an indictment. then you can get a trial. i am not sure what it takes internationally, but some of these accusations are not from official sources so they are not given credence. if we can have the un or nato investigate these accusations maybe we can get some indictments, trials and convictions. i would hate to see vigilante justice carried out, ever in cases where i think that it might be warranted....i believe in the rule of law.

you know about the vigilante thing... ive used this example twice recently and im gonna use it again here now.
when MLK was killed robert kennedy said in a speech that he can understand the blacks wanting to go after white folks. he said he could understand this because his brother was killed by a white man. but it wasnt ALL white men that murdered his brother he said, it was(for arguments sake) ONE white man. and i think in this case it is wrong and very dangerous to condemn all members of IDF for the actions of a few no matter how abhorrant we find the policies of those in charge.

now as for international law.. clearly its failing in the case of israel because nothing is being done. the plaestinians contnue to be oppressed and the israeli govt are being emboldened by the support it gets from the US govt. in turn and for whatever reasons the international community seems impotent to take the US to task on their support of this continuing atrocity. and until the international community without the US does decide to uphold international law, nothing is going to change. i think this is a clear case where we cant wait for the US to guide us. they are on the wrong side here and need to be brought to task.

you know, i agree with you with the rfk thing. my parents wanted vengeance for mlk's death and they are white middle class midwesterners. they were in college when mlk died and they were furious. i can understand their frustration. rfk was completely correct in his speech, and if he had been wrong many more cities would have burned that night. on that same token, i do not give those in the idf the benefit of the doubt because they are occupying land that is not theirs. it was stolen and the international community does not recognize the current borders. i can completely understand the furstration of the palestinians, and i agree wit them completely. my gripe is with the international community who allows the current situation to continne from month to mont, from year to year, and seemingly from generation to generation. international law is international law. and it pisses me off how some countries are bound by international law and others are allowed to act above it. either there is law, or there is not, without law there is chaos, and chaos is ruling the day in the middle east. the us shoudl either lead, or get the fuck out of the way and yield to whatever entitiy will lead and enorce the law. unfortunately we are doing nothing other than allowing israel to act with impunity, it is up to the international community to act, because if it was left up to individual palestinians to act they would be crushed and labeled as terrorists, and in the court of public opinion does a "terrorist" ever win? no...

ذهب wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

ذهب wrote:

i'm not talking about what the people on the moving train think. this is a pearl jam message board and how proactive i am and what people say to me here is insignificant in the scope of things. i'm talking about personally. i am tired of people jumping to conclusions GENERALLY. there has been plenty of occassions when i've had to defend myself. i've been called anti semetic, i've lost friends because of my committment to the Palestinian people and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

so get back to your thread. thanks.

then what are you getting at then? you got all hot and bothered when people started asking about your new screen name. and i am sorry, but you could have called yourself "gone" instead of taking the dramatic route of going with the arabic name. that is not a shot at you, but you need to understand why people are concerned.

actually i tried "gone". someone else has already used it.

i didn't get all hot or bothered when byrnzie asked me about my board name. i actually ignored it and posted another post after it and stayed on topic. the thread wasn't about me.

i got annoyed when you came along and said that my new name was quite interesting and byrnzie should google it. you never posted a google link initially. that's all you said. if you had posted your google link to start with rather than just the comment then things probably wouldn't have blown up like they did. i asked what the 'quite interesting' meant. i had no clue because you didn't post the link. you just made the "very interesting" comment to Byrnzie like it was something sinister.

i''m done with this. i'll take my name and fuck off.

do not blame me for your actions. you changed your name and became the only one of 200 someodd thousand to have an arabic name. there is nothing wrong with that. i think we wanted you to reply to that question, but you didn't. we could have googled it and known. i am sorry for jumping in. but i DID find it quite interesting for reasons stated earlier in this thread. if people did not care they would not have asked or bothered to look it up..and if you must know, i noticed the name change this afternoon and briefly looked it up, and when i replied tonight i was on my phone's internet and you can not copy and paste on there, so i could not look it up and post the link. i think you need to stop acting like everyone has a sinister motive. you know that i make it a habit of not only posting articles, but the corresponding links, that way there is no confusion of what i am posting.