Documentary: The Obama Deception -- AWESOME!

SolarWorld wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

as for the last paragraph...what did the govt do to step in and stop the system from imploding last October? Most people that follow this line of thought think that the 'masters of the universe' are the bankers.....why exactly would the bankers step in and stop the govt from giving them trillions of dollars? It's not like they can say, 'oops, DOW is down 400 pts, you guys want a new currency?' It won't happen overnight, might as well get paid in the meantime. You are doing what you accuse theorists of - oversimplifying.

I find it laughable that you are telling me to educate myself and you know nothing of the electronic run that happened, the trillions that were being pulled out on the day the market crashed. The fact that you have no idea what happened on THAT day further proves my point about Alex Jones followers.

OutOfBreath wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

Conspiracy: a secret plan or agreement between two or more people to commit an illegal or subversive act.
The fact that it is illegal for many of the members to be there means that yes, the fact that they meet IS a conspiracy in itself, by definition.

How is it illegal for anyone to attend? By what laws of what country? And, no actually, that does not constitute much of a conspiracy in itself.

Can you clarify your definition of ‘reigning hegemonical ideas’? Sounds like conspiracy to me…

Well, for instance, we have had for a long time the idea that markets work best when there is no regulation, and that markets always by definition are more efficient than public systems. It's in a bit of trouble these days. What I mean is widely held beliefs and ideas in the population or within certain professions/parts of society that shapes the said society. That's not a conspiracy unless you will label every political party or activist organization as conspiracies too.

Who's implying a single will? My guess would be that the bolded part above is EXACTLY what is goin on...setting policies, reviewing behaviour patterns etc, and discussing the next steps in continuing the hegemony they enjoy... Do any of you 'conspiracy' detractors honestly think that we are so naive as to believe that David Rockefeller takes a pulpit with a powerpoint presentation on how to dominate the world, then hands out homework? This is akin to the belief of conspiracy theorists (implied by detractors) that, for 9/11 to be an inside job, they would have needed a thousand people huddled around a black board taking notes on the whole plan...I don't see anyone implying that it's so black and white…

You just implied single will in what you wrote here. In that you assume they are working together towards the common goal, and that the gathering is there to do that. When I say behavioural patterns, I am NOT talking about "planning patterns" or anything like it. I'm talking of using what we know from social psychology, sociology and organizational studies and applying it to the meeting.

It's no different than any other industry – when industry heads and insiders meet to discuss business, THEY benefit...and most everyone involved in the industry that does NOT meet gets fucked over by the decisions made at the meeting (collusion).

They CAN, of course, if there are few actors that know eachother well and see eye to eye on everything. Also remember that for industries, they are not all in on it together in that setting. They are also competitors. They CAN form monopolies and cartels certainly. Bu the larger the group, the less potent it becomes. Look at OPEC, a real cartel. Even they struggle to act uniformly unless really forced to by conditions, since some of them can weasel out of cutting as much as they should, selling more and benefitting for instance.

I find this cartellization much less likely among a diverse crowd from all walks of politics and business.

If the meetings involve the heads of finance, politics, military, intelligence and other industries that have massive impacts on the public....Why make excuses for them? I don’t’ think it’s a reach to assume that since we (public or media) are not there, we are getting fucked over by the decisions made…They are overstepping their authority, and in many cases committing an illegal act just by attending.

The media cant be everywhere, nor would it be right for them to be. "You aren't there" in congress either, and much of what goes on never gets your attention (even if it actually is recorded). That's not necesarily a problem. Besides, for anything that they "decide" there to go through, they all have to go home and get it through the parliament or congress, and thus be subject to scrutinization if needed.

And, no, I dont think it is right to assume that they are "fucking us" (nevermind the problem who "us" would be in this context, anyway) just because it isn't televised. The flipside is that just because it's televised, doesn't mean you arent being fucked over either. And it is really up to individual perspective what "fucking us over" really entails.

The rich and wealthy have power and influence. Always have, always will. To do something means to take political actions to make real changes. Not worry about just who of them attended what meeting. You dont need a conspiratorial worldview to acknowledge privilege, wealth and power as problems for those not posessing the aforementioned. That they are problematic doesnt mean there's conspiracies behind. For instance, many seems to favour minimal public sector and redistribution through taxes. The flipside is that it provides more power to the privileged and wealthy, since when there's nothing else to stop it, money rules. Those having the most, decides the most. That's one example of something that's not really a conspiracy.

There are conspiracies, certainly, but the grand unifed one seems highly unlikely.

Peace
Dan

Drowned Out wrote:

SolarWorld wrote:

You told me to "get some facts". I'm not here to debate you. I'm not insulting you, get off your highly defensive horse. Watch the Frontline link I posted. If the "whoever is going to take us over" REALLY was going to do such a thing, last October would have been the time to do it.

I never told you to get facts. I asked you to tell me which facts you disagreed with in the film. How is that telling you to educate yourself? :roll:

My point about last October, regarless of my naivety regarding whateverthefuck you're talking about, is that these people don't need an opportunity to take over the world, they already run it. Why would they push thru currency change or whatever you're suggesting when they're the ones profiting from all the chaos already?

I can't watch video at work, but I'll check out your Rockefeller-funded op-ed later tonight....but probably won't reply to the thread, lest I be ignored

SolarWorld wrote:

Drowned Out wrote:

SolarWorld wrote:

You told me to "get some facts". I'm not here to debate you. I'm not insulting you, get off your highly defensive horse. Watch the Frontline link I posted. If the "whoever is going to take us over" REALLY was going to do such a thing, last October would have been the time to do it.

I never told you to get facts. I asked you to tell me which facts you disagreed with in the film. How is that telling you to educate yourself? :roll:

My point about last October, regarless of my naivety regarding whateverthefuck you're talking about, is that these people don't need an opportunity to take over the world, they already run it. Why would they push thru currency change or whatever you're suggesting when they're the ones profiting from all the chaos already?

I can't watch video at work, but I'll check out your Rockefeller-funded op-ed later tonight....but probably won't reply to the thread, lest I be ignored

You know, don't watch the video. If you think PBS is part of some Rockefeller conspiracy then your mind has already been warped. Again if you have no knowledge whatsoever of the trillions being pulled out of the market last October you don't have a basic understanding of the banking "bailout". Unplug from Mr. Jones for a moment.

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Yeah,
my buddy & roomate made the mistake of watching this with me.
he doesn't really understand the deeper level of politics and lives in the fantasy where Obama is our shining knight come to save us.

Needless to say this movie both left him with his mouth broken at times, and then alternately left him spewing things like, "this is such crap. i can't believe you fall for this propaganda half-truth crap. This is all half truths."

The problem was, everytime he was saying, "this is all half truths", the movie was spouting off mainstream FACTS about how big of a crock of shit this administration is -- nothing misleading about it, just the truth ... truth HE DIDN'T WANT TO HEAR.

So, DO YOU?

The Obama Deception [google video]
url=http://www.mininova.org/tor/2368134]torrent at mininova[/url

callen wrote:

pjalive21 wrote:

haha...i think its time to say I TOLD YOU SO... i think it was what? me and 3 other people on this forum telling everyone about Mr. Teleprompter but yet everyone crowned this fool, the next coming

he is going to have the worst 100 days in presidential history and of course everyone will blame Bush

Fool???? After a whole three months...ha ha ha....and you'd rather have McCain/Palin