I Can't Wait For Government Run Health-Care!!!
Comments
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Commy wrote:jlew24asu wrote:jlew24asu wrote:
tell me Commy, who would take care of your medical needs under your Anarchy system?
you didnt answer the question. I'm dying to know your answer.
nor did you tell me where you got your numbers on the cost of health care.
its not a simple answer.
labor is decided by individuals, who the cap fits. and you're right, not everyone is cut out to be a doctor. but they save lives. ideally, celebrities are born this way, those that save lives get attention from their peers, ideally. that is a motivating factor for some, for why they labor. instead of these idiot reality star douchebags that everyone considers celebrities now, it would be more about who does the most for the community. that's how hero's would be born, and they would have a certain celebrity status.
as it is prices are fairly arbitrary. in many industries corporations are controlling prices by controlling supply. there's some diamond mines in africa where they just hide away billions of dollars worth of diamonds so as not to flood the market, thus dropping prices. agriculture is like that as well. we have the ability to grow enough food for everyone on the planet, but prices would be so low monsanto might lose money next quarter, so they don't do it. point is prices are, for the most part, arbitrary, or fixed by the sellers, the corporations.
why does knee surgery cost $30,000? part of it is the expertise of the doctor, but $30,000 for a 3 hour surgery seems a bit excessive to me. part of it is equipment.
You know Cuba has 20,000 fully trained doctors operating around the 3rd world? that's more than any country on earth. poor little island cuba has more trained doctors operating outside its borders than some countries have inside. if they can do with so few resources, imagine what could be acccomplished with a resource rich country such as the United States.Commy wrote:why does knee surgery cost $30,000 or whatever it is? why is it so high? its almost an arbitrary figure based somewhat on demand. ideally it would be free.
people do not work for free Commy. medical school is very long and expensive. and only a certain few are capable of being life saving doctors. secondly, built into the cost of care is liability costs of the doctors. they pay almost half their income on insurance to protect themselves against people like you who wold sue them if they made a mistake.
i wou;dn tbe suing anybody. unless he injected my with cyanide or something.
see above.
Cuba has 20,000 trained doctors operating outside their borders, providing care to third world countries, saving countless lives.
and medical school costs are arbitrary. why should education cost ANYTHING? not everyone can do it. only those capable will be enrolling anyway. we could learn a a lot from Cuba. maybe that's why they are still considered a threat, they are an example on how to run a decent society.
in a resource based society, money is taken out of the equation. service is provided based on need. people will be motivated to become doctors because of reasons other than greed, the desire to save lives for one, and they would have a certain elevated status within the community, much like a shaman back in the day, only more modern and a lot cooler. they would be celebrities.
I exaggerated my numbers. I made them up. but its of my best educated opinion, that UHC in the US would cost far more then our military budget. Americans expect and demand the highest of care. not taken from the lowest bidder. well "if Cuba can do it" is not a valid argument.
so now you have your answer. so again, you want an Anarchy system correct? in your Anarchy system, who will provide and pay for your care?
but anyway, doctors arent going through years and years of grueling, EXPENSIVE schooling just to "save lives". you need to accept the fact the money is a much bigger motivator.0 -
Commy wrote:jlew24asu wrote:jlew24asu wrote:
tell me Commy, who would take care of your medical needs under your Anarchy system?
you didnt answer the question. I'm dying to know your answer.
nor did you tell me where you got your numbers on the cost of health care.
its not a simple answer.
labor is decided by individuals, who the cap fits. and you're right, not everyone is cut out to be a doctor. but they save lives. ideally, celebrities are born this way, those that save lives get attention from their peers, ideally. that is a motivating factor for some, for why they labor. instead of these idiot reality star douchebags that everyone considers celebrities now, it would be more about who does the most for the community. that's how hero's would be born, and they would have a certain celebrity status.
as it is prices are fairly arbitrary. in many industries corporations are controlling prices by controlling supply. there's some diamond mines in africa where they just hide away billions of dollars worth of diamonds so as not to flood the market, thus dropping prices. agriculture is like that as well. we have the ability to grow enough food for everyone on the planet, but prices would be so low monsanto might lose money next quarter, so they don't do it. point is prices are, for the most part, arbitrary, or fixed by the sellers, the corporations.
why does knee surgery cost $30,000? part of it is the expertise of the doctor, but $30,000 for a 3 hour surgery seems a bit excessive to me. part of it is equipment.
You know Cuba has 20,000 fully trained doctors operating around the 3rd world? that's more than any country on earth. poor little island cuba has more trained doctors operating outside its borders than some countries have inside. if they can do with so few resources, imagine what could be acccomplished with a resource rich country such as the United States.Commy wrote:why does knee surgery cost $30,000 or whatever it is? why is it so high? its almost an arbitrary figure based somewhat on demand. ideally it would be free.
people do not work for free Commy. medical school is very long and expensive. and only a certain few are capable of being life saving doctors. secondly, built into the cost of care is liability costs of the doctors. they pay almost half their income on insurance to protect themselves against people like you who wold sue them if they made a mistake.
i wou;dn tbe suing anybody. unless he injected my with cyanide or something.
see above.
