Building Apple computers

I'm not saying, I'm just saying, don't shoot the messenger.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/02/news/co ... s.fortune/

BTW, I'm kicking myself every day for not buying Ford stock in January of 2008.

michelle822 wrote:

Apple fanboys and fangirls puzzle me - i guess the products are supposedly so cool they're willing to give the company and that d-bag Jobs a pass on just about anything :?

And yet every time I see threads about Apple I never fail to find vitriol being aimed at Steve Jobs for no apparent reason that "he's a douchebag". The guy rescued Apple from floundering when he returned to the company he started, and they just posted a $15 billion profit last year. Not bad for a company being derided for serving a "niche market".
Nobody's saying he's perfect - he has an infamous temper and a penchant for holding on to grudges - but I don't judge any products based on the temperament of their CEOs. I judge products on their performance, and frankly I've found Apple products to be by and large just as good or even better than anything out there.

Not everyone will agree with me, of course, but I don't base my views on gut emotions or snide dismissals.

And believe me, despite the fact that I now own a MacBook after years of using PCs, and being on my second iPhone, I'm not shy about criticizing Apple for their errors. Giving the iPhone an unbelievably weak transmitter was one glaring defect that's led to countless issues with AT&T customers being unable to properly get reception. Making the 6th generation iPod classic 120 GB (from 160GB) and changing the audio chip to a noticeably inferior one was another stupid decision. And so on.

Furthermore, I find such faux outrage over Apple's use of Chinese labor to be laughable, when virtually every electronic device used by people here have roots in suffering and blood. And not just in China. The coltan and niobium used in CPUs and smart chips, for instance, are inextricably linked to militant groups committing genocide in the Congo, and yet nobody's been talking about this. HP a role model? After this company spearheaded the efforts to outsource jobs to India and the Philippines so they didn't have to pay workers here a living wage?
Yeah, Apple shouldn't be doing business with China. But really, neither should any of us here. There's a lot of hidden costs to the Chinese manufacturing economy, from the rampant pollution of their environment caused by building a new coal fired plant every week and dumping noxious chemicals into their water, to more and more greenhouse gases going into the atmosphere, and one sided "free trade" deals that leech jobs away from us and turning us into a "would you like some fries with that?" economy.

How about we start having a sensible discussion about bringing back union made manufacturing jobs to the USA, where they provided the backbone of the middle class and our booming economy from the late 40s to the 80s? How about we start factoring in the real costs of doing business with China? How about reversing NAFTA, CAFTA, and all these rotten "free trade" policies? How about restoring the tax rates of billionaires and millionaires to the way they were back in the Eisenhower era so CEOs don't have an incentive to keep pumping up profits to the point of breaking their companies and crushing everyone else?


/end rant

Meh.. if your old enough to walk, you're old enough for labor.

Like if work.






I'm drunk now, so anyone offended can sue me.



I'm not saying the labor conditions are to everyones expectations, but believe me, I counted the days religously until I turned 16 and could make $4.35 an hour.. beated the $5 a week my parents gave me.



But really, it sucks.. but are these workers slaves? They have a choice right, and they must like the option, right? No?

What would they be doing if Apple pulled out and paid Americans more to do a shittier job?


Don't think I'm siding, I'm just questioning.

Starfall wrote:

michelle822 wrote:

Apple fanboys and fangirls puzzle me - i guess the products are supposedly so cool they're willing to give the company and that d-bag Jobs a pass on just about anything :?

Yeah, Apple shouldn't be doing business with China. But really, neither should any of us here. There's a lot of hidden costs to the Chinese manufacturing economy, from the rampant pollution of their environment caused by building a new coal fired plant every week and dumping noxious chemicals into their water, to more and more greenhouse gases going into the atmosphere, and one sided "free trade" deals that leech jobs away from us and turning us into a "would you like some fries with that?" economy.

How about we start having a sensible discussion about bringing back union made manufacturing jobs to the USA, where they provided the backbone of the middle class and our booming economy from the late 40s to the 80s? How about we start factoring in the real costs of doing business with China? How about reversing NAFTA, CAFTA, and all these rotten "free trade" policies? How about restoring the tax rates of billionaires and millionaires to the way they were back in the Eisenhower era so CEOs don't have an incentive to keep pumping up profits to the point of breaking their companies and crushing everyone else?


/end rant

I absolutely agree with you!!!!
would the usa need to 'create' jobs now, if we didn't outsource the manufacturing and customer service sectors ????

LikeAnOcean wrote:

But really, it sucks.. but are these workers slaves? They have a choice right, and they must like the option, right? No?

They have a choice between starvation, or making a barely sustainable living. Kinda like choosing to submit to a mugger when he has a knife to your throat, or getting your carotid artery slashed.
Real easy to criticize other countries from the safety and comfort of your armchair in the good old US of A.

What would they be doing if Apple pulled out and paid Americans more to do a shittier job?
Don't think I'm siding, I'm just questioning.

The fact that you can even think that Americans "do a shittier job" is proof enough that you ARE siding. Americans have the highest productivity of any work force in the world, and it's been going up every year.

Meanwhile, the real wages of American workers have remained stagnant since the 1980's, while company profits and CEO salaries have continued to skyrocket.

Makes me wonder what you're actually questioning.

yes we would still need to create jobs, not nearly as many but still the economy would be as bad as it is now

this "crisis" was more about housing, bad lending and shady banking then about people loosing jobs