Cuba has 20,000 trained doctors operating outside their borders, providing care to third world countries, saving countless lives.
and medical school costs are arbitrary. why should education cost ANYTHING? not everyone can do it. only those capable will be enrolling anyway. we could learn a a lot from Cuba. maybe that's why they are still considered a threat, they are an example on how to run a decent society.
in a resource based society, money is taken out of the equation. service is provided based on need. people will be motivated to become doctors because of reasons other than greed, the desire to save lives for one, and they would have a certain elevated status within the community, much like a shaman back in the day, only more modern and a lot cooler. they would be celebrities.
You can pull this off. Find a few hundred like minded people to throw in everything they have (monetarily) and go buy a small island. After you purchase the island and start up your system, you won't need money anyway. From there on out, everyone takes on a different role and works to serve the greater good rather than works for profit.0 -
Hey commy the state I live in has more than 20,000 trained doctors :roll: And your comment about how you think education as far as medical school should be free is hysterical to say the least. so why dont' you go work for free. and see how long the lights stay on at your place.0
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jlew24asu wrote:
I exaggerated my numbers. I made them up. but its of my best educated opinion, that UHC in the US would cost far more then our military budget. Americans expect and demand the highest of care. not taken from the lowest bidder. well "if Cuba can do it" is not a valid argument.
but imagine a Cuban structure on a system with our resources. If htey can do what they are doing under an embargo style state, no trade allowed etc...imagine what the US could do with its nearly endless pool of resources to draw from.so now you have your answer. so again, you want an Anarchy system correct? in your Anarchy system, who will provide and pay for your care?
its a long, long answer.
ideally there would be no money. money is power to some extent. money creates classes, to some extent. you can't have either under anarchy. you need a resource based economy, you need to change the way labor is motivated.....its a fundamental shift. not doing things for personal gain, but doing things because they will benefit the community. its a huge change in society, sounds simple, but its huge, it would eliminate %50 of all crime. gotta get paid? not anymore.
Say you had a family. (i don't know if you do). but i have brothers and a niece and nephew. if i could do something, anything at all to help them, i would, without question. its that mentality, on a much larger scale.but anyway, doctors arent going through years and years of grueling, EXPENSIVE schooling just to "save lives". you need to accept the fact the money is a much bigger motivator.
its is now. but after that shift in motivation, it will become natural. its not lowering the bar, its not giving everyone the shittiest cars and the fake houses-its balancing the bar. its giving everyone buicks or whatever is a little above average and giving everyone a decent house to live in. no more $20,000,000 estates.
when 1 makes $20,000,000, 10,000 people lose.0 -
does your state have those doctors opertating in 3rd world countries? didn't think so.prfctlefts wrote:Hey commy the state I live in has more than 20,000 trained doctors :roll: And your comment about how you think education as far as medical school should be free is hysterical to say the least. so why dont' you go work for free. and see how long the lights stay on at your place.Post edited by Commy on0 -
i would LOVE to see true universal healthcare within my home country within my lifetime. i sincerely hope it happens. as to the cost? i seriously cannot imagine it being any more expensive than helathcare is right now......but having the added benefit of ALL being covered and offered healthcare. THAT would be the ideal in america. i think at times we as a country have gotten so caught up in the 'independent'......the being 'self-sufficient'....that we have lost sight of the communal good of our citizens, and of our country, and of the greater good to be served.Stay with me...
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow0 -
i want to , believe me.VINNY GOOMBA wrote:You can pull this off. Find a few hundred like minded people to throw in everything they have (monetarily) and go buy a small island. After you purchase the island and start up your system, you won't need money anyway. From there on out, everyone takes on a different role and works to serve the greater good rather than works for profit.
you know who else tried this?
The Branch Davidians. Now, granted there was some shady shit going down in that compound, but they did exactly that. It was removed with force, very publicly, and the experiment ended. And I believe that's why they chose to storm the compound, even though they had David Koresh alone in the woods days before the slaughter. They wanted to do a few things, establish the authority of the ATF, and second to eliminate an alternative to capitalism, in a public way. Like they always do. internationally or nationally, any alterntives to capitlaism must be dealt with, preferably with force.0 -
commy, call me when you wake up from your dream world.0
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Hey commy
were you dropped on your head when you were a child repeatedly0 -
Commy wrote:
because everything is so great right now.jlew24asu wrote:commy, call me when you wake up from your dream world.
right.
ah fuck it, I"m just gonna go home, turn on the tv watch the nightly news, drink a beer like i could even change the world yeah right.
They should have never removed that from the song. Or the singing during the breakdown.0 -
you know douchebag, at least I offered a solution.prfctlefts wrote:Hey commy
were you dropped on your head when you were a child repeatedly
I"m not sure what you're doing.0 -
yeah, that was my favorite line in that song. i agree.VINNY GOOMBA wrote:Commy wrote:
because everything is so great right now.jlew24asu wrote:commy, call me when you wake up from your dream world.
right.
ah fuck it, I"m just gonna go home, turn on the tv watch the nightly news, drink a beer like i could even change the world yeah right.
They should have never removed that from the song. Or the singing during the breakdown.0 -
Commy wrote:
does your state have those doctors opertating in 3rd world countries? didn't think so.prfctlefts wrote:Hey commy the state I live in has more than 20,000 trained doctors :roll: And your comment about how you think education as far as medical school should be free is hysterical to say the least. so why dont' you go work for free. and see how long the lights stay on at your place.
Um as a matter of fact yes. We have one of the best medical Universities in ther country. MUSC. and some intern all over the world.0 -
Commy wrote:
you know douchebag, at least I offered a solution.prfctlefts wrote:Hey commy
were you dropped on your head when you were a child repeatedly
I"m not sure what you're doing.
cmon on man lighten up
I'll give you that but I still thing your borderline lunacy 0 -
Commy wrote:
i want to , believe me.VINNY GOOMBA wrote:You can pull this off. Find a few hundred like minded people to throw in everything they have (monetarily) and go buy a small island. After you purchase the island and start up your system, you won't need money anyway. From there on out, everyone takes on a different role and works to serve the greater good rather than works for profit.
you know who else tried this?
The Branch Davidians. Now, granted there was some shady shit going down in that compound, but they did exactly that. It was removed with force, very publicly, and the experiment ended. And I believe that's why they chose to storm the compound, even though they had David Koresh alone in the woods days before the slaughter. They wanted to do a few things, establish the authority of the ATF, and second to eliminate an alternative to capitalism, in a public way. Like they always do. internationally or nationally, any alterntives to capitlaism must be dealt with, preferably with force.
See, that's why you have to ante up big time and get an island, get yourselves some isolation.
Only thing is, what happens when someone becomes corrupt on this island, and tries to profit off of his or her role there (because let's face it, we're not perfect)? Who has the authority to send them packing in a society of anarchy?0 -
VINNY GOOMBA wrote:
See, that's why you have to ante up big time and get an island, get yourselves some isolation.
Only thing is, what happens when someone becomes corrupt on this island, and tries to profit off of his or her role there (because let's face it, we're not perfect)? Who has the authority to send them packing in a society of anarchy?
would be nice.
resources are controlled by the people, equally. so if a doctor or someone steps up and says,
"I won't provide my service unless you make me king",
the rest of us can step up and say,
"you don't eat until you provide your service".
inherent checks and balances.0 -
Commy wrote:
because everything is so great right now.jlew24asu wrote:commy, call me when you wake up from your dream world.
right.
ah fuck it, I"m just gonna go home, turn on the tv watch the nightly news, drink a beer like i could even change the world yeah right.
I respect your opinion but you aren't providing any realistic solutions. you are talking about living in a world with no money. a world where people will study for years at their own expense and be at your beckon call when you get sick just because we all love each other as family.
the system could use some work, no doubt. but like I said, come talk to me when you wake up form your dream world.
btw, whats your solution to world hunger? o I got it. you learn how to farm, I'll learn how to process food, and we'll pass it out to everyone who needs it. see, I can provide solutions too.0 -
prfctlefts wrote:Commy wrote:
you know douchebag, at least I offered a solution.prfctlefts wrote:Hey commy
were you dropped on your head when you were a child repeatedly
I"m not sure what you're doing.
cmon on man lighten up I'll give you that but I still thing your borderline lunacy
Why is it borderline lunacy? It's really not as far fetched as people think it is. It's just too many people have bought into a historical power shifting system.
Using monetary value as the backbone of an argument shows a lack of imagination for creating a solution. Sure we live in a monetary society that creates classes and power change. But people act as if we gathered up all the currency in the world right now and put it in a rocket and shot it to outer space leaving no money left on Earth that all of a sudden all power goes out, everyone is evicted from their homes, doctors will quit helping people and everyone loses their jobs.
I'd like to think as humans, as we like to call ourselves, that we have enough decency to do what we know best and use that service to help everyone as a whole. And that power plant operators will continue to go in and continue the running power to the hospitals, farmers will keep growing, doctors will keep helping, that's just the simple breakdown of it. Obviously it's a very long winded answer to actually sit down and articulate a complete plan to keep a society afloat.
It's sad that we've come to rely on money as an ignition source rather than doing what's best for us as a whole and just doing it because we can. Including giving someone the health they deserve.0 -
first of all people need to get the fuck out of the desert. why they choose to live in some of these places is beyond me.,jlew24asu wrote:
btw, whats your solution to world hunger? o I got it. you learn how to farm, I'll learn how to process food, and we'll pass it out to everyone who needs it. see, I can provide solutions too.
but we could ship a few thousand combines and tractors on over to africa, or better yet, help them build an infrastructure capable of producing this equipment, which would enable them to grow their own food.0
